# NFL Playoffs - 2018 Edition **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 31, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008 "2018-12-31T22:47:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/301 "2019-01-21T20:00:32Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I dont hate them that much, it was just the most recent example of something annoying they did. You seem to be much more invested than I. I have one post in this thread (now two), so you might be overestimating my investment. But my point was that you listed overpriced underdog t-shirts as one reason to hate the Patriots. Leaving aside the “overpriced” nonsense ([all NFL gear is overpriced: ahem, $22 cheesehead](http://www.packersproshop.com/green-bay-packers-hats/cheesehead-and-novelty)), what T-shirts the team sells has as much relevance to the team itself as what concessions they sell. Seems a bit silly to lump that in with supposed cheating. But to each their own. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/302 "2019-01-21T20:03:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > It’s a laff riot that there is \*anyone \*who thinks the Pats \*invented \*the “nobody believes in us” self-motivation stuff that has been an absolute team sports cliche for as long as there have been team sports. But do go on, please. This is a textbook example of your rhetorical slipperiness. No-one in this thread has suggested that the Patriots invented the “nobody believes in us” schtick." The point they have been making is that such schtick is generally deployed by poor-to-middling teams, rather than being trotted out by a historically dominant team that has won its division every year for the past decade, and is about to appear in its ninth Superbowl out of the past 18, including 5 wins over that stretch. Did you hear any of the same woe-is-us underdog stuff from the mid-90s Dallas Cowboys, the 1980s San Francisco 49ers, or the 1970s Pittsburgh Steelers? > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Did you pass high school chemistry? I passed high school literacy, which is all that’s necessary to grasp the issues in the deflating discussion. Let me know if you want some help. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/303 "2019-01-21T20:15:27Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > This is a textbook example of your rhetorical slipperiness. Let’s see an example of such a thing, shall we? Oh, look: > [@](#): > > The point they have been making is that such schtick is generally deployed by poor-to-middling teams, rather than being trotted out by a historically dominant team Unfortunately that’s the first time that point has been made here. Do please note that the tactic obviously works for the Patriots. > [@](#): > > I passed high school literacy, which is all that’s necessary to grasp the issues in the deflating discussion. So, no, and I didn’t really think so. Interesting statement you made earlier about “blind hatred”, though. BTW, when a Billy Beane team actually \*wins \*something, do please let us know that, too. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/304 "2019-01-21T21:42:19Z")
You’re more slippery than an eel, aren’t you? Every argument you make ignores the inconvenient facts, and moves the goalposts just enough so that, to a casual observer, it might almost seem like you are debating in good faith. I should have known not to engage you. I’ve learned in the baseball threads; it seems the rule applies more generally. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/305 "2019-01-21T23:08:26Z")
“Good! Use your aggressive feelings, boy. Let the hate flow through you.” ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/306 "2019-01-21T23:41:00Z")
Interesting. Dating back to 1970 as a starting point, every decade thereafter has seen the same team win at least three Super Bowls in that decade. Steelers in the 1970’s, 49ers in the 1980’s, Cowboys in the 1990’s, Patriots in 2000-2010, and about to be the Patriots again (2010-2020). ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/307 "2019-01-22T00:23:29Z")
The Deflategate scandal ultimately wasn’t about deflating footballs, but about Tom Brady lying through his teeth repeatedly. He made provably false statements over and over, and then destroyed his phone to prevent it from being used against him. I don’t hold the Patriots as an organization responsible and it’s clear that no deflation occurred but Brady deserves the suspension. I liked that New England went 3-1 in Brady’s absence to start that year and pretty much didn’t seem to miss him. That was my favorite part. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/308 "2019-01-22T01:26:04Z")
[Moderating] This thread is about the 2018 Playoffs. Whatever it was that happened with Deflategate, it was years ago. If you absolutely must discuss it, take it to a different thread. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/309 "2019-01-22T01:26:04Z")
[Moderating] This thread is about the 2018 Playoffs. Whatever it was that happened with Deflategate, it was years ago. If you absolutely must discuss it, take it to a different thread. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/310 "2019-01-22T02:54:46Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > You’re more slippery than an eel, aren’t you? He’s not “slippery”. He’s simply unwilling to accept things that dont fit his predetermined outcome and is willing to stretch or ignore facts and rely instead on “Winning!” as a response. He’s the Donald Trump of sports fandom. > [@mhendo](#): > > I should have known not to engage you. I’ve learned in the baseball threads; it seems the rule applies more generally. Absolutely. I agree with him on many of his political positions, but I shudder every single time he enters a debate because he’s simply a waste of time. It’s good to be reminded that it applies to sports as well as politics. ---
**Author:** ![DKW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dkw/32/3118_2.png) [@DKW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DKW)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/311 "2019-01-22T04:06:01Z")
Ugh. I think [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muTEm2KZdbk) sums up my feelings quite nicely. Okay, here’s the thing. I’ve understood the reality of terrible officiating and outright corruption in sports for a long, long time. I know that being a sports fan means accepting this crap, and this exactly why I stopped being a fan of anything a long time ago. It makes absolutely no difference to me why it happens; match fixing, gross incompetence, overcomplicated rules, favoritism, or just lousy luck; the lousy end result is the same and the pain is completely real whatever the cause. It’s like a perverse version of the Assassins’ motto: Nothing is legitimate, everything is wrong. But there is one major difference with the NFL: it has, for many years, made a tremendous effort to _fight_ this crap. That’s why the rulebook gets retooled every season. That’s why there’s a replay official. That’s why there are coaches’ challenges. That’s hitting helmet to helmet has been outlawed under any circumstances. The league didn’t just give a bunch of lip service, throw a convenient scapegoat under the bus, and change diddly-squat, the usual response to outcries about robberies. It actually _cares_ about having fair contests and has shown it with all these new rules, and new procedures, and new safeguards. **And it hasn’t made one goddam tiny bit of difference.** At this point I have to reach the sad conclusion that there’s just something extremely unnatural or counterintuitive about football which causes the men in charge of regulating their sport, despite their best intentions, to royally screw up, and there simply isn’t any solution to be had. How many big officiating flaps have there been in baseball since it instituted replay? Baseball used to be _rife_ with egregious offenses…there’s a reason this is the sport that gave us “Cyclops” and “blind”…and a simple technological measure effectively put an end to that. The NFL stabs this beast over and over and over, and it simply refuses to die. As for the Super Bowl…ah, geez. How do I put this? There was one the Patriots had, _had_, HAD to have, and that was the one that would’ve completed a perfect 19-0 season and _shut up that one worthless blathering 70’s relic forever_. Had they done this, it would’ve been the league’s single happiest moment in an eternity and made _everything_ worth it. I wouldn’t have given a rip if there were a hundred scandals, if a thousand players had their dreams smashed and gobbled up by the Pats juggernaut. _Killing the albatross would’ve made it ALL worth it._ And of course they had to blow it. And do you know who they _did_ get the best of later? The Seahawks. :smack: And Falcons. :mad: Now they face the Rams in two weeks. I remember the first such encounter, where the Patriots parlayed a bizarre game-turning call against the Raiders into an incredibly inexplicable matchup against a _much_ stronger NFC team…who lost because they got cocky and didn’t take their opponent seriously (:smack: x 5,000). If they win again…um…it’ll be like the Seahawks all over again. Then again, what’s my rooting interest for Los Angeles? All right, boys, take down the Evil Empire and _we can stop talking about Lebron James for a couple months!_ Looks like it’s going to be another strange, confusing afternoon at Lucky Strike Social Club. Oh well, at least the video games are always good. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/312 "2019-01-22T04:27:31Z")
> [@DKW](#): > > Ugh. I think [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muTEm2KZdbk) sums up my feelings quite nicely. > > Okay, here’s the thing. I’ve understood the reality of terrible officiating and outright corruption in sports for a long, long time. I know that being a sports fan means accepting this crap, and this exactly why I stopped being a fan of anything a long time ago. It makes absolutely no difference to me why it happens; match fixing, gross incompetence, overcomplicated rules, favoritism, or just lousy luck; the lousy end result is the same and the pain is completely real whatever the cause. It’s like a perverse version of the Assassins’ motto: Nothing is legitimate, everything is wrong. > > But there is one major difference with the NFL: it has, for many years, made a tremendous effort to _fight_ this crap. That’s why the rulebook gets retooled every season. That’s why there’s a replay official. That’s why there are coaches’ challenges. That’s hitting helmet to helmet has been outlawed under any circumstances. The league didn’t just give a bunch of lip service, throw a convenient scapegoat under the bus, and change diddly-squat, the usual response to outcries about robberies. It actually _cares_ about having fair contests and has shown it with all these new rules, and new procedures, and new safeguards. > > **And it hasn’t made one goddam tiny bit of difference.** > > At this point I have to reach the sad conclusion that there’s just something extremely unnatural or counterintuitive about football which causes the men in charge of regulating their sport, despite their best intentions, to royally screw up, and there simply isn’t any solution to be had. How many big officiating flaps have there been in baseball since it instituted replay? Baseball used to be _rife_ with egregious offenses…there’s a reason this is the sport that gave us “Cyclops” and “blind”…and a simple technological measure effectively put an end to that. The NFL stabs this beast over and over and over, and it simply refuses to die. > > As for the Super Bowl…ah, geez. How do I put this? There was one the Patriots had, _had_, HAD to have, and that was the one that would’ve completed a perfect 19-0 season and _shut up that one worthless blathering 70’s relic forever_. Had they done this, it would’ve been the league’s single happiest moment in an eternity and made _everything_ worth it. I wouldn’t have given a rip if there were a hundred scandals, if a thousand players had their dreams smashed and gobbled up by the Pats juggernaut. _Killing the albatross would’ve made it ALL worth it._ And of course they had to blow it. And do you know who they _did_ get the best of later? > > The Seahawks. :smack: > > And Falcons. :mad: > > Now they face the Rams in two weeks. I remember the first such encounter, where the Patriots parlayed a bizarre game-turning call against the Raiders into an incredibly inexplicable matchup against a _much_ stronger NFC team…who lost because they got cocky and didn’t take their opponent seriously (:smack: x 5,000). If they win again…um…it’ll be like the Seahawks all over again. Then again, what’s my rooting interest for Los Angeles? All right, boys, take down the Evil Empire and _we can stop talking about Lebron James for a couple months!_ > > Looks like it’s going to be another strange, confusing afternoon at Lucky Strike Social Club. Oh well, at least the video games are always good. I could not read this post without slipping it into a "Old man screaming “Get Offa My Lawn!” voice. I have no clue what your point is or what kind of conspiracy you think exists. It was kinda fun though. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/313 "2019-01-22T11:36:38Z")
> [@DKW](#): > > Looks like it’s going to be another strange, confusing afternoon at Lucky Strike Social Club. Yeah, I’m sure it will. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/314 "2019-01-22T11:50:34Z")
> [@DKW](#): > > Ugh. I think [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muTEm2KZdbk) sums up my feelings quite nicely. > > Okay, here’s the thing. I’ve understood the reality of terrible officiating and outright corruption in sports for a long, long time. I know that being a sports fan means accepting this crap, and this exactly why I stopped being a fan of anything a long time ago. It makes absolutely no difference to me why it happens; match fixing, gross incompetence, overcomplicated rules, favoritism, or just lousy luck; the lousy end result is the same and the pain is completely real whatever the cause. It’s like a perverse version of the Assassins’ motto: Nothing is legitimate, everything is wrong. > > But there is one major difference with the NFL: it has, for many years, made a tremendous effort to _fight_ this crap. That’s why the rulebook gets retooled every season. That’s why there’s a replay official. That’s why there are coaches’ challenges. That’s hitting helmet to helmet has been outlawed under any circumstances. The league didn’t just give a bunch of lip service, throw a convenient scapegoat under the bus, and change diddly-squat, the usual response to outcries about robberies. It actually _cares_ about having fair contests and has shown it with all these new rules, and new procedures, and new safeguards. > > **And it hasn’t made one goddam tiny bit of difference.** > > At this point I have to reach the sad conclusion that there’s just something extremely unnatural or counterintuitive about football which causes the men in charge of regulating their sport, despite their best intentions, to royally screw up, and there simply isn’t any solution to be had. How many big officiating flaps have there been in baseball since it instituted replay? Baseball used to be _rife_ with egregious offenses…there’s a reason this is the sport that gave us “Cyclops” and “blind”…and a simple technological measure effectively put an end to that. The NFL stabs this beast over and over and over, and it simply refuses to die. It seems counter-intuitive but I’ve wondered whether our increased reliance on instant reply and challenges (in baseball and football) has made the actual real-time officiating and umpiring worse. It’s not that umps or refs deliberately go out there to nonchalantly call a game but perhaps on a subconscious level, there’s the understanding that “Hey, if I fuck it up, there’s instant replay.” ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/315 "2019-01-22T13:12:11Z")
**[Moderating]** OK, I apparently should have read through the whole thread when I got the previous report. You guys should know enough that if you have a problem with an individual, you need to take it to the BBQ Pit. Next person to discuss in this thread whether **ElvisL1ves** or anyone else is debating in good faith gets a Warning. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/316 "2019-01-22T13:48:20Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > It seems counter-intuitive but I’ve wondered whether our increased reliance on instant reply and challenges (in baseball and football) has made the actual real-time officiating and umpiring worse. It does sometimes seem like the game officials are conscious of it, and will often let a play continue when in the past they’d have whistled it. It would be even more helpful if the replay official were authorized to call penalties that weren’t called on the field, especially obvious ones like in the Saints loss (I’m pretty sure college rules let him call targeting). In baseball, replay should have permitted an Out call on Galarraga’s perfect game too, for that matter. But it takes too damn long for the microscopic frame by frame analysis that predominates now. That has to speed up, too, and let more calls stand as is. The intent was never to make officiating perfect, just to provide a way for the most obvious wrongs to be righted. It still isn’t going to put the Saints in the Super Bowl. ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/317 "2019-01-22T14:31:24Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > It seems counter-intuitive but I’ve wondered whether our increased reliance on instant reply and challenges (in baseball and football) has made the actual real-time officiating and umpiring worse. It’s not that umps or refs deliberately go out there to nonchalantly call a game but perhaps on a subconscious level, there’s the understanding that “Hey, if I fuck it up, there’s instant replay.” I agree, and I also think that the constant rule changes leave everyone confused as to what is, or is not, pass interference, a catch, roughing, etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/318 "2019-01-22T16:54:27Z")
I did not have a chance to watch the Rams/Saints game and I just now caught up on the highlights. I had heard a little something about a “no call” but not the details. So I’m super late to the party on this but HO-LY SHIT was that 10x worse than I expected. :eek: In general, I think complaining about officials is about 95% sour grapes, but WOW this was a bad one. Maybe the worst no call I’ve ever seen, and it happens in a critical part of the field at a critical time in a game that decides who goes to the Super Bowl. Just an absolute choke by the officials. My deepest sympathies to Saints fans. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/319 "2019-01-22T18:42:13Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > I did not have a chance to watch the Rams/Saints game and I just now caught up on the highlights. I had heard a little something about a “no call” but not the details. So I’m super late to the party on this but HO-LY SHIT was that 10x worse than I expected. :eek: > > In general, I think complaining about officials is about 95% sour grapes, but WOW this was a bad one. Maybe the worst no call I’ve ever seen, and it happens in a critical part of the field at a critical time in a game that decides who goes to the Super Bowl. Just an absolute choke by the officials. My deepest sympathies to Saints fans. I watched those highlights again last night…you’re right. It’s an EGREGIOUS non-call, and the kicker is the fucking ref was standing RIGHT THERE near them and had a full view of what happened. Insanity. And gee, I wonder who’s going to win the Super Bowl? ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008/320 "2019-01-22T20:16:19Z")
[And now a New Orleans lawyer is suing the NFL to replay the end of the game](https://nypost.com/2019/01/22/nfl-sued-over-blown-call-during-nfc-championship-game/). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-playoffs-2018-edition/827008.md?page=17)