# New York Times hires unapologetic racist writer **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 4, 2018, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086 "2018-08-04T10:58:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 54
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1061 "2018-09-13T23:04:49Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > No cite there, so I’ll respond with my own cite-free data (I’ve started a thread about it, I think, and I’ll cite when I’m able) – police shoot 21 times as many young black men as young white men despite young black men only having about ~6-8 times the murder rate. Further, 50% of black people report being mistreated personally by law enforcement. That’s more than enough data to provide legitimate reasons for distrust of law enforcement. I will assume your numbers are accurate for the sake of discussion (and I don’t have any real reason to doubt them). But if this logic is fair, wouldn’t it also be fair for a white person to be more leery of getting on a bus filled with black people than a black person should be to get on one filled with whites? Since actuarily speaking, we’ve established that a randomly selected black person is roughly 11 times more likely to murder a white person than a randomly selected white person is to kill a black person. (A dispute over this is what led EE to issue his only mea culpa to date that I know of—the fact that it’s the one he cited in response to Damuri challenging him on whether he had ever admitted error suggests that it is indeed likely to be sui generis.) Unless you want to just dismiss FBI statistics as someone did upthread (or maybe in another Pit thread), in which case your statistics are also moot. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I’ve been called racist and I haven’t shut up. If anyone’s been “shut up”, it’s because they shut themselves up. This is almost entirely nonsense. It’s just an excuse to whine about criticism. Hell, you’ve been called racist and you haven’t shut up. Do you have a single example of someone being shut up? We’re in the Pit, for chrissakes. This is a very self-selected group of contentious, even tendentious, folks. And it’s anonymous. Had James Damore or Jonathan Friedlund made their comments here, they would presumably still have their jobs unless someone doxxed them. But even aside from life-altering penalties like that, many people (my wife is one of them) just don’t like getting any kind of harsh accusation hurled at them, and will bend over backward to avoid this. I would say this is the majority of people. And you’ve been called racist? Really? As in, the kind of racist that carries a serious stigma among the progressive crowd you hang out with? Or is it just being called a reverse racist by your political enemies, that if anything gives you street cred among your allies? > [@Slash1972](#): > > Great, that’s two votes so far! I’ll add mine, that’s three! > > Stay off of Twitter, lest someone being mean to white people makes you change your mind. I won’t change my mind. But like a lot of ideological purists on both ends of the spectrum, you don’t understand the importance of having pawns. You just want to righteously swing your king all over the board, unprotected, instead of keeping it protected by a wall of pawns. Those pawns aren’t true believers, so screw them! You only want the good people on your team. Anyone who would even consider voting for Trump is not a good person (and note that I don’t disagree!), so they can just bugger off. But as Adlai Stevenson famously (or maybe apocryphally) recognized, you need more than right-thinking folks on your side. You also need some wishy-washy dummies with questionable morals. If you tell those wishy-washy dummies to go hang, they will vote for the other side and you (we) will lose. Should we throw away all our principles to attract those pawns? No. But I fail to see how standing firm for the principle of “don’t drag someone for characteristics they were born with and cannot change” is compromising any important principle at all. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Bullshit. Moderate white people are not being shut up in any way at all. Limbaugh and Hannity have said for years that accusations of racism are enough to shut someone down… and it’s complete bullshit. They’ve said many racist things and they’ve never been shut down. Trump, obviously, has not been shut down. Neither has Steve King or the many other Republicans in office who have said racist things. There are so many examples of prominent people who have said racist things and not been shut down at all that it’s ridiculous that those same people still spread this nonsense. And even more ridiculous that some folks like you believe it. It’s laughable bullshit. This really might be the crux of the issue. It’s important enough that I have to lament that it’s sort of buried in a longer reply. But please “listen” to me on this. You’re absolutely right that it’s not an accusation that shuts people down if they are over on the hard right or especially “alt-right”. If anything, it just gets them charged up and riled up, and provides something for them to bond over with their fellow righties. But that is not the point! In fact, THIS IS PRECISELY THE PROBLEM. Again, let’s think about straight white teenage boys who are figuring out if they want to be Bernie Bros or Jordan Peterson followers or Breitbartians (or something else, but those three cover a lot of ground). Maybe they notice the multicultural “cool kids” at school are pretty hardcore “woke”, so they make some social inquiries, put out some feelers, to see if they can make it into that crowd. As straight white males, they have to “audition” more than others who don’t fit that description, or could be said to be on “probation” (if you want to dispute this, I’m just going to laugh). If they then voice any skepticism about BLM, about deplatforming or other suppression of free speech, or comment negatively on someone like Jeong, they are very likely to be called a racist and that will “shut them down”. (It is true at older ages, too: you really think I speak freely at DFL meetings?) Either they will walk it back, curry favor, and maybe get back into the crowd’s good graces, or they will say “fuck this” and go over to the right, where they will be embraced. I would like for the left not to force this choice, which will quite often push them over to the other side and pointlessly lose us votes. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1062 "2018-09-13T23:16:09Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I will assume your numbers are accurate for the sake of discussion (and I don’t have any real reason to doubt them). But if this logic is fair, wouldn’t it also be fair for a white person to be more leery of getting on a bus filled with black people than a black person should be to get on one filled with whites? Since actuarily speaking, we’ve established that a randomly selected black person is roughly 11 times more likely to murder a white person than a randomly selected white person is to kill a black person. (A dispute over this is what led EE to issue his only mea culpa to date that I know of—the fact that it’s the one he cited in response to Damuri challenging him on whether he had ever admitted error suggests that it is indeed likely to be sui generis.) Unless you want to just dismiss FBI statistics as someone did upthread (or maybe in another Pit thread), in which case your statistics are also moot. Which buses white people feel comfortable getting on really doesn’t matter. If someone wants to wait for the next bus, who cares, as long as they aren’t hurting anyone? If they want to spout off online or in public about how black people are dangerous and that’s why they don’t want to ride the bus, then that’s well worth criticizing, but no one cares if someone decides to wait for the next bus. But those statistics can be spun in many different ways. It’s a fact that an individual black person is far, far more likely to be killed by a white person than an individual white person is to be killed by a black person. By this measure, a random black person has far more legitimate reason to be afraid of white people than the reverse. Mostly because there are so many more white people than black people in the US. Which doesn’t invalidate this fact in any way at all. > [@](#): > > We’re in the Pit, for chrissakes. This is a very self-selected group of contentious, even tendentious, folks. And it’s anonymous. Had James Damore or Jonathan Friedlund made their comments here, they would presumably still have their jobs unless someone doxxed them. > > But even aside from life-altering penalties like that, many people (my wife is one of them) just don’t like getting any kind of harsh accusation hurled at them, and will bend over backward to avoid this. I would say this is the majority of people. > > And you’ve been called racist? Really? As in, the kind of racist that carries a serious stigma among the progressive crowd you hang out with? Or is it just being called a reverse racist by your political enemies, that if anything gives you street cred among your allies? Why would it matter who called me racist or why? If someone calls me racist I stop and think and look at what I’ve said or posted. It’s very possible I still have some unconscious biases, and I want to root them out. > [@](#): > > This really might be the crux of the issue. It’s important enough that I have to lament that it’s sort of buried in a longer reply. But please “listen” to me on this. > > You’re absolutely right that it’s not an accusation that shuts people down if they are over on the hard right or especially “alt-right”. If anything, it just gets them charged up and riled up, and provides something for them to bond over with their fellow righties. > > But that is not the point! In fact, THIS IS PRECISELY THE PROBLEM. Again, let’s think about straight white teenage boys who are figuring out if they want to be Bernie Bros or Jordan Peterson followers or Breitbartians (or something else, but those three cover a lot of ground). Maybe they notice the multicultural “cool kids” at school are pretty hardcore “woke”, so they make some social inquiries, put out some feelers, to see if they can make it into that crowd. As straight white males, they have to “audition” more than others who don’t fit that description, or could be said to be on “probation” (if you want to dispute this, I’m just going to laugh). > > If they then voice any skepticism about BLM, about deplatforming or other suppression of free speech, or comment negatively on someone like Jeong, they are very likely to be called a racist and that will “shut them down”. (It is true at older ages, too: you really think I speak freely at DFL meetings?) Either they will walk it back, curry favor, and maybe get back into the crowd’s good graces, or they will say “fuck this” and go over to the right, where they will be embraced. I would like for the left not to force this choice, which will quite often push them over to the other side and pointlessly lose us votes. People should be afraid that they might say something racist, when it comes to fraught topics. That’s a good sort of public “feeling” in a society that’s so strongly influenced by white supremacism. And it’s a great thing that you don’t feel comfortable spouting your white supremacist pseudo-science at DFL gatherings. That shows that you have some recognition of the shittiness of your ideas, even if it isn’t enough to get you to change them. But no one gets “shut down”. Getting criticized isn’t being shut down. Criticism is a great thing. If some folks are afraid of criticism, that’s their problem, and their loss. Criticism is one of the keys to growing as a person. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1063 "2018-09-13T23:35:43Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > A dispute over this is what led EE to issue his only mea culpa to date that I know of—the fact that it’s the one he cited in response to Damuri challenging him on whether he had ever admitted error suggests that it is indeed likely to be sui generis. I’ve admitted error every time I’ve made one, which has been multiple times on this board. I linked to that one because some stupid douchebag, who thinks it’s a weakness to admit error, already linked to it in this thread, so it was easy to find. Here, I’ll frame it as a bet for you: If I can link to another post where I admit error will you admit that you are a fucking idiot? P.S., now it’s your turn to link to a post where you admit error, tough guy. Also, the post where I give the data is here: > [@](#): > > It took me less than 3 minutes to actually go check the data, do a little math, and conclude that this was utterly wrong. > > I guess my question for you is why you didn’t take 3 minutes to check if this was true before posting it. > > For those who care, here’s the data: > > Whites killed by blacks, 2016: 533 > Blacks killed by whites, 2016: 243 > White population of United States, 2010: 196,817,552 > Black population of United States, 2010: 37,685,848 > > So, percentage of white people who were killed by a black person in 2016: 0.0003% > percentage of black people who were killed by a white person in 2016: 0.0006% > > So, the chance of a black person being killed by a white person is nearly twice as high as the opposite. That’s an enormous error for SlackerInc to make. > > And again, let me remind everyone, this post took longer to write than it took to do the math. Why the fuck didn’t SlackerInc do it? Notice how small those numbers are? If you’re worried to take a bus because of a 533/196,817,552% chance of being killed by a black person, then your risk assessment is off. (probably because, like **SlackerInc** , you’re stupid. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1064 "2018-09-14T00:17:10Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > You’re still talking about me, huh? Rewriting history again, eh? I know you’re bad at math, but maybe you can try to comprehend this one: [number of times you come at me] \> [number of times I sigh and wearily respond] MUCH greater. Remember how you kept bouncing around like you were on crack, insisting I respond to you and back up my claim that you are innumerate? I tried to avoid it, saying you needed to find someone else to vouch for you actually being right, or I didn’t want to bother with you after all your ridiculousness in the past (“arrogant, verbose and wrong”). Post 942 was my finally giving in to all your taunts and spelling out how badly you shit the bed, in meticulous detail. So now you’re trying to turn it around and call me the obsessive one? Pfffffft. > [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Anyway, my post 944 detailed the multiple lies you made in your post 942, so you can stop saying “not a single person has demonstrated any error …” now, because I did exactly that. Hah, nope. It’s…interesting how when you mentioned other post numbers, you included links. Not with those, though! I’ll link to them so anyone with a brain they didn’t get off the Brains R Us clearance rack can see what nonsense you’re peddling: 942: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202412&postcount=942](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202412&postcount=942) 944: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202492&postcount=944](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202492&postcount=944) My rebuttal to 944 in 947: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202535&postcount=947](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202535&postcount=947) And your response to 947 in 948: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202542&postcount=948](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202542&postcount=948) If anyone thinks you got the better of me in that exchange, I don’t know how I can help them. I strongly believe otherwise, am willing to link to the posts including your responses, and I stand by them. That’s it. This is why I keep just linking to these posts, because I’m not terribly interested in going ‘round and ‘round with you afresh—so it’s ironic, again, that you are insisting I’m the obsessive. [quote=“Evil\_Economist, post:1060, topic:819086”] Also, it’s weird that someone like you would have such an obsessive focus on errors, meanwhile you make huge, enormous, incredibly stupid mistakes. Like the one I detail in post [948](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202542&postcount=948). Oh wait, you did link to 948, as though that’s a post to be proud of. 😕 No, you don’t “detail” any mistake there. You loudly proclaim there is one, but you don’t actually identify a real error. [quote=“Evil\_Economist, post:1060, topic:819086”] Or your mistake that started this whole thing, which you still don’t understand. I lay it out in post [929](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21201948&postcount=929). No, you didn’t “lay it out”. You batted around a straw man. You quoted yourself (inaccurately) characterizing my position, and Kimstu doing the same, then you attacked these straw man positions. You didn’t actually quote me as representing the position you attributed to me, because you couldn’t. Because I didn’t. As for the latter part of that post, about the “dogs and cows” analogy (the one place in the post you actually quoted my position before attacking it) I stand by my criticism of it, and in fact I revisited that criticism in a much more recent post upthread. > [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Actually, just out of curiosity, can you show any post on this board where you have ever admitted error? Seems like someone like you should have done that, unless you’re some kind of hypocrite, hmmmmm…? Here ya go: > [@St. Louis pizza is good! (Relatedly, TV critic Alan Sepinwall is a jerk.)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/st-louis-pizza-is-good-relatedly-tv-critic-alan-sepinwall-is-a-jerk/801733/121): > > BTW, mea culpa for raising an eyebrow at the idea that the Quad Cities could have their own pizza style. I honestly thought it was too small a metro area to warrant such a thing. But per Wikipedia, the Quad Cities CSA is #92 in the nation, and there’s a pretty steep dropoff once you get out of the top 100: Fargo-Moorhead, which I would have guessed to be bigger than the Quad Cities, is #116 and is barely over half as populous. Huh! > [@Black Panther movie](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-panther-movie/809075/601): > > You’re right. I have no answer to that, and I apologize. Lila wants to be called Lila and referred to as “she”, and there’s no reason for me not to indulge her in her preference. Mea culpa. This BTW was in reply to Kimstu, who responded: > [@Black Panther movie](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-panther-movie/809075/602): > > Manfully conceded (no sarcasm), and I salute you. Here’s one from a thread that was ultimately closed: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16806613&postcount=308](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16806613&postcount=308) > [@](#): > > Okay, you’ve convinced me that the KKK’s terrorism after Reconstruction is not likely to have made a deep genetic impact (though the social impact was surely dramatic). ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1065 "2018-09-14T00:33:18Z")
Ugh, I tried to fix the wonky formatting there but missed the edit window because I didn’t look at my post until after reading Andy’s and EE’s, posted while I was composing mine. Apologies. There are two places I neglected to paste in a close-quote box, so it may be unclear where the quoted material ends and my reply begins. My replies there begin with: “Oh wait, you did link to 948…” and “No, you didn’t ‘lay it out’.” (Psst, EE: that’s the correct way to nest quotes inside quotes. HTH) Anyway, EE has indeed spouted off again. No real surprise, but it does take chutzpah, even for him, to quote himself as follows: > [@](#): > > It took me less than 3 minutes to actually go check the data, do a little math, and conclude that this was utterly wrong. This was precisely the claim he ultimately had to retract\* and admit he was wrong, “SlackerInc was right”, and that he was glad I didn’t take his bet, which would have banished him from the board. But now he’s _citing_ it as evidence of something?!? :smack: \*I guess he didn’t _have_ to. He’s just as wrong in this thread, but he has stubbornly refused to concede an inch. What made the difference, I don’t know, unless it’s somehow just too humiliating to do it twice. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1066 "2018-09-14T01:13:19Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Rewriting history again, eh? I know you’re bad at math, but maybe you can try to comprehend this one: > > [number of times you come at me] \> [number of times I sigh and wearily respond] Actually I think it’s: [number of times you come at me]\<[number of times you shoot yourself in your own dick] > [@](#): > > As for the latter part of that post, about the “dogs and cows” analogy (the one place in the post you actually quoted my position before attacking it) I stand by my criticism of it, and in fact I revisited that criticism in a much more recent post upthread. Oh God, I’m going to have to go find that post. Is it as [weird and delusional as the original](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21202228&postcount=934)? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1067 "2018-09-14T01:29:00Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Ugh, I tried to fix the wonky formatting there but missed the edit window because I didn’t look at my post until after reading Andy’s and EE’s, posted while I was composing mine. Apologies. No one but me is reading your dumb delusional shit, dude. You’re certainly wearing out people’s scroll wheels. But you’re desperately performing to an audience that, to the extent they might accidentally glance at you, think you’re a capering fool. Like the way you keep linking to your posts, which are tedious, stupid, and wrong. They were tedious, stupid, and wrong the first time you posted them. Do you think anyone’s following those links? They’re not. (It’s OK to link to my posts. Keep doing that. I tear the fuck out of you in my posts, and people probably find that funny). My point is, don’t worry about the formatting. No one cares. It’s the least of the problems with your posts. Unfortunately, the biggest problem with your posts is you. That’s harder to fix. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1068 "2018-09-14T12:21:19Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > No cite there, so I’ll respond with my own cite-free data (I’ve started a thread about it, I think, and I’ll cite when I’m able) – police shoot 21 times as many young black men as young white men despite young black men only having about ~6-8 times the murder rate. Further, 50% of black people report being mistreated personally by law enforcement. That’s more than enough data to provide legitimate reasons for distrust of law enforcement. I’m sorry I thought this was common knowledge: > **[Analysis | Aren’t more white people than black people killed by police? Yes,...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.46eaa1831351)** > > Blacks are shot and killed by police at 2.5 times the rate of whites. “As The Post noted in a new analysis published last week, that means black Americans are 2.5 times as likely as white Americans to be shot and killed by police officers.” I know this says shot and killed but the lethality of shootings of black people are no higher than that of white people. I don’t know what the “police harassment” statistics are but I think they get harassed more frequently. > [@](#): > > Because people rightfully recognized it as virtually nothing, as it was in response to horrible shit on twitter. I have only seen screenshots of the #cancelwhitepeople along with a few posts above it and it all just seemed to be whtiebashing. I’ll ask for like the 20th time, do you have a link that shows this series of events that justifies saying #cancelwhitepeople? > [@](#): > > I’ve been called racist and I haven’t shut up. It doesn’t always work, but they wanted it to. So someone accused you of being racist against black or brown people? Or did they accuse you of being racist against white people? Because as we can see from this thread, being accused of being racist against white people doesn’t slow anyone down. > [@](#): > > If anyone’s been “shut up”, it’s because they shut themselves up. This is almost entirely nonsense. It’s just an excuse to whine about criticism. Hell, you’ve been called racist and you haven’t shut up. Do you have a single example of someone being shut up? Wait do you really think that people do not try to shut down debate with accusations of racism? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1069 "2018-09-14T12:29:35Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I’m sorry I thought this was common knowledge: > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?noredirect=on&utm\_term=.46eaa1831351](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.46eaa1831351) > > “As The Post noted in a new analysis published last week, that means black Americans are 2.5 times as likely as white Americans to be shot and killed by police officers.” > > I know this says shot and killed but the lethality of shootings of black people are no higher than that of white people. > > I don’t know what the “police harassment” statistics are but I think they get harassed more frequently. And here’s the cite for the 21 times difference: [Deadly Force, in Black and White — ProPublica](https://www.propublica.org/article/deadly-force-in-black-and-white) “The finding that young black men are 21 times as likely as their white peers to be killed by police is drawn from reports filed for the years 2010 to 2012, the three most recent years for which FBI numbers are available.” > [@](#): > > I have only seen screenshots of the #cancelwhitepeople along with a few posts above it and it all just seemed to be whtiebashing. I’ll ask for like the 20th time, do you have a link that shows this series of events that justifies saying #cancelwhitepeople? No one has justified it; we’ve just said it’s barely anything. Plenty of people have shown the harassment she got preceding this tweet. > [@](#): > > Wait do you really think that people do not try to shut down debate with accusations of racism? So do you have a single example of someone being “shut down” by a false accusation of racism? I’m sure somewhere that some individual has tried to do this, but other than the fantasies of right wing entertainers, I see no reason to believe this is anything more than rare (reasonable accusations of racism are relatively common, of course, because racism is pretty damn common and often easy to identify). ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1070 "2018-09-14T12:30:14Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > You are correct. Facebook is an absolutely reasonable example of social media. However, an individual’s Facebook feed is piss-poor example of what liberals or anyone other mass group of Americans say or believe. > > Any reasonable person knows that. I’m assuming that EE is an ignorant lunatic fringe liberal in real life and not just on this board so he has facebook frie3ndswoare similarly ignorant lunatic fringe liberals who post ignorant shit. I could be wrong and EE might be a rocket scientist in real life and he just wants to now what I feels like to be stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1071 "2018-09-14T12:36:09Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I tried looking for past elections where Obama ran against Trump. I wasn’t able to find any. I should have said voted for Obama twice before voting for Trump. You were saying that there is something about the “morons” who voted for Trump. I am saying that some of those same “morons” voted for Obama twice. I say this because you seem to think the people who voted for Trump were all lost causes. You seem to think that there is no reason to try to get their vote anyways because they were never going to vote for anyone other than Trump. I suspect there were at least as many people holding their nose as they voted for Trump as there were people holding their nose as they were voting for Hillary. You seem to be saying fuck them, we don’t need them. (You’ll just keep on losing lections rather than try to appeal to people who only agree with you 51%. If Trump wins re-election by a larger margin than the first time it will be because of people like you attacking centrist. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1072 "2018-09-14T12:46:29Z")
> [@andros](#): > > No. > > You’re trying to shut someone up by calling her a racist when she is not. I’m not involved in a debate with her. She sad something that was actually racist and I think the accusation is reasonable considering her response when it was brought to her attention. But I am glad that at least you realize that charges of racism can be used to shut down debate. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1073 "2018-09-14T13:19:40Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I’m not involved in a debate with her. She sad something that was actually racist and I think the accusation is reasonable considering her response when it was brought to her attention. > > But I am glad that at least you realize that charges of racism can be used to shut down debate. I recognize hypocrisy in service of an agenda, yes. Whatever your agenda actually _is_, beyond being contrary and attempting to marginalize someone with whom you disagree by calling her a racist. Which, by the by, she is not. . ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1074 "2018-09-14T13:46:15Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …ah. So your tone policing. Gotcha. No, I’m just laughing at laughing at your impotent white rage. > [@](#): > > No they fucking aren’t. Yes they fucking are. Your turn. > [@](#): > > I’m not making the claim that they are. You made that claim, you answer that question. In America, I think its because they have already won most of the arguments that can be won with facts and analysis alone (or at least the currently available facts) and now want to convince people to do what they want in areas where there isn’t clear and convincing evidence and so they try to turn their opinions into facts. So they lie or distort the truth. > [@](#): > > What the fuck do you know about “what my brand” is? I stand for social justice. I fight for the rights of the marginalized. You actually think that’s a problem? I was talking about Trump’s brand of shit. > [@](#): > > My dad was Samoan. His granddad was part of the Mau movement and was murdered by New Zealand police. My mum is Ngāpuhi. Any other personal details about me do you think you are entitled to know? Ummm. OK. Then forget what I said about impotent white rage. I now realize that your rage is not just self-masturbatory white liberal guilt exercise in patting yourself on the back. > [@](#): > > New Zealand is racist as fuck. I talked about this on these very boards just yesterday. Yes it is and I don’t know why I assumed you were white. Perhaps it was because so many of the people who condone anti-white racism here in America are white. I don’t see it as much from people who have actually experienced racism. > [@](#): > > You don’t know jackshit about my country apart from what you just looked up on google. You even thought I was pakeha, didn’t you? Yes, yes I did. I admit I don’t know that much about New Zealand. But I’ve done business in Australia (Macquarie) and New Zealand (TCNZ). The people are nice but there was a level of casual racism that was pretty shocking. I knew that your prime minister gave birth in office because I am interested in maternity leave as a universal benefit in the USA. I’ve watched a few movies from new Zealand that may or may not be accurate depictions of New Zealand society. But if they are, then New Zealand has some race problems of its own and can’t really wag its finger at the USA. My interaction with New Zealanders have been almost exclusively with pakeha, like I said, they are seemingly nice folks but racist as fuck. This was almost 20 years ago and things might be different now. > [@](#): > > The dominant group quite happily shares power. Do some fucking research. I didn’t say share power, I said LOSE power. Shared power can be taken back. If you have shared power, then you are just an agent for the dominant group and the power is shared only as long as the dominant group wants to share that power. I’m talking about when power is lost. How do you think the pakehas would react in your country if Maori (and other brown minorities) started to approach 50% of the population? When the pakehas aren’t mostly rich and the Maori aren’t largely poor? And they realize that New Zealand’s prosperity didn’t depend on white people controlling everything. > [@](#): > > When I see “liberals” accusing people of being racist: generally its because those people are racist. When I see it on this board or in debates about race, its frequently to shut people up. Its like how accusations of anti-Semitism fly whenever we have a debate about Israel’s treatment of Palestinians. Sure sometimes people are anti-semetic, but other times they just want people to shut up about how Israel treats the Palestinians. > [@](#): > > They do it because those people are fucking racist. So you have never seen liberals being accused of racism by the thought police branch of liberalism? > [@](#): > > We do that by doing all the things that you implore us not to. You do it with more than mere accusations of racism. We have racists here too and they must be opposed but the accusations of racism are being used against moderates and center left folks. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1075 "2018-09-14T14:08:56Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I should have said voted for Obama twice before voting for Trump. > > You were saying that there is something about the “morons” who voted for Trump. I am saying that some of those same “morons” voted for Obama twice. > > I say this because you seem to think the people who voted for Trump were all lost causes. You seem to think that there is no reason to try to get their vote anyways because they were never going to vote for anyone other than Trump. I suspect there were at least as many people holding their nose as they voted for Trump as there were people holding their nose as they were voting for Hillary. > > You seem to be saying fuck them, we don’t need them. (You’ll just keep on losing lections rather than try to appeal to people who only agree with you 51%. > > If Trump wins re-election by a larger margin than the first time it will be because of people like you attacking centrist. There seem to be a couple of glaring differences between Obama and Clinton, I’ll leave it to you to figure them out. Differences that might swing people to vote for Trump instead of Clinton. Besides, there are more than enough people who, if they would actually go and vote, to overcome the results of the last election. I would say focus more on getting Democrats to actually vote, and less on continuous outrage over what the President says on a daily basis. But that’s just me. And again, find one person who says “I was going to vote for Clinton, but people on Twitter were mean to white people, so I switched to Trump, even though nothing about his platform appealed to me” ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1076 "2018-09-14T15:26:21Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > And here’s the cite for the 21 times difference: [Deadly Force, in Black and White — ProPublica](https://www.propublica.org/article/deadly-force-in-black-and-white) > > “The finding that young black men are 21 times as likely as their white peers to be killed by police is drawn from reports filed for the years 2010 to 2012, the three most recent years for which FBI numbers are available.” Not that its not a problem but you are talking about the cohort of young black men 15-19 compared to the cohort of young white men 15-19. The ratio is still about 2.5 to 1. > **[How a controversial study found that police are more likely to shoot whites,...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/why-a-massive-new-study-on-police-shootings-of-whites-and-blacks-is-so-controversial/?utm_term=.dac1487eb922)** > > The findings were a big surprise for the Harvard economist who led the project > [@](#): > > No one has justified it; we’ve just said it’s barely anything. Plenty of people have shown the harassment she got preceding this tweet. Yes they have. I have seen it. But that harassment seems separated in time from the racist statement. It wasn’t “in the heat of the moment” it seemed to represent her general attitude rather than a visceral response. Does her statement last month now give white people license to be racist against Asians for the forseeable future? > [@](#): > > So do you have a single example of someone being “shut down” by a false accusation of racism? I’m sure somewhere that some individual has tried to do this, but other than the fantasies of right wing entertainers, I see no reason to believe this is anything more than rare (reasonable accusations of racism are relatively common, of course, because racism is pretty damn common and often easy to identify). I could point to pretty much every debate on Israel’s treatment of palestine where someone tries to shut someone up by accusing them of anti-Semitism. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1077 "2018-09-14T15:45:39Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Not that its not a problem but you are talking about the cohort of young black men 15-19 compared to the cohort of young white men 15-19. > > The ratio is still about 2.5 to 1. > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/why-a-massive-new-study-on-police-shootings-of-whites-and-blacks-is-so-controversial/?utm\_term=.dac1487eb922](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/why-a-massive-new-study-on-police-shootings-of-whites-and-blacks-is-so-controversial/?utm_term=.dac1487eb922) Huh? My link shows a ratio of 21 to 1 for young black men. > [@](#): > > Yes they have. I have seen it. But that harassment seems separated in time from the racist statement. It wasn’t “in the heat of the moment” it seemed to represent her general attitude rather than a visceral response. Does her statement last month now give white people license to be racist against Asians for the forseeable future? No one gets any license for racism ever at any time. Including Jeong. She said something dumb, in response to some horrible stuff, and apologized for it. > [@](#): > > I could point to pretty much every debate on Israel’s treatment of palestine where someone tries to shut someone up by accusing them of anti-Semitism. This isn’t what I asked you. Do you have a single example of someone being shut up (do you know what “being shut up” means? You were the one who offered that phrase) by such an accusation? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1078 "2018-09-14T15:51:59Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Even if we were to assume that liberals started becoming racist against white people, why would that lead to Trump in office? Why wouldn’t Republicans have nominated one of the other candidates? They were all on the “liberals are the true racists” bandwagon, calling them PC and SJWs and stuff. The conservative “liberals are the true racists” bandwagon seems to be premised on the notion that liberals are racist because they are race conscious and want race conscious policies and laws, while the conservatives think that the racial playing field is level so no need to mention or think about race (except in our private thought). I think their argument is weak. I also think you can go too far in the other direction and become TOO race conscious. What I am accusing liberals of doing to drive people to trump is not simply being racist against whites it is adopting the entire critical race theory school of thought, which blames white people for pretty much all of society’s woes. > [@](#): > > Also, Clinton herself never attacked white people. And yet most Trump voters cite Clinton as the reason they voted for Trump. There are a lot of reasons why Hillary lost. Most Trump voters were probably going to vote for whoever had the R next to their name no matter what. But at the margins, I think you’re right, it was probably Hillary. But slowly over time, I think we have been pushing white people away. Its not simply being racist against white people. Being racist against white people is just one side effect of critical race theory, which blames all of the woes of the black community on white supremacy and the institutional racism that they believe we have throughout our system from centuries of white racism that has permeated our society and its institutions. Crit race theorist might say #cancelwhiteness and perhaps it just transmogrified into #cancelwhitepeople when it came from Jeong. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1079 "2018-09-14T15:54:27Z")
> [@andros](#): > > I recognize hypocrisy in service of an agenda, yes. Whatever your agenda actually _is_, beyond being contrary and attempting to marginalize someone with whom you disagree by calling her a racist. > > Which, by the by, she is not. > . Why would she #cancelwhitepeople? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086/1080 "2018-09-14T16:00:14Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > There seem to be a couple of glaring differences between Obama and Clinton, I’ll leave it to you to figure them out. Differences that might swing people to vote for Trump instead of Clinton. Why so coy? What do you think those differences are? AFAICT, a lot more people vote for white women generally than black men. Judging from the senate and the house of representatives. > [@](#): > > Besides, there are more than enough people who, if they would actually go and vote, to overcome the results of the last election. I would say focus more on getting Democrats to actually vote, and less on continuous outrage over what the President says on a daily basis. But that’s just me. I agree. Trump is embarrassing but ultimately, SCOTUS nominations are more important. Unfortunately, we need the bread and circus of outrage to get people off their ass it seems. > [@](#): > > And again, find one person who says “I was going to vote for Clinton, but people on Twitter were mean to white people, so I switched to Trump, even though nothing about his platform appealed to me” And again, we are not talking about Michael Moore switching parties. We are talking about swing voters. people who voted for Obama twice and then voted for Trump. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086.md?page=53) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-york-times-hires-unapologetic-racist-writer/819086.md?page=55)