# NFL Week 9 **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 2, 2018, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874 "2018-11-02T02:10:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/41 "2018-11-06T13:07:34Z")
The NFL just flexed the 11/18 Vikings/Bears game to 8:20, and then the Bears play again on 11/22 at 12:30 PM. How is this fair to Chicago? They will have 3.5 days between the end of week 11 and the start of week 12. That’s insane. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/42 "2018-11-06T13:21:52Z")
Well, I think you can stick a fork in Dallas because they are done, done, done. After basically forcing Tony Romo into retirement with a brilliant rookie season, Dak Prescott has been very ordinary at best. Despite the fact that the NFC east is pretty mediocre, Dallas will have to struggle just to finish .500. Their next five games are Eagles, Falcons, Redskins, Saints, and Eagles. If they lost ALL of those games, I wouldn’t be shocked. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/43 "2018-11-06T13:48:35Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > OK that makes sense. And the articles I’m reading this morning do call it intentional grounding, so it makes me wonder why they sometimes were calling it a delay of game penalty? (Which would only be five yards, not ten, anyway, right?) What I don’t understand is that apparently nobody knows if the clock is supposed to start after a declined penalty when the ball stayed in-bounds. I assumed it would, and I assume Mahones did as well, and that’s why he spiked it. In any case, the NFL timing rules are all screwed up. Among other things, a team should not be penalized because of an official review. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/44 "2018-11-06T14:09:12Z")
My understanding is that the clock stops after any play with a penalty ends as this is an official time out. The clock is restarted at the next snap. If I’m wrong on this I’d be very interested in hearing how it really works. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/45 "2018-11-06T14:30:36Z")
Often in a situation where stopping the clock could be a greater advantage than yardage lost from a penalty (such as a situation where there is less than a minute left before the half or end of a game) there could be a ten second runoff, to discourage that tactic. Of course it’s pretty complicated like many rules in football. > **[Here’s how football’s 10-second runoff rule works](https://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2016/10/12/13204822/10-second-runoff-rule-ncaa-clock-penalty-injury)** > > This rule is designed to prevent a team from gaining an unfair late advantage. It requires three things to happen. I’ve seen multiple times in games this year where officials seem confused about how much time should be on the clock when a penalty occurs and/or when it should have stopped and when it should have started again, and delays while they try to figure it out. More often than I remember in recent years. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/46 "2018-11-06T15:12:41Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > IIRC the rule for intentional grounding says a player can only spike the ball to stop the clock. Since the clock wasn’t running - intentional grounding. I missed this play, but why wasn’t the clock running? If the ball was snapped, the clock should start, right? And then the QB spikes it to immediately stop the clock. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/47 "2018-11-06T16:11:21Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I missed this play, but why wasn’t the clock running? If the ball was snapped, the clock should start, right? And then the QB spikes it to immediately stop the clock. The point is that “clocking” the ball (throwing a spike into the ground immediately after a snap) is only allowed when the clock was running prior to the snap. When the clock is not running prior to the snap, there’s no reason to clock the ball, because you aren’t losing time by huddling up and deciding what the next play will be. From what I read, the main confusion seems to be that a) Intentional Grounding as a penalty is supposed to be called only when done to avoid a rush, but b) “clocking” the ball is only allowed under the grounding rule to stop a running clock. So, if intentionally spiking the ball to stop a clock is only excepted from the rule when the clock was running prior to the snap, possibly the rule writers intended that the intentional grounding rule apply to someone who spikes it when the clock was NOT running. But, by MY thinking, all that spiking the ball in that situation should involve is people pointing at the quarterback and saying, “Man, sucks to be you right now; why did you do that??” The “penalty” for doing that is that you lose a down for no good reason. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/48 "2018-11-06T17:21:14Z")
I agree. It’s a dumb play, but it shouldn’t really be a penalty because the offense certainly doesn’t gain any benefit by clocking the already stopped clock. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/49 "2018-11-06T17:26:52Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I agree. It’s a dumb play, but it shouldn’t really be a penalty because the offense certainly doesn’t gain any benefit by clocking the already stopped clock. It’s a weird penalty just because no one carved out an exception for it. The exception under Intentional Grounding is: > [@](#): > > Item 3. Stopping Clock. A player under center is \*\*permitted to stop the game clock legally to save time \*\*if, immediately upon receiving the snap, he begins a continuous throwing motion and throws the ball directly into the ground. No one thought to add an exception for “spiking the ball when you thought the clock was running.” ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/50 "2018-11-06T18:15:22Z")
But there are times where the clock starts on the referee’s whistle before the snap. I assumed that was what was supposed to happen. And if a penalty is an official time out and doesn’t restart the clock, in my opinion an official review shouldn’t allow for a runoff as a possible consequence. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/51 "2018-11-06T18:33:47Z")
That’s right. The ref will set the ball, get out of the way, blow the whistle and cartwheel his right arm. At that time the game clock starts running. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/52 "2018-11-06T19:06:57Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The NFL just flexed the 11/18 Vikings/Bears game to 8:20, and then the Bears play again on 11/22 at 12:30 PM. How is this fair to Chicago? They will have 3.5 days between the end of week 11 and the start of week 12. That’s insane. It’s not, but the only fair I care about in Chicago happened in 1933. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/53 "2018-11-06T19:26:44Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The NFL just flexed the 11/18 Vikings/Bears game to 8:20, and then the Bears play again on 11/22 at 12:30 PM. How is this fair to Chicago? They will have 3.5 days between the end of week 11 and the start of week 12. That’s insane. The worst part is that during the 3.5 days between games, they have to travel. It’s only to Detroit, but still, having to travel during a 3.5 day week is a bummer. Though I suppose it could be worse: At least the 11/18 game is in Chicago. Imagine if they started that 3.5 day week in some other city and had to fly back on a red-eye. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/54 "2018-11-06T19:29:02Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > It’s not, but the only fair I care about in Chicago happened in 1933. I was talking with a member of our curling club last night, and he noted that he once stopped dating a woman rather than marry her, simply because she was a Packers fan, and he was from Chi-town. Says he regrets nothing about the decision, either. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/55 "2018-11-06T22:35:26Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > I was talking with a member of our curling club last night, and he noted that he once stopped dating a woman rather than marry her, simply because she was a Packers fan, and he was from Chi-town. Says he regrets nothing about the decision, either. 😛 I’ll be honest, football season when I lived in Chicago tended to be a lonely time for me. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874/56 "2018-11-07T02:45:28Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > I was talking with a member of our curling club last night, and he noted that he once stopped dating a woman rather than marry her, simply because she was a Packers fan, and he was from Chi-town. That is not the curling way. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-9/823874.md?page=2)