# NFL Week 4 - RIP Mike Heimerdinger **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [October 2, 2011, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328 "2011-10-02T04:14:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/61 "2011-10-03T02:48:48Z")
> [@Brandon](#): > > However, from what I am seeing, most are are claiming the call was incorrect. Why is that? Not a loaded question, I’m just trying to understand better. Is it just one of those rules that is pretty subjective and should be improved? The controversy could be that no official blew a whistle. Even if you “give yourself up,” you haven’t officially done so until an official blows a whistle signalling a dead ball. When Cruz let go of the ball, it was officially live and should have been a fumble. As Omniscient indicated, the “giving up” probably wasn’t very convincing, hence no whistle. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/62 "2011-10-03T02:53:53Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > The controversy could be that no official blew a whistle. Even if you “give yourself up,” you haven’t officially done so until an official blows a whistle signalling a dead ball. When Cruz let go of the ball, it was officially live and should have been a fumble. I haven’t heard any commentator make that case, but it’s a good one if true. However the refs in the game didn’t allow the Cards to challenge it which implies to me that a whistle was blown. ---
**Author:** ![Brandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f08c70/32.png) [@Brandon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brandon)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/63 "2011-10-03T02:55:36Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > The controversy could be that no official blew a whistle. Even if you “give yourself up,” you haven’t officially done so until an official blows a whistle signalling a dead ball. When Cruz let go of the ball, it was officially live and should have been a fumble. As Omniscient indicated, the “giving up” probably wasn’t very convincing, hence no whistle. That would make sense, but I have no idea when the whistle was blown. I’m surprised that isn’t a bigger part of the conversation. On edit: Good point, **Omniscient**. Maybe it isn’t part of the conversation because it was clearly blown. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/64 "2011-10-03T03:04:28Z")
Some random Twitter comments form the ESPNChicago guys. **ESPNChiBears Dickerson and Wright** Laughed when told this in locker room: ‘We were hitting Steve Smith so hard. But he would get up and just yell at us. It was weird, man.’ JD **ESPNChiBears Dickerson and Wright** Here’s a cool Bears stat: Matt Forte on pace for 2,536 all-purpose yards. That is amazing. JD And one from Simmons: **sportsguy33 Bill Simmons** Sanchez and Flacco should just start flinging poop at each other. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/65 "2011-10-03T03:08:20Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > I haven’t heard any commentator make that case, but it’s a good one if true. However the refs in the game didn’t allow the Cards to challenge it which implies to me that a whistle was blown. Yeah, I’m just theorizing, taking a guess trying to answer **Brandon** ’s question about a controversy existing. I have no idea whether a whistle blew or not. Can’t tell in the YouTube video. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/66 "2011-10-03T03:08:20Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Some random Twitter comments form the ESPNChicago guys. Honestly, if I was interested in reading the Twitter comments from the ESPN guys, couldn’t I just go find them myself? ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/67 "2011-10-03T03:19:35Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Honestly, if I was interested in reading the Twitter comments from the ESPN guys, couldn’t I just go find them myself? What the fuck is your problem? ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/68 "2011-10-03T03:30:49Z")
A few years back I recall speculating that Detroit might be forced by idiots into skipping Calvin Johnson in the draft, because they’d receive mockery from everyone (and scorn from fans) about drafting yet another WR in the first, regardless of the fact that their other ones were out of the league, with other teams, or useless. Well, Detroit managed to make the smart move that looked dumb to idiots, and it’s really paying off. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/69 "2011-10-03T04:14:31Z")
Dandy Andy Dalton (aka Ninja Ginga, Ginger Jesus, Red Rifle, etc) with a nice 2nd half to seal the Bengals win over the Jills…and I have to say that the AFCN is a really strong defensive division this season so far…offenses have been all over the place by all four teams. And the Bengals D is legit…if the offense can develop some consistency over the course of the season they will be dangerous going forward. Posting from the three-way tie that is the AFCN basement at 2-2… Fucking Ratbirds… ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/70 "2011-10-03T04:17:46Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Honestly, if I was interested in reading the Twitter comments from the ESPN guys, couldn’t I just go find them myself? This post should have been deleted under category 1 in [this thread you started.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=626496) :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/71 "2011-10-03T11:40:35Z")
Through four games the AFCN is indeed the best defensive conference in the NFL. Check it out: [NFL 2023 REG - offense passing stats](http://www.nfl.com/stats/team) The top three overall NFL defenses through four games in order are Cincinnati, Pittsburgh and Baltimore. None of the teams appears as a statistical leader on offense. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/72 "2011-10-03T11:56:53Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > Through four games the AFCN is indeed the best defensive conference in the NFL. Check it out: [NFL 2025 REG - offense passing stats](http://www.nfl.com/stats/team) > > The top three overall NFL defenses through four games in order are Cincinnati, Pittsburgh and Baltimore. None of the teams appears as a statistical leader on offense. And now they get to play each other’s poor offenses, so their defensive stats will really impress!!! ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/73 "2011-10-03T12:03:04Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > What the fuck is your problem? You quoted three different twitter feeds that were meaningless with no context, and with no content of your own. If the goal of the thread is to offer up random twitters from sportswriter, fine, I’ll stay out of it. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/74 "2011-10-03T13:20:29Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > And now they get to play each other’s poor offenses, so their defensive stats will really impress!!! To be fair, it isn’t like the AFCN teams have played all crappy offenses so far this season. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/75 "2011-10-03T14:24:45Z")
Nominee #1 for Sandy Vagina of the Year: Arizona defensive tackle Calais Campbell (bolding of exceptionally laughable statement mine) > [@](#): > > “It hurts because we thought it was a fumble and it should be our ball, and then we probably win the game. Then you get caught up in the emotion and they line up and throw a deep ball. **They took advantage of our emotions**.” ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/76 "2011-10-03T14:45:07Z")
On the Cruz play, I saw post game comments from Eli Manning, and he seemed to think they got away with one on the call. After watching the video, I think he’s right. I would have ruled it a fumble…I see no obvious “giving himself up”. I see the receiver stumble, I see no one touch him, I see no “down by contact”, and I see him inexplicably abandon the football. If I was his coach, he’d be running laps from now until Hell freezes over. ---
**Author:** ![RetroVertigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b38774/32.png) [@RetroVertigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RetroVertigo)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/77 "2011-10-03T14:47:48Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > No. That contest is for 0-16. The Eagles have already lost that race (by winning). Minnesota, St. Louis, Miami, and Indianapolis (!) are the only teams competing. To be fair St. Louis and Minnesota have both invested high draft picks on QB’s the last two years. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/78 "2011-10-03T15:12:07Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > I see the receiver stumble, I see no one touch him, I see no “down by contact”, and I see him inexplicably abandon the football. It’s actually quite explicable why he abandoned the football. Because he had given himself up and went to the ground and was down. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/79 "2011-10-03T15:17:38Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > It’s actually quite explicable why he abandoned the football. Because he had given himself up and went to the ground and was down. As Plaxico proved many years ago, that doesn’t always matter. The refs had a judgment call to make, and no matter which way it went someone was getting screwed. It seems like a bad call now, though, because you get guys like Eli going before the cameras with a shit-eating grin talking about how they got away with one. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2011, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328/80 "2011-10-03T15:36:31Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > It’s actually quite explicable why he abandoned the football. Because he had given himself up and went to the ground and was down. I assume that’s what he thought he was doing. It did not appear to be what he actually did, as I see it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-4-rip-mike-heimerdinger/598328.md?page=5)