# New Study: Liberal Atheists = Smartest People **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 25, 2010, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354 "2010-02-25T03:04:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dostoyevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Dostoyevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dostoyevsky)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/1 "2010-02-25T03:04:46Z")
My favorite [blog](http://reason.com/blog/2010/02/24/why-liberals-and-atheists-are) links to a new study from a London School of Economics professor. As the title of the study suggests [“Why Liberals and Atheists Are More Intelligent”](http://spq.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/0190272510361602v1) this is a heavily opinionated research piece and I (the unscientific layman) would like someone with knowledge of science to validate/invalidate its findings. Please. Many thanks, A Politically Centrist Religious Pantheist ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/2 "2010-02-25T03:15:25Z")
I don’t think it’s any surprise that the more intelligent people are the more skeptical they’re likely to be, and the more critical in their thinking – also the more iconoclastic, and the more complex in their ethical thinking. The less intelligent thy are, the more likely they are to stay entrenched in tribalism, religionism and simplistic ethical thinking. I saw a new study a few days ago that also showed a correlation between religion and racism. the more religious someone is, the more racist they are likely to be. I’ve always liked the observation by John Stuart Mill that not all conservatives are stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/3 "2010-02-25T03:18:39Z")
This doesn’t prove anything. Once eugenics, communism, and fascism were all " waves of the future" and widely accepted by the intellectual elites. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/4 "2010-02-25T03:19:25Z")
[Link to article about religion/racism study](http://uscnews.usc.edu/university/study_links_religion_and_racism.html) ---
**Author:** ![Dostoyevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Dostoyevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dostoyevsky)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/5 "2010-02-25T03:20:57Z")
Not sure if this is related to the OP, but does anyone know of a study that says Religious Conservatives are more intelligent? ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/6 "2010-02-25T03:21:10Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I don’t think it’s any surprise that the more intelligent people are the more skeptical they’re likely to be, and the more critical in their thinking – also the more iconoclastic, and the more complex in their ethical thinking. > > The less intelligent thy are, the more likely they are to stay entrenched in tribalism, religionism and simplistic ethical thinking. > > I saw a new study a few days ago that also showed a correlation between religion and racism. the more religious someone is, the more racist they are likely to be. > > I’ve always liked the observation by John Stuart Mill that not all conservatives are stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives. Mill would be with his advocacy of free-market capitalism a libertarian today. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/7 "2010-02-25T03:21:36Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > This doesn’t prove anything. Once eugenics, communism, and fascism were all " > waves of the future" and widely accepted by the intellectual elites. This is not true of eugenics or fascism (somewhat true of Marxist idealism, but Soviet style Socialist totalitarianism wasn’t really Marxism), and not relevant in any case. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/8 "2010-02-25T03:23:12Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > This is not true of eugenics or fascism (somewhat true of Marxist idealism, but Soviet style Socialist totalitarianism wasn’t really Marxism), and not relevant in any case. Eugenics were widely accepted back in the early Twentieth Century. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/9 "2010-02-25T03:23:39Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Mill would be with his advocacy of free-market capitalism a libertarian today. American political liberals are also believers in free-market capitalism. That’s pretty much universal across the entire mainstream political spectrum in the US. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/10 "2010-02-25T03:24:40Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Eugenics were widely accepted back in the early Twentieth Century. No they weren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Dostoyevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Dostoyevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dostoyevsky)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/11 "2010-02-25T03:25:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > American political liberals are also believers in free-market capitalism. True. It’s easy to define “atheist” but “liberal” is more of a stretch to peg with precise criteria, and that raises questions about the study. Today’s liberalism is tomorrow’s conservatism. ETA: maybe if I was more liberal I’d understand the study better! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/12 "2010-02-25T03:38:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No they weren’t. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics) > [@](#): > > United States > > One of the earliest modern advocates of eugenics (before it was labeled as such) was Alexander Graham Bell. In 1881 Bell investigated the rate of deafness on Martha’s Vineyard, Massachusetts. From this he concluded that deafness was hereditary in nature and, through noting that congenitally deaf parents were more likely to produce deaf children, tentatively suggested that couples where both were deaf should not marry, in his lecture Memoir upon the formation of a deaf variety of the human race presented to the National Academy of Sciences on 13 November 1883.[54] However, it was his hobby of livestock breeding which led to his appointment to biologist David Starr Jordan’s Committee on Eugenics, under the auspices of the American Breeders Association. The committee unequivocally extended the principle to man.[55] > > During the 20th century, researchers interested in familial mental disorders conducted a number of studies to document the heritability of such illnesses as schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and depression. Their findings were used by the eugenics movement as proof for its cause. State laws were written in the late 1800s and early 1900s to prohibit marriage and force sterilization of the mentally ill in order to prevent the “passing on” of mental illness to the next generation. These laws were upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court in 1927 and were not abolished until the mid-20th century. All in all, 60,000 Americans were sterilized.[56] > > […] > > **In the USA, eugenic supporters included Theodore Roosevelt[citation needed] , pre-1960’s Democratic Party[citation needed], the National Academy of Sciences[citation needed], the American Medical Association[citation needed] and the National Research Council[citation needed]. Research was funded by distinguished philanthropies and carried out at prestigious universities.[citation needed] It was taught in college and high school classrooms.[citation needed] Margaret Sanger founded Planned Parenthood of America to urge the legalization of contraception for the lower classes.[citation needed] In its time eugenics was touted by some as scientific and progressive[citation needed], the natural application of knowledge about breeding to the arena of human life. Before the realization of death camps in World War II, the idea that eugenics would lead to genocide was not taken seriously by the average American.** Sounds pretty widespread. ---
**Author:** ![Dostoyevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Dostoyevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dostoyevsky)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/13 "2010-02-25T03:41:46Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Sounds pretty widespread. Um, the part you bolded contains nothing but statements without cites: > [@](#): > > \*\*In the USA, eugenic supporters included Theodore Roosevelt[citation needed] , pre-1960’s Democratic Party[citation needed], the National Academy of Sciences[citation needed], the American Medical Association[citation needed] and the National Research Council[citation needed]. Research was funded by distinguished philanthropies and carried out at prestigious universities.[citation needed] It was taught in college and high school classrooms.[citation needed] Margaret Sanger founded Planned Parenthood of America to urge the legalization of contraception for the lower classes.[citation needed] In its time eugenics was touted by some as scientific and progressive[citation needed], the natural application of knowledge about breeding to the arena of human life. Before the realization of death camps in World War II, the idea that eugenics would lead to genocide was not taken seriously by the average American. \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/14 "2010-02-25T03:47:55Z")
**Curtis LeMay** , when you quote from an article, please use just enough to prove your point and link to the rest. I shortened your Wikipedia quote. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/15 "2010-02-25T03:48:34Z")
> [@Dostoyevsky](#): > > Um, the part you bolded contains nothing but statements without cites: > > \*\* Still does not remove the fact that several states passed sterlization laws (which are cited). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/16 "2010-02-25T03:54:02Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics) > Sounds pretty widespread. Only one of those sources in that article is cited. Eugenics was not widely accepted among intellectuals, at least not as anything other than a theoretical proposition, This whole angle is an evasion from the topic, though. The more intelligent people are, the less religious they tend to be. Does that prove there aren’t any gods? Of course not. It just means they tend to be more critical in their thinking and less likely to accept what they’re told just because they’re told it. There are exceptions, obviously. Some of the most brilliant individuals have been theists. Newton, for example. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/17 "2010-02-25T03:56:13Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Still does not remove the fact that several states passed sterlization laws (which are cited). Those laws were not written by academics and intellectuals, but by pandering politicians. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/18 "2010-02-25T03:58:41Z")
> [@Dostoyevsky](#): > > My favorite [blog](http://reason.com/blog/2010/02/24/why-liberals-and-atheists-are) links to a new study from a London School of Economics professor. As the title of the study suggests [“Why Liberals and Atheists Are More Intelligent”](http://spq.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/0190272510361602v1) this is a heavily opinionated research piece and I (the unscientific layman) would like someone with knowledge of science to validate/invalidate its findings. Please. > > Many thanks, > A Politically Centrist Religious Pantheist All I see at the link is the abstract. Is there a link to the whole article? If so, I hope it would be a bit more lay-accessible; the abstract is full of specialized jargon. E.g., what exactly do “evolutionarily novel” and “evolutionarily familiar” mean – do they have anything to do with biological evolution, or are the psychological terms of art completely unconnected with that? ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/19 "2010-02-25T04:07:02Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > This doesn’t prove anything. Once eugenics, communism, and fascism were all “waves of the future” and widely accepted by the intellectual elites. I don’t understand how this is supposed to disprove the article in the OP. Were the intellectual elites who supported eugenics and fascism liberals? Communism was misguided, but the people who consider themselves to be liberals today don’t support communism. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354/20 "2010-02-25T04:09:20Z")
> [@Lakai](#): > > I don’t understand how this is supposed to disprove the article in the OP. Were the intellectual elites who supported eugenics and fascism liberals? > > Communism was misguided, but the people who consider themselves to be liberals today don’t support communism. As to eugenics most of it’s supporters were “progressive” reformers. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-study-liberal-atheists-smartest-people/530354.md?page=2)