# Newspaper publishes pic of psychopath holding obvious brand-name beer: can they be sued to remove it **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 5, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177 "2012-06-05T17:13:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Spare\_Me](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Spare\_Me](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spare_Me)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/21 "2012-06-06T18:04:37Z")
> [@KarlGauss](#): > > Canadian psychopath [Luka Magnotta](http://www.thestar.com/business/article/1206132--luka-magnotta-sips-blue-labatt-sees-red?bn=1) is certainly getting his fifteen minutes. The link is to an article and photo which shows him holding the popular Canadian beer Labatt Blue. …well, “popular” is also a generous descriptor of Blue. 😃 Labatt’s decision to not further pursue the matter: “Our goal was simply to protect our brand. Given the serious nature of the underlying story, we decided it was important to request that an alternate photo be used. Once the Gazette explained their position, we promptly thanked them for their response, dropped the matter and we will not be following up further. We accept the Gazette’s position,” said the statement from Charlie Angelakos, Labatt’s vice president of corporate affairs. Should actually be read as “Once the folks from Legal found out what we did, they told us to drop it. Something about a leg and standing on it…?” About the only person who’d have any cause of action here at all would be, as was pointed out above, the photographer who took the picture. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/22 "2012-06-07T21:18:51Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Kleenex is a trademarked brand name. That means nobody else can sell tissues and call them “Kleenex”. That doesn’t mean I can’t say “Pass me a kleenex”, or write a story where a character says “Pass me a kleenex”. The trademark doesn’t regulate how I am supposed to, or allowed to, use the word “kleenex” in everyday speech or news stories or books or movies. Companies are (or should be) vigilant on using their trademarked names loosely, or they might lose the trademark. This has happened often, notably with aspirin, which was a trademarked name by Bayer. Bayer was not vigilant in protesting this and lost its trademark. A company can’t do anything about verbal abuse, but if that appeared in print as you quoted, most assuredly the author and publisher would be requested to change the quote by capitalizing the “k” and showing the trademark symbol. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/23 "2012-06-07T21:33:33Z")
For what it’s worth, [Lacoste tried a similar thing with Anders Breivik (of the 2011 Norway attacks)](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep/09/anders-breivik-clothes-lacoste-police). ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/24 "2012-06-07T21:37:41Z")
Kleenex could send the author and/or publisher a letter asking them to change the reference. And that’s all. There’s no legal requirement for anyone to abide by Kleenex’s wishes. The letter does not mean that the name can’t be legally used. What the letter does is demonstrate that the company tries to protect its trademark. If a trademark falls out of use, you lose your right to use the trademark exclusively. So Kleenex sends out the letters, not to get people to stop using the word kleenex to refer to any tissue, but to demonstrate that they haven’t abandoned the trademark. Often though, magazines and newspapers and TV shows will voluntarily agree to these requests, because they make their money from selling advertising. They want to keep their advertisers, or potential future advertisers, happy. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/25 "2012-06-07T21:52:33Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > Maybe Magnotta Wines can get the courts to change his name as well. Anyone heard from Suzanne Vega? ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/26 "2012-06-07T22:08:50Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > Companies are (or should be) vigilant on using their trademarked names loosely, or they might lose the trademark. This has happened often, notably with aspirin, which was a trademarked name by Bayer. Bayer was not vigilant in protesting this and lost its trademark. A company can’t do anything about verbal abuse, but if that appeared in print as you quoted, most assuredly the author and publisher would be requested to change the quote by capitalizing the “k” and showing the trademark symbol. Bayer lost the aspirin trademark in the US as part of WWI reparations not because the Bayer company failed to protect the trademark. > [@](#): > > As part of war reparations specified in the 1919 Treaty of Versailles following Germany’s surrender after World War I, Aspirin (along with heroin) lost its status as a registered trademark in France, Russia, the United Kingdom, and the United States, where it became a generic name. > **[Aspirin | Trademark](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspirin#Trademark)** > > Bayer lost its trademark for aspirin in the United States and some other countries in actions taken between 1918 and 1921 because it had failed to use the name for its own product correctly and had for years allowed the use of "Aspirin" by other manufacturers without defending the intellectual property rights. Aspirin is a generic trademark in many countries. Aspirin, with a capital "A", remains a registered trademark of Bayer in Germany, Canada, Mexico, and in over 80 other countries 1.United St... ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/27 "2012-06-08T10:44:09Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > Bayer lost the aspirin trademark in the US as part of WWI reparations not because the Bayer company failed to protect the trademark. > > [Aspirin - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspirin#Trademark) The entire Wikipedia paragraph states: > [@](#): > > As part of war reparations specified in the 1919 Treaty of Versailles following Germany’s surrender after World War I, Aspirin (along with heroin) lost its status as a registered trademark in France, Russia, the United Kingdom, and the United States, where it became a generic name.[168][169][170] Today, aspirin is a generic word in Australia, France, India, Ireland, New Zealand, Pakistan, Jamaica, Colombia, the Philippines, South Africa, the United Kingdom and the United States.[171] Aspirin, with a capital “A”, remains a registered trademark of Bayer in Germany, Canada, Mexico, and in over 80 other countries, where the trademark is owned by Bayer, using acetylsalicylic acid in all markets, but using different packaging and physical aspects for each.[172][173] Footnotes 168, 169, and 170 given as authority for that statement do not state that. Footnote 172 makes a similar statement, but says it expired in the USA in 1917, but gives no authority for stating it was part of the war reparations for the other countries. I did not find that in the Treaty of Versailles. The Wikipedia statement says it remains a trademark in certain countries “using different packaging and physical aspects,” whatever that may mean. Fn 173 states: > [@](#): > > Aspirin, which was originally a proper noun, later became a common noun, so the initial letter was no longer capitalized. The word has now joined the general language, in the company of many other well-known proper nouns that are no longer proper.3,4 I published a partial list of these in 1997. ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/28 "2012-06-08T15:25:52Z")
> **[Chemistry news, research and opinions | Chemistry World](https://www.chemistryworld.com/?playpodcastlinkuri=%2Fchemistryworld%2Fpodcast%2FCIIEcompound.asp%3Fcompound%3DAspirin)** > > Chemistry, covered. Science news, research, reviews, features and opinions. Read Chemistry World to keep up with stories from across the chemical sciences. > [@](#): > > On the 28th of June 1919, the treaty of Versailles was signed, laying out the formal reparations that would be laid on Germany at the end of the first world war. As might be expected, much of the treaty was concerned with boundaries and military restrictions. But it also had a significant financial component, and there among the huge payments and heavy industry provisions for steel and coal was the freedom to use the name ‘aspirin’. From [Bayer.com](http://Bayer.com) [http://www.bayer.com/en/the-bayer-cross.aspx](http://www.bayer.com/en/the-bayer-cross.aspx) > [@](#): > > The Treaty of Versailles, which was signed in 1919 by Germany and the Allied powers to end World War I, brought an abrupt end to the successful company’s expansion plans. Bayer’s foreign assets were seized, along with its patent and trademark rights, which included both the Bayer Cross and Aspirin™, an extremely important product. At the time, the Alien Property Custodian sold the patents of the German chemical industry for only US$ 250,000 - a heavy blow for the Farbenfabriken. This meant that in the United States, the Bayer name no longer belonged to Bayer, but to Sterling Drug. It wasn’t until 1994 that Bayer regained the right to use its name and corporate logo in the United States by acquiring the North American non-prescription drug business of Sterling Winthrop. After more than 74 years, however, the price had risen dramatically: Bayer paid $1 billion for the right to use a uniform corporate logo throughout the world. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/29 "2012-06-08T16:43:00Z")
Plus, doesn’t a trademark have to be used “in commerce” to qualify for infringement? Simply mentioning it in a story wouldn’t qualify, IIRC… ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/30 "2012-06-08T16:57:20Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > Plus, doesn’t a trademark have to be used “in commerce” to qualify for infringement? Simply mentioning it in a story wouldn’t qualify, IIRC.. If the trademark is bandied around and used commonly, it is lost. You can be sure that the companies producing Vaseline, Kleenex, Frigidaire, etc. are vigilant in checking written material for the generic use of their trademarks. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/31 "2012-06-08T17:13:38Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > If the trademark is bandied around and used commonly, it is lost. You can be sure that the companies producing Vaseline, Kleenex, Frigidaire, etc. are vigilant in checking written material for the generic use of their trademarks. Right, but people using those terms in a generic sense aren’t guilty of trademark violation. These companies are simply using those letters as later proof that they didn’t acquiese in allowing their trademarks to become generic terms. If I tell you that I made a xerox copy of a document, Xerox can bitch all they want, but can’t stop me from using words how I please. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/32 "2012-06-08T18:50:20Z")
That reminds me of that cult that committed mass suicide in the 90s. All of those pictures of dead bodies in the dormitory wearing Nike tennis shoes. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/33 "2012-06-08T19:31:43Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > If the trademark is bandied around and used commonly, it is lost. You can be sure that the companies producing Vaseline, Kleenex, Frigidaire, etc. are vigilant in checking written material for the generic use of their trademarks. They can be vigilant all they want, but the fact that a name is trademarked doesn’t prevent people from using trademarked names in any way. The only thing a trademark does is prevent people from using someone else’s trademarked name in commerce. And even then, a trademark is not a blanket prohibition. The Beatles trademarked Apple Music. Then a computer company came along that was also called Apple. They were allowed to use the Apple name for their computer company, because they were a computer company that had nothing to do with music. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/34 "2012-06-08T19:34:04Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > And even then, a trademark is not a blanket prohibition. The Beatles trademarked Apple Music. Then a computer company came along that was also called Apple. They were allowed to use the Apple name for their computer company, because they were a computer company that had nothing to do with music. Until iTunes happened many years later. There must have been some legal fuss over that. I wonder if they’re prevented from using the Apple name on anything to do with iTunes. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 10:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/35 "2013-06-02T10:43:36Z")
Assuming he didn’t take the picture himself, their best strategy would be to pay the legal costs of the photographer to sue for using his photo without permission. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/36 "2013-06-02T11:22:42Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Until iTunes happened many years later. There must have been some legal fuss over that. I wonder if they’re prevented from using the Apple name on anything to do with iTunes. That shit went on forever. > **[Apple Corps v Apple Computer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Corps_v_Apple_Computer)** > > Between 1978 and 2007, there were a number of legal disputes between Apple Corps (owned by the Beatles) and the computer manufacturer Apple Computer (now Apple Inc.) over competing trademark rights, specifically over the use of the name "Apple" and their respective logos which consist of a profile of an apple. Apple Inc. paid Apple Corps. over three settlements: $80,000 in 1978, $26.5 million in 1991, and $500 million in 2007, when Apple Inc. acquired all the trademarks related to "Apple." > The... ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/37 "2013-06-02T12:24:41Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > That reminds me of that cult that committed mass suicide in the 90s. All of those pictures of dead bodies in the dormitory wearing Nike tennis shoes. I thought of this too. When Labbat bitches and moans, they should thank their lucky stars they’re not Kool-Aid. New game: Brands associated with crimes: OJ Simpson/Bruno Maglie shoes. ETA: Kool-Aid and suicide has now entered the language in general contexts–now that’s bad. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/38 "2013-06-03T02:29:08Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > Assuming he didn’t take the picture himself, their best strategy would be to pay the legal costs of the photographer to sue for using his photo without permission. Is there some reason you had to revive a year-old thread? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/39 "2013-06-03T02:55:45Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > I thought of this too. > > When Labbat bitches and moans, they should thank their lucky stars they’re not Kool-Aid. > > New game: Brands associated with crimes: > OJ Simpson/Bruno Maglie shoes. > ETA: Kool-Aid and suicide has now entered the language in general contexts–now that’s bad. Especially since it’s entirely [unclear](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drinking_the_Kool-Aid#Jonestown_massacre) whether actual Kool-Aid or its competitor Flavor-Aid was the brand used. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177/40 "2013-06-03T03:02:25Z")
> [@Terminus\_Est](#): > > Is there some reason you had to revive a year-old thread? I didn’t. I don’t know, it came up on my screen under latest posts. Maybe someone added a spam post that got deleted but still caused it to show up as new. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/newspaper-publishes-pic-of-psychopath-holding-obvious-brand-name-beer-can-they-be-sued-to-remove-it/624177.md?page=3)