# NFL toughens stance on domestic violence **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 29, 2014, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845 "2014-08-29T10:18:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2014, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/41 "2014-08-29T22:38:11Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I think it’s nice that you think the NFL took a careful and balanced look at the facts in this case, decided in its Solomonic wisdom that a two-week suspension was the just solution- even though they were almost immediately forced to admit they fucked up and adopt much harsher penalties than the ones they had chosen to impose on Rice. I doubt they were that thoughtful. I think they decided a two-week suspension would satisfy the public because it would send the message that the NFL took this seriously. It did not and does not. I remember the complete and utter freak-outs on the sports talk shows and ESPN immediately after the announcement. I’m sure you do to. You’re asserting that one of the most media savvy business on the planet calculated their decision solely to get the best media reaction and missed it by THAT much? Sorry, that defies belief. I think Occam’s razor is with me on this one. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2014, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/42 "2014-08-30T02:12:21Z")
Because the NFL has done such a great job handling the concussion issue and the name of one of their franchises. No, they couldn’t possibly fumble a PR situation. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2014, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/43 "2014-08-30T02:42:39Z")
Or consider the total cluelessness of the Ravens’ response: having Rice read a prepared statement where he apologized for “this situation” and actually said “Failure is not getting knocked down; it’s not getting up” before his wife apologized for her part in the incident where he knocked her unconscious. An NFL team thought this was really good PR! Of course it’s possible the NFL thought a two-game suspension sent the message it needed to send. What’s the evidence it _didn’t_ feel that way? The NFL makes these kind of blunders all the time. It just hasn’t paid much of a price for it. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2014, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/44 "2014-08-30T02:59:02Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > They have a few options. > > 1. Keep doing what they are doing, and dictate punishment on non-CBA infractions on a case-by-case basis, learn from past mistakes and re-evaluate in a year or two. > > 2. Have a knee jerk reaction to public outcry and institute a draconian penalty in a fit of damage control. > … > Clearly they fucked up, but choice #2 just flat out compounds the problem without actually doing anything to solve the problem. It’s a PR decision, not a policy decision or reform plan. This reaction is the one that is so over-the-top that it looks like a joke, not the NFL’s. I will say with confidence that u don’t believe that this policy has _any_ chance of “unfairly” subjecting a player to a year 's suspension. This howl of protest is hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2014, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/45 "2014-08-30T03:52:35Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > This reaction is the one that is so over-the-top that it looks like a joke, not the NFL’s. I will say with confidence that u don’t believe that this policy has _any_ chance of “unfairly” subjecting a player to a year 's suspension. This > howl of protest is hilarious. The penalty for a second offense–and it is unclear what exactly “offense” means–is banishment from the league. A player may petition for reinstatement after a year, but reinstatement is not automatic. That’s way too harsh for a misdemeanor conviction, and insane if the NFL’s definition of offense is anything less than a conviction. I’d go with four games for a first misdemeanor conviction, 8 games for a second misdemeanor, and a full season for a felony–with possible escalation to a lifetime ban depending on the severity of the victim’s injuries. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2014, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/46 "2014-08-30T14:28:01Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > That’s way too harsh for a misdemeanor conviction, … The abstract “misdemeanor” means nothing to me in this instance. “Second time caught beating someone up” — I’m fine with the penalty. These are elite professionals who are paid handsomely. I don’t think it’s too much to ask them to avoid beating people up, regardless of the context. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/47 "2014-08-31T03:44:57Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > The abstract “misdemeanor” means nothing to me in this instance. “Second time caught beating someone up” — I’m fine with the penalty. > > These are elite professionals who are paid handsomely. I don’t think it’s too much to ask them to avoid beating people up, regardless of the context. These are 21-22 year old kids, most of whom were nearly parent-less to say nothing of the day-to-day culture of violence that surrounded them. Careful you don’t trip and fall off Mount Pious, there. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/48 "2014-08-31T04:15:41Z")
Mount Pious, seriously? I’m sorry, no. Fucking people up physically outside a legal tackle on the field—whether a domestic violence situation or not—is not an area in which I think the NFL needs to offer much slack. I certainly don’t think a criminal conviction is necessary, so long as it’s reasonably clear what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/49 "2014-08-31T05:07:30Z")
I’m pretty ignorant of this whole affair but is this new system set up so that after a player’s second offense and subsequent suspension is in place, the player can continue playing by “appealing” the suspension? ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/50 "2014-08-31T18:24:44Z")
And… 49ers DE Ray MacDonald is the first player [busted on a domestic violence charge](http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/49ers-defensive-ray-macdonald-arrested-domestic-violence-againast-pregnant-fiancee-article-1.1923046)since the announcement. It’ll be interesting to see a) how fast the NFL reacts and b) if the victim’s pregnancy is the type of aggregating factor that results in a suspension of more than six games. I’m with **Acsenray** on this one - this is just not an area where the NFL needs to soft-pedal. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/51 "2014-08-31T18:37:18Z")
It will be interesting to see how the process works, and how the union reacts. I remain hopeful that the league will not act without a conviction, or at least an admission from the defendant. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/52 "2014-08-31T18:42:54Z")
Under that standard, should Aaron Hernandez be playing for the Pats this season? ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/53 "2014-08-31T18:49:06Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > Under that standard, should Aaron Hernandez be playing for the Pats this season? Can’t play if he’s in jail, which the NFL doesn’t control. Besides which, I think they released him months ago. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/54 "2014-08-31T19:02:55Z")
I had remembered Aaron Hernandez being released on bail, but it turns out that’s incorrect. So, yeah, you’ve got a point on that one. So let’s take a hypothetical example of a player, accused of and about to go on trial for murder, but currently free on bail. What if anything ought the NFL do with respect to that player? If not the NFL, should teams cut and not sign such a player? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/55 "2014-08-31T19:42:21Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Besides which, I think they released him months ago. Hernandez was released by the Patriots two hours after his arrest. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2014, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/56 "2014-08-31T22:41:32Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Or consider the total cluelessness of the Ravens’ response: having Rice read a prepared statement where he apologized for “this situation” and actually said “Failure is not getting knocked down; it’s not getting up” before his wife apologized for her part in the incident where he knocked her unconscious. An NFL team thought this was really good PR! Of course it’s possible the NFL thought a two-game suspension sent the message it needed to send. What’s the evidence it _didn’t_ feel that way? The NFL makes these kind of blunders all the time. It just hasn’t paid much of a price for it. Was what happened on the elevator ever revealed? Everyone assumes he knocked her out and she wasn’t unconscious due to alcohol or something but I didn’t see where that was stated. I say that because the charge as filed does not match NJ law if he did punch her out. And domestic violence is not something you mess around with around here as a responding police officer or a prosecutor. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2014, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/57 "2014-09-01T02:29:16Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Was what happened on the elevator ever revealed? Everyone assumes he knocked her out and she wasn’t unconscious due to alcohol or something but I didn’t see where that was stated. I say that because the charge as filed does not match NJ law if he did punch her out. And domestic violence is not something you mess around with around here as a responding police officer or a prosecutor. According to _Sports Illustrated_ — [http://www.si.com/nfl/2014/02/20/ray-rice-baltimore-ravens-assault-police](http://www.si.com/nfl/2014/02/20/ray-rice-baltimore-ravens-assault-police) — > [@](#): > > Police investigating Baltimore Ravens running back Ray Rice for allegedly knocking his fiancée unconscious at an Atlantic City casino have video evidence of the blow, according to a person with knowledge of the investigation. The New York Daily News — [Police say video shows Ravens’ Ray Rice knocking out fiancee Janay Palmer – New York Daily News](http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/rice-struck-fiancee-rendering-unconscious-police-complaint-states-article-1.1621876) — > [@](#): > > The police complaint says Rice struck her with his hand, “rendering her unconscious.” Palmer is also accused of striking Rice with her hand. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2014, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/58 "2014-09-01T03:34:21Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > According to _Sports Illustrated_ — [http://www.si.com/nfl/2014/02/20/ray-rice-baltimore-ravens-assault-police](http://www.si.com/nfl/2014/02/20/ray-rice-baltimore-ravens-assault-police) — > > The New York Daily News — [Police say video shows Ravens’ Ray Rice knocking out fiancee Janay Palmer – New York Daily News](http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/rice-struck-fiancee-rendering-unconscious-police-complaint-states-article-1.1621876) — Thanks for the links. I know there is video in all AC casino elevators. I’m not sure why it wouldn’t be eventually released. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2014, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/59 "2014-09-02T16:43:28Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Mount Pious, seriously? I’m sorry, no. Fucking people up physically outside a legal tackle on the field—whether a domestic violence situation or not—is not an area in which I think the NFL needs to offer much slack. I certainly don’t think a criminal conviction is necessary, so long as it’s reasonably clear what happened. I assume you would say the same if it was not the spouse/SO being attacked? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2014, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845/60 "2014-09-02T17:16:23Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > why is it the NFL’s job to punish people for domestic violence Because they’re in the entertainment industry, and it’s bad for business to have players being notable for beating the crap out of their WAGs. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-toughens-stance-on-domestic-violence/696845.md?page=2)