# New, very basic cars **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 24, 2013, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380 "2013-07-24T14:53:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2018, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/142 "2018-05-15T01:16:06Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > On stock tires? Yes, stock everything. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2018, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/144 "2018-05-15T17:04:54Z")
> [@anomalous1](#): > > Want a really basic car that is easy to repair, has a good power to weight ratio, small, easy to upgrade and can give domestic muscle cars a run for their money? Get a Chevy Cavalier Z24 (1st or third generation). Heavy in the front, light in the back and can slide/drift easily. 26MPG Hwy. > > Yes, I said a **Cavalier**. So many people talk crap about them without driving them. Try driving one with a turbo and you’ll shit your pants. It’s a nice combination of things, fast but not too fast, great acceleration, sounds great, has a fantastic and reliable transmission. Here’s a regular 2003 Chevy Cavalier versus a regular 2003 Ford Mustang. > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtJrLsPY6g0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtJrLsPY6g0) > > Impressive little cars. I’ve driven lots. They were (most) of the training vehicles in my high school driver’s ed program. They were shitty. If you shit your pants in one, it’s because they handle poorly. You can make anything fast by slapping a big enough turbo on it. That doesn’t make it good. [Here’s](https://newatlas.com/toyota-land-cruiser-230-mph/49395/) a 230 mph Toyota Land Cruiser. ---
**Author:** ![anomalous1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@anomalous1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anomalous1)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2018, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/145 "2018-05-15T20:21:36Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I’ve driven lots. They were (most) of the training vehicles in my high school driver’s ed program. They were shitty. If you shit your pants in one, it’s because they handle poorly. > > You can make anything fast by slapping a big enough turbo on it. That doesn’t make it good. [Here’s](https://newatlas.com/toyota-land-cruiser-230-mph/49395/) a 230 mph Toyota Land Cruiser. You must’ve been driving some heaps/sedans. My point is that for such a small, quaint vehicle they can be very impressive, even without a turbo. The vehicles you drove must have been poorly maintained or had soft ride suspension and not ride and handling suspension (FE2). The handling is phenomenal. You can’t confuse actually feeling the difference in handling to not being able to feel any difference between makes and models in current cars. To each their own I guess, you don’t see the capability of these vehicles and I don’t see anything exciting about a drive-by-wire coffee-getter that looks exactly like every other SUV on the road. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/146 "2018-05-16T15:01:18Z")
The most potent factory Z24 had 150 horsepower and did 0-60 in 7.6 seconds. That’s not slow, but it’s not going to make anyone “shit their pants” unless the next fastest thing they’ve driven is a golf cart. The dealer-option supercharger takes it to 190-something. Still not close to pants-shitting territory. The Z24 had the same solid rear axle as other Cavaliers, and would have handled just as poorly. ---
**Author:** ![anomalous1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@anomalous1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anomalous1)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/147 "2018-05-16T21:23:14Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The most potent factory Z24 had 150 horsepower and did 0-60 in 7.6 seconds. That’s not slow, but it’s not going to make anyone “shit their pants” unless the next fastest thing they’ve driven is a golf cart. The dealer-option supercharger takes it to 190-something. Still not close to pants-shitting territory. > > The Z24 had the same solid rear axle as other Cavaliers, and would have handled just as poorly. Dealer-Option…:rolleyes: I implore you to check out the video links i’ve posted above… that is what I am referring to as “pants shitting”. It’s not being in the seat, its the surprise, its that the car has an easy capability of overtaking something someone paid 80K for. That is the point. For a cheap and reliable budget car it can perform really well. You don’t get that surprise with many, with or without a turbo or supercharger. I know they are not the fastest car, but the ability to compete is what is shocking. Seriously, if you haven’t seen them, check the video links. That is what is jaw dropping. Its really comparing the WHP-HP, Torque and Weight of the vehicles that makes it impressive. A Cavalier weighing a 1000LBS less than others with a 100HP more, easily compensates. As for the solid rear axle, I can’t dispute that but it all depends on how the front end is set up to compensate. Surely there are better cars and ways to have better handling with the rear but knowing how to drift removes that problem. To each their own, though. ---
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380/148 "2018-05-17T01:54:12Z")
> [@anomalous1](#): > > Dealer-Option…:rolleyes: > I implore you to check out the video links i’ve posted above… that is what I am referring to as “pants shitting”. It’s not being in the seat, its the surprise, its that the car has an easy capability of overtaking something someone paid 80K for. That is the point. For a cheap and reliable budget car it can perform really well. You don’t get that surprise with many, with or without a turbo or supercharger. I know they are not the fastest car, but the ability to compete is what is shocking. Seriously, if you haven’t seen them, check the video links. That is what is jaw dropping. Its really comparing the WHP-HP, Torque and Weight of the vehicles that makes it impressive. A Cavalier weighing a 1000LBS less than others with a 100HP more, easily compensates. > > As for the solid rear axle, I can’t dispute that but it all depends on how the front end is set up to compensate. Surely there are better cars and ways to have better handling with the rear but knowing how to drift removes that problem. > > To each their own, though. That video doesn’t tell you anything about how Cavaliers perform, because that Cavalier is modified. It’s speed at the end of the 1/4 mile is 109 mph, indicating over 300 hp. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-very-basic-cars/664380.md?page=7)