# NFL 2024-25: Week 18 **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** football-nfl\ **Created:** [December 31, 2024, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397 "2024-12-31T15:20:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/81 "2025-01-06T15:28:56Z")
> [@solost](#): > > that’s why it worked so well- you don’t see the Lions lining up to go for it on 4th and think, “eh, they’re bluffing”. Exactly. It’s one of those intangible effects of the risky calls that is more difficult to quantify than simply looking at success vs failure rate. Another was the Lions 4th down success versus the Vikings. The Lions go for it so often, I don’t think they feel the same stress on an attempt. Been there, done that - if it doesn’t work, they move on. The Vikings looked panicked on their 4th down attempts, which probably contributed to their lack of success. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/82 "2025-01-06T15:37:07Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The Vikings looked panicked on their 4th down attempts, which probably contributed to their lack of success. To the point where somewhere near the end of the 3rd or start of the 4th they decided to try a long FG (which they missed) when I’m pretty sure going for it was the right decision. It was 4th and 3 down 8 points at the Lions 38 yard line. Somebody can find the chart but that certainly felt overly conservative to me. The Vikings really shot themselves in the foot execution-wise in that game. But some of that, of course, was the Lions defense playing much better than I’d been led to believe they could (I haven’t watched them much this year). ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/83 "2025-01-06T15:45:42Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The Vikings looked panicked on their 4th down attempts, which probably contributed to their lack of success. > [@Jas09](#): > > The Vikings really shot themselves in the foot execution-wise in that game. But some of that, of course, was the Lions defense playing much better than I’d been led to believe they could (I haven’t watched them much this year). Yeah, the Lions’ defensive game was a thing of beauty. From what I understand, it was a clear choice on the part of Aaron Glenn to get aggressive and try to put a lot of pressure on Darnold. Instead of playing it safe with the depleted defenders and just playing a contain defense, holding the Vikings to ‘only’ around 30 points and hoping the offense can score more. That aggressive defense could have blown up in their faces and led to a lot of big Vikings plays, but it worked perfectly. The constant closeups on Darnold’s face in the second half, showing his ever-increasing looks of frustration, I _almost_ felt bad for him. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/84 "2025-01-06T15:48:52Z")
> [@solost](#): > > The constant closeups on Darnold’s face in the second half, showing his ever-increasing looks of frustration, I _almost_ felt bad for him. He was seeing ghosts again, huh? ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/85 "2025-01-06T15:53:59Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > He was seeing ghosts again, huh? Ha, I was not aware of the source of that reference and had to [google it](https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/jets-sam-darnold-admits-to-seeing-ghosts-during-dreadful-performance-vs-patriots/). Yeah, he definitely looked like he was seeing a ghost or two last night. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/86 "2025-01-06T15:59:42Z")
> [@solost](#): > > I was wondering whether it was a true bluff or if it was just the Lions going for it on 4th like they always do. But, that’s why it worked so well- you don’t see the Lions lining up to go for it on 4th and think, “eh, they’re bluffing”. Goff’s go-to phrase to snap the ball is “Turbo Set.” He used it pretty much the whole game last night (I believe). But on this occasion, the OL knew it wasn’t being snapped on “Turbo Set.” The DL wasn’t privy to such information and the deception worked brilliantly! Goff has a great cadence for drawing teams offside. One thing I noticed in the Lions-Vikings game is that the refs apparently think the 40-second play clock is just there for looks. Vikings got away with several delay-of-game penalties. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/87 "2025-01-06T16:03:55Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > One thing I noticed in the Lions-Vikings game is that the refs apparently think the 40-second play clock is just there for looks. Vikings got away with several delay-of-game penalties. Yeah. The CW is that the back judge looks at the clock, then looks down to see if it has been snapped, but how long could that possibly take? Half a second at the most to shift your eyes 2 mm. I call shenanigans, which is apparently backed up by the league ordering them to give the offense all the leeway in the world and then some. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/88 "2025-01-06T16:04:14Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > One thing I noticed in the Lions-Vikings game is that the refs apparently think the 40-second play clock is just there for looks. Vikings got away with several delay-of-game penalties. They got popped on a couple delay-of-game penalties, too. The Vikings’ offense just looked disorganized and out of it the entire second half, again thanks to Aaron Glenn’s risky call to get aggressive with the Lions’ beat-up defense. He’s going to have a fun playoff bye week taking interviews. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/89 "2025-01-06T16:51:55Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > To the point where somewhere near the end of the 3rd or start of the 4th they decided to try a long FG (which they missed) when I’m pretty sure going for it was the right decision. It was 4th and 3 down 8 points at the Lions 38 yard line. Somebody can find the chart but that certainly felt overly conservative to me. I don’t see a down exactly like that, but I see a 4th and 4 on the 34 where they’re down 8, and it’s better to go for it, though not by a lot (+0.6%). [MIN at DET Live 4th Downs - ESPN Analytics](https://espnanalytics.com/decision-game?id=2) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/90 "2025-01-06T19:17:28Z")
> [@solost](#): > > They got popped on a couple delay-of-game penalties, too. My WAG is that they got away with toeing the line for so long all game that they got too comfortable and it eventually caught up with them. When they finally started getting flagged I couldn’t be happier. Reap what you sow. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/91 "2025-01-06T19:36:59Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > When they finally started getting flagged I couldn’t be happier. Maybe the powers that be in the NFL got word to the refs that NBC was letting the entire world know that the Vikes were getting away with this foul numerous times. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/92 "2025-01-06T21:55:41Z")
Packers WR Christian Watson, who had to come out of yesterday’s loss to the Bears, has a torn ACL, which will knock him out of the playoffs, and will likely mean he won’t be able to return in time for the start of next season. Both Packers QBs – starter Jordan Love, and backup Malik Willis – suffered injuries, as well: Love had to leave the game after injuring his throwing elbow, while Willis banged his hand on an opponent’s helmet late in the game. Neither has been ruled out for Sunday’s playoff game against the Eagles, but it’ll undoubtedly depend on how their weeks go. > **[Packers' Watson has season-ending knee injury](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/43311095/source-initial-tests-show-packers-wr-christian-watson-tore-acl)** > > Packers receiver Christian Watson sustained a season-ending knee injury in Sunday's loss to the Chicago Bears. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/93 "2025-01-06T22:03:26Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Neither has been ruled out for Sunday’s playoff game against the Eagles, but it’ll undoubtedly depend on how their weeks go. I checked the Packers depth chart and their 3rd QB option is… Blank space. Oh well, the 49ers did just fine in the 2022 NFC Championship without a QB, right? ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/94 "2025-01-06T22:06:11Z")
I hear Jimmy Garoppolo is available. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/95 "2025-01-06T22:06:34Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I checked the Packers depth chart and their 3rd QB option is… Blank space. They do have a third-stringer, Sean Clifford, who is in his second year with the Packers. He’s been on the practice squad for most of this season (elevated to the active roster for one game in September, when Jordan Love was out). ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/96 "2025-01-06T22:54:34Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > One thing I noticed in the Lions-Vikings game is that the refs apparently think the 40-second play clock is just there for looks. Vikings got away with several delay-of-game penalties. Of note is that the play clock hitting zero means there’s one second left. The second between one and zero. Conceptually, imagine it’s a one second clock. The instant you start a one second clock it would show zero, because there would instantly be 0.99 seconds left. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/97 "2025-01-06T22:56:04Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > They do have a third-stringer, Sean Clifford, who is in his second year with the Packers. He’s been on the practice squad for most of this season Ah… And I guess practice squad folks won’t show up on the depth chart because they can’t play unless elevated from it, which can (and probably will) happen if Love and/or Willis can’t be available. I guess that’s better than figuring out how good of a quarterback your punter was in highschool. 😆 ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/98 "2025-01-06T23:25:12Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Ah… And I guess practice squad folks won’t show up on the depth chart because they can’t play unless elevated from it, which can (and probably will) happen if Love and/or Willis can’t be available. Exactly. And, based on what Matt LaFleur said yesterday (that Love could have gone back in, if it had been necessary) and today, it seems likely that, barring a setback, both of them will be able to play – even if not at 100% – on Sunday. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/99 "2025-01-06T23:55:47Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Of note is that the play clock hitting zero means there’s one second left. Are you sure about that? It runs counter to every clock I’ve seen (I used to run the clock at my kid’s games). When I started the clock, it took a second before the clock changed, i.e. if it started at 40, it stayed 40 for the first second before changing to 39, and when it hit 0, it was truly zero (it even sounded a loud horn at the instant it hit 0). ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397/100 "2025-01-06T23:59:14Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Are you sure about that? I’m not sure about that, either. What I do see is that most officials seem to give a fraction of a second of a grace period on calling delay of game, and don’t blow the play dead the moment that the play clock ticks over to “0” if the ball hasn’t been snapped yet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-2024-25-week-18/1012397.md?page=6)