# Newborns, Hospitals, and the dreaded ACLU **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [May 14, 2001, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423 "2001-05-14T15:50:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2001, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/21 "2001-05-22T15:09:36Z")
The state of New Jersey won’t let me drop the “Jr.” from my driver’s license, though my father died 17 years ago and (the last I looked), I’m not royalty. ---
**Author:** ![BunRab](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@BunRab](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BunRab)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2001, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/22 "2001-05-22T21:40:47Z")
I had an e-pal (e-mail pen pal) for a while, from the Czech Republic. He was quite startled to hear that most Americans do have middle names- apparently, in their tradition, middle names are rare, he couldn’t think of anyone he knew personally who had one. (And on the other hand, compared to, say, Spanish tradition, Americans have pitifully few names.) Anyway, I imagine that many of the ethnic groups where middle names are not common, have problems when they come to the US - I can picture all the assorted officials at immigration demanding to know what their middle name is, and some of the entrants not even being aware that such a thing was allowed, let alone “practically required”! ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2001, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/23 "2001-05-22T22:25:47Z")
John W. Kennedy, I think you have made something of that point before. Somehow that detail is no longer widely known, and not really practiced by anyone but apparently you. I have a book detailing my family geneology, listing some steps back a John I, John II, and John III. They were not royalty, either, and I’m sure at some point deaths occurred to one without occurring to all. Your system also poses confusion - it is easier to keep straight if the numbering doesn’t change. What happens if you have a John I, John II, John III, and John IV, and then John II dies. Does that mean you now only have a John I, II, and III? Add to that the detail that some people are even named Junior, and there’s one more point of confusion. In short, I think most people \like\ keeping the number designations. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![ENugent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/4af34b/32.png) [@ENugent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ENugent)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2001, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/24 "2001-05-22T23:13:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Broomstick \* > Hey, flyboy, you know us pilots ask for that extra dose of governmental harassment just by stepping off the planet. How many other citizens have to report their health status to the federal government? I don’t have a reliable cite, but I have read that doctors cannot change their names unless they are willing to go back to medical school. Anyone know if it’s true? > [@](#): > > As a person with no middle name, I’ve stumbled across the “belief system” mentioned many times. I have an acquaintance who has only one name - she decided she didn’t like her old one, so she changed it. If you think it’s bad when they try to put an X as your middle initial, you should try not having both a first and last name… ---
**Author:** ![deepstblu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@deepstblu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/deepstblu)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2001, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/25 "2001-05-23T13:44:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ENugent \* > \*\*I have an acquaintance who has only one name - she decided she didn’t like her old one, so she changed it. If you think it’s bad when they try to put an X as your middle initial, you should try not having both a first and last name… \*\* Kreskin ran into this problem early in his career–he had trouble getting airline reservations with just one name. Finally hit on the idea of using the intitals “T.A.,” for “The Amazing…” ---
**Author:** ![AKAmame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/aca169/32.png) [@AKAmame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AKAmame)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2001, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/26 "2001-05-24T12:53:00Z")
In re the OP, in Australia if you name the baby at the hospital, someone there will fill in all the relevant forms for you and lodge them with all relevant government departments. Otherwise you have a couple of months (from memory) to name the child, and you have to fill in the forms and lodge them yourself. Now **that’s** an incentive to name the child before you leave! But as the thread has side-tracked to middle initials, a small true tale. My ex-work brought in a three letter acronym computer code for each staff member, which had to be quoted for all access to HR, staff records, computer based information services and computer-based help (ie everything beyond pen and paper). The code used the initials of the worker’s last name, first name, middle name. No middle name? No worries, they’d thought of that - the default was “X”. It was unfortunate for one of my co-workers that their last name began with “P” and their first name with “O”! **Irishman** , you may have read **John W Kennedy** ’s comment before, but others, such as me, have not. I thought that it was amusing, informative and pertinent. What’s the problem? ---
**Author:** ![flyboy152](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ed655f/32.png) [@flyboy152](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flyboy152)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2001, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/27 "2001-05-24T22:55:33Z")
\>\>I don’t have a reliable cite, but I have read that doctors cannot change their names unless they are willing to go back to medical school. Anyone know if it’s true? That can’t be right. I know women doctors who have married and changed their names to that of their husband. Also, it would be crazy; you don’t have to relearn medical skills just because you change your name. However, I’m sure they can’t just “do it”; they probably have to do a s\*\*\*load of paperwork (medical licenses, prescription permissions, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2001, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/28 "2001-05-25T11:59:39Z")
My Dad was born at home and has no birth certificate. When he joined the Air Force all he had for identification purposes was the telegram his parents sent when he was born, which apparently was enough in the early '50s, and now his military records are the foundation his identity is built on. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2001, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/29 "2001-05-26T04:00:00Z")
“NMN” is often used for people who have no middle names. There is a tradition in my family (not my idea, and I don’t adhere to it so don’t yell at me) of not giving middle names to daughters. The thinking is, apparently, that 1) Nuns don’t need middle names and b) Married women use their maiden names as middle names. So none of my sisters were given middle names. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2001, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/30 "2001-05-30T16:13:11Z")
Originally posted by AKAmame: > [@](#): > > **Irishman** , you may have read **John W Kennedy** ’s comment before, but others, such as me, have not. I thought that it was amusing, informative and pertinent. What’s the problem? I didn’t mean to sound like he shouldn’t have posted. The comment about him saying it before was just that - a comment. The “problem” is that until he said it (the first time), I was not aware of any practice of dropping the numerals. The actions of New Jersey indicate I’m not the only one. And I listed a couple reasons why the (apparently) new practice is better. ---
**Author:** ![deepbluesea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ba9def/32.png) [@deepbluesea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/deepbluesea)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2001, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/31 "2001-05-31T01:38:09Z")
I was born in an NY hospital, and my parents, because of the various complications in naming a Jewish baby (aside from the 8 day thing, they wanted a name that started with ‘I’, to honor my mother’s deceased father, and had a hard time coming to grips with one), they nearly didn’t get me named at all. A rather officious hospital lady - look, my mom was drugged out of her gourd after a LONG labor, and ‘hospital lady’ is all she can remember - said “name the kid today or I will name her Baby Girl [Lastname].” My parents, who normally wouldn’t have knuckled under to such pressure, went ahead and named me. (This is probably a good thing. With the best intentions in the world, they would never have gotten around to the legal process of filing a name change for me, and back when I was an easily-mortified teenager, getting a learner’s permit in the name of Baby Girl would’ve killed me.) It took them all day on the phone to find a name, and it is significant that my first name is one of the last ones in the I section in baby name books. Now, as for MDs - a doctor can change his name. Female doctors who get married sometimes do. Female doctors who get divorced sometimes do. And sometimes doctors just want to. (I know one MD who changed her name upon marriage, back to her maiden name after divorce, then to an entirely other name a few months after that. A puzzlement.) But the name-changing ante is higher for MDs in terms of paperwork and hassle, and plus you’ll have the annoying problem of explaining to all your patients why your fancy diplomas are issued to this entirely other person, which they will surely notice if they spend a few hours waiting for you in a small room with nothing but said diplomas and maybe a scale. Having diplomas not in your current name doesn’t exactly inspire faith in the white coat. ---
**Author:** ![Fern\_Forest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/71c47a/32.png) [@Fern\_Forest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fern_Forest)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2001, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/32 "2001-06-03T07:39:08Z")
I was born at home (1974) and wasn’t registered for 4 months. I was named however before I was born as the night before I was born my father had a dream that he had a son and named him Osiris. Needless to say they didn’t know they were going to have a boy. Although the doctor did bug them to get around and fill out the forms my mom delayed. I think some places are suck a little too deeply in red tape. They definately could do it better. I wonder how much money Quebec wastes on this naming thing, money that could be spent elsewhere on other things. But then that could also apply to many other countries for many other departments. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2001, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/33 "2001-06-03T23:01:23Z")
brother rat, am I to infer from your post that your first name is Osiris? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2001, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423/34 "2001-06-04T00:32:48Z")
What I’m wondering, is if your real name is Osiris, why you go by **brother rat** online. Osiris is certianly more interesting, if nothing else. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newborns-hospitals-and-the-dreaded-aclu/65423.md?page=1)