# NFL Week 14 **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 8, 2011, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465 "2011-12-08T03:30:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/161 "2011-12-13T05:22:46Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > I’m sad to see that called as pass interference. It may be the right call by the rulebook (I don’t know), but it was great defense - the hand on the shoulder didn’t prevent the receiver from making the catch. I hate to see that penalized. Hope it doesn’t result in a touchdown. > [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > +1. Unbelievable. > > I’m probably biased as a Seattle fan, but I tend to think, regardless of the game I’m watching, that the NFL could do with fewer PI penalties called. It was a great play to bat away the ball, but it was also undeniably pass interference when he grabbed and turned Lloyd with the opposing hand. It was also a somewhat savvy play because it’s the type of subtle thing that often gets missed, especially when the WR isn’t pulled off balance, but in this case it definitely had to be called. Lloyd couldn’t elevate because of the grab and was twisted away from the ball. It’s clear cut, the same play on Calvin Johnson probably doesn’t draw a flag simply because Megatron is so big and strong that the hand wouldn’t have impeded him at all. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/162 "2011-12-13T05:53:27Z")
Wow. James Harrison is really quite the piece of trash isn’t he. He and Suh should go bowling together. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/163 "2011-12-13T06:36:17Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Wow. James Harrison is really quite the piece of trash isn’t he. He and Suh should go bowling together. Did he do something new? ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/164 "2011-12-13T07:35:00Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > It was a great play to bat away the ball, but it was also undeniably pass interference when he grabbed and turned Lloyd with the opposing hand. It was also a somewhat savvy play because it’s the type of subtle thing that often gets missed, especially when the WR isn’t pulled off balance, but in this case it definitely had to be called. Lloyd couldn’t elevate because of the grab and was twisted away from the ball. It’s clear cut, the same play on Calvin Johnson probably doesn’t draw a flag simply because Megatron is so big and strong that the hand wouldn’t have impeded him at all. I disagree - my recollection is that he did not turn the receiver, and that any impact he did have on the receive was immaterial due to being able to bat the ball away. Again, whether or not it was a PI by-the-book or even will “always be called” isn’t my point - my point was that it should not be called, and that football would be more fun if it weren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/165 "2011-12-13T14:49:38Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Did he do something new? [The usual](http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=A2KJ3CVYZedOazEAD01NbK5_?slug=capress-fbn_steelers-15582079) – not only is leading with your helmet in an attempt to injure not worthy of a suspension, it’s not even worthy of a fine. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/166 "2011-12-13T17:00:21Z")
[Take a seat, Harrison](http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=ApvTtgGPiALFG2vb09yW.ONDubYF?slug=ap-steelers-harrison). Five illegal hits in three seasons? Amazing that they were actually able to establish a pattern of behavior! ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/167 "2011-12-13T17:05:40Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > I disagree - my recollection is that he did not turn the receiver, and that any impact he did have on the receive was immaterial due to being able to bat the ball away. Again, whether or not it was a PI by-the-book or even will “always be called” isn’t my point - my point was that it should not be called, and that football would be more fun if it weren’t. You do realize that his batting the ball away is completely irrelevant. That’s not a tipped ball scenario. By your logic a DB could run over a WR so long as he tips the ball away in the process. That not how the rules work, regardless of what you think would be more fun. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/168 "2011-12-13T17:08:30Z")
> [@Hal\_Briston](#): > > [Take a seat, Harrison](http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=ApvTtgGPiALFG2vb09yW.ONDubYF?slug=ap-steelers-harrison). Five illegal hits in three seasons? Amazing that they were actually able to establish a pattern of behavior! I think 1 game is horribly light. I’m starting to think the NFL needs to adopt the NHL policy where you’re out as long as the player who you injured during the illegal play is. Jason Babin should be out for the season for what he did to Russell Okung and Harrison should be out as long as McCoy is. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/169 "2011-12-13T19:21:57Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > +1. Unbelievable. > > I’m probably biased as a Seattle fan, but I tend to think, regardless of the game I’m watching, that the NFL could do with fewer PI penalties called. Am I the only who who feels that entire sections of the NFL rulebook need a serious re-write? I realize that the powers that be love the idea of a higher scoring league but the way they’ve hamstrung defensive backs and pass rushers is also creating a game that seemingly is constantly interrupted by one flag after another. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/170 "2011-12-13T19:27:43Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Am I the only who who feels that entire sections of the NFL rulebook need a serious re-write? > > I realize that the powers that be love the idea of a higher scoring league but the way they’ve hamstrung defensive backs and pass rushers is also creating a game that seemingly is constantly interrupted by one flag after another. Um, nothing has changed with regards to PI calls at all. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/171 "2011-12-13T19:55:28Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Um, nothing has changed with regards to PI calls at all. You honestly don’t feel that in the last two years the advantage has shifted so far towards the receiver that it makes covering them without drawing a flag pretty difficult? The rules may not have changed but the enforcement of them sure seems a whole lot stricter. Then you have the whole dust up as to whether or not a receiver had control of the ball when going out of bounds. Wish I could remember who the color guy was a couple weeks back who admited that he didn’t even understand the damn rule. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/172 "2011-12-13T20:11:18Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > You honestly don’t feel that in the last two years the advantage has shifted so far towards the receiver that it makes covering them without drawing a flag pretty difficult? > > The rules may not have changed but the enforcement of them sure seems a whole lot stricter. > > Then you have the whole dust up as to whether or not a receiver had control of the ball when going out of bounds. Wish I could remember who the color guy was a couple weeks back who admited that he didn’t even understand the damn rule. Not in the least. It’s confirmation bias. Teams throw the ball more and therefore get more calls, but proportionally it’s probably the same. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/173 "2011-12-13T20:15:08Z")
I’ve been watching a bit more non-Packer games recently and I’ve been seriously unimpressed with the quality of play this tear. Maybe it’s the offseason, maybe it’s cyclical, but it seems there are a lot of bad teams out there. And a lot of teams playing badly. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/174 "2011-12-13T20:21:37Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I’ve been watching a bit more non-Packer games recently and I’ve been seriously unimpressed with the quality of play this tear. Maybe it’s the offseason, maybe it’s cyclical, but it seems there are a lot of bad teams out there. And a lot of teams playing badly. Injuries seems worse. Far more key players have gone down it seems. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/175 "2011-12-13T20:23:47Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I’ve been watching a bit more non-Packer games recently and I’ve been seriously unimpressed with the quality of play this tear. Maybe it’s the offseason, maybe it’s cyclical, but it seems there are a lot of bad teams out there. And a lot of teams playing badly. Doesn’t seem all that unusual from other years. There’s been a tons of injuries on many of the playoff-contending teams in the last several weeks. That could be a contributing factor. I saw a note that Jacksonville has put 27 players on IR this season. That’s more than half a roster. Not that I thought they’d contend this year, but that many injuries plus a rookie QB is bound to make for bad football (except for the exceptions - like Houston, oddly enough). Scheduling is also weird. At least in the AFC, most of the playoff contenders have had relatively easy schedules in the back half compared to the beginning of the season. The games aren’t so exciting, unless you’re a fan of the team or there’s playoff implications. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/176 "2011-12-13T20:49:35Z")
There are clearly more pass interferance calls now than three years ago. The reasons for this may have to do with the increase in man to man. [http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8242fc95/printable/pass-interference-holding-penalties-on-the-rise-in-the-nfl](http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8242fc95/printable/pass-interference-holding-penalties-on-the-rise-in-the-nfl) ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/177 "2011-12-13T20:56:03Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > I think 1 game is horribly light. I’m starting to think the NFL needs to adopt the NHL policy where you’re out as long as the player who you injured during the illegal play is. Jason Babin should be out for the season for what he did to Russell Okung and Harrison should be out as long as McCoy is. I am seriously out of touch with the NHL, but that is actually a pretty good rule, assuming that it only applies to illegal plays. The thing is, Harrison will do this again. It’s just the way he plays. I doubt it would help at all, but maybe the NFL should have some kind of “how to tackle” training. ---
**Author:** ![Kiros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/439d5e/32.png) [@Kiros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiros)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/178 "2011-12-13T21:12:17Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > There are clearly more pass interferance calls now than three years ago. The reasons for this may have to do with the increase in man to man. > > [http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8242fc95/printable/pass-interference-holding-penalties-on-the-rise-in-the-nfl](http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8242fc95/printable/pass-interference-holding-penalties-on-the-rise-in-the-nfl) It started after the '03 playoffs, when Bill Polian and the Colts lobbied (we’ll be nice and avoid “whined”… doh!) the league for an emphasis on DB/receiver contact. It kicked up again after '08 or so for… not sure really? Because they saw how much money they could make with an offense like Brady/Moss/Welker/etc running wild? ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/179 "2011-12-13T21:54:07Z")
> [@Kiros](#): > > It kicked up again after '08 or so for… not sure really? Because they saw how much money they could make with an offense like Brady/Moss/Welker/etc running wild? Yeah, don’t know. IMHO there is a concerted effort to make this even more of a pass first league. Big plays are popular with (casual) fans and the more big plays, the more people watching. Purists may love ball control and 80 yard drives that last ten minutes but a lot of people find it boring. Just my opinion. I may be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465/180 "2011-12-13T22:23:39Z")
My predicted sequence of events: 1. Seneca Wallace starts for the injured Colt McCoy 2. Seneca Wallace does well, beats Arizona, and looks like a real NFL offense in the process 3. Which proves that McCoy was really holding the team back because it looked so much worse with him 4. However, winning that game puts us ahead of 6 or 7 4-win teams, eliminating our chances to get one of the top quarterbacks in the draft. _headdesk_ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-14/605465.md?page=10)