# NFL Week One good turn deserves another **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** football-nfl\ **Created:** [September 3, 2021, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058 "2021-09-03T18:06:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/121 "2021-09-14T15:26:05Z")
> [@3AxisCtrl](#): > > Hunter Renfrow understood, and fell on the ball. But Humphrey never really had possession, so the result - incomplete pass - was the correct one (setting aside likely DPI). Right. And even if he’d had possession, tossing it on the ground would have been a fumble, recovered by Renfrow. I wonder if that would have given them the 1st down? (I don’t remember where they were on the field or the distance to first, just that it was 3rd down) Thanks for confirming I’m not the only person who caught that. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/122 "2021-09-14T15:28:38Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Thanks for confirming I’m not the only person who caught that. Certainly nobody on the field had. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/123 "2021-09-14T15:28:58Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I wonder what their odds against the Lions are next week? Weeellllll… IF Green Bay was playing in Detroit I might actually like the Lions chances, but the Lions historically do terrible at Lambeau. Also the Lions have an old tradition of bringing new life and hope to demoralized teams, soooo… 😟 (Yes, I know past performance should theoretically have no bearing on the present, especially since the Lions are in a major rebuilding season. But the trends I mention somehow have persisted across many coaching and personnel changes. It’s like a curse). ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/124 "2021-09-14T15:32:40Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Right. And even if he’d had possession, tossing it on the ground would have been a fumble, recovered by Renfrow. I wonder if that would have given them the 1st down? (I don’t remember where they were on the field or the distance to first, just that it was 3rd down) I believe a double change of possession resets you to 1st & 10, regardless of where you were. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/125 "2021-09-14T15:49:43Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > I believe a double change of possession resets you to 1st & 10, regardless of where you were. As does a single change of possession, of course. Any change of possession becomes a new set of downs for whichever team has the ball. So you’re entirely correct. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/126 "2021-09-14T16:37:17Z")
> [@solost](#): > > …the Lions are in a major rebuilding season. How could you tell? ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/127 "2021-09-14T20:11:41Z")
Lions + season = rebuilding season. There aren’t a lot of variables here. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/128 "2021-09-14T20:32:54Z")
I don’t watch ESPN much, and didn’t last night, so I missed it until [nfl.com](https://www.nfl.com/videos/best-of-peyton-and-eli-manning-from-mnf-week-1) put up the highlights, but Peyton and Eli Manning were calling the game last night. And, judging only from the highlights shown, it sounds like a blast. From Eli mocking Peyton’s massive forehead and need for special helmets to drop ins by Charles Barkley, murder-accomplice Ray Lewis, and Travis Kelce it was quite interesting. I’d hate to put money inn ESPN’s pocket, but it sounds like fun to watch. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/129 "2021-09-14T20:45:53Z")
Yeah, they were on an alternate feed on ESPN+ and on ESPN2. Considering the game, that was probably more fun than the “main” crew on ESPN. The Mannings are contracted for 10 games this season to do alternate commentary for MNF, so 9 more of these. They had a bunch of set piece skits but those fell mostly flat. It got better in the second half when they focused a little more on the football side and left the comedic bits as just bits and not the main attraction. Kind of like they were former NFL QBs and not former comedians. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/130 "2021-09-14T21:20:12Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > The Bears go beat because our defense could not stop their offense. Stafford surgically took us apart. Now that he is surrounded by talent, he is showing that he is one of the league’s top quarterbacks. Let’s slow down a little here. The Bears secondary, especially the safeties, are utterly inept. Lots of mediocre QBs would have had great success throwing bombs to WRs who didn’t have a defender within 10 yards. Take away those two TD passes of 55+ yards and the Rams offense wasn’t better than the Bears. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/131 "2021-09-14T21:30:21Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > To be fair that’s how the Seahawks have been for the past decade too, except that Russell Wilson has traditionally been dismissed as a “game manager” (that narrative has finally started to change the last few years, That is one spectacular straw man you’ve created. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/132 "2021-09-14T21:33:51Z")
I agree, coaches can’t be engaging with players like that. But if you think that was an accidental stomp, I have a bridge to sell you. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2021, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/133 "2021-09-14T21:35:17Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > That is one spectacular straw man you’ve created. Try Googling “russell wilson game manager” and you’ll see that I didn’t build that straw man. And note that the narrative has changed dramatically of late, you don’t see much talk like that later than 2018. But that was definitely his reputation because the Legion of Boom and Marshawn took the spotlight for a while. Why don’t you read this article, it might help you out: > **[The Evolution of Seattle Seahawks QB Russell Wilson](https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/12/5/18126856/russell-wilson-seattle-seahawks-offensive-evolution)** > > The Seattle passer has mastered his craft this season, taking a roster lacking star power and turning it into a playoff contender. As the Seahawks near a postseason berth, it’s become clear Wilson has cemented his place in the league’s top QB tier. That’s just a small sample. Again, Google will help you. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2021, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/134 "2021-09-15T00:52:02Z")
Definitely, it’s not like there’s a video of Harrison trying to step over CEH, missing and hitting his knee, then stumbling or anything. Try watching the video I linked at 22 seconds. It’s not exactly a gray area. ETA: I was wrong in saying the coach was on the field. Harrison still was, the coach was not. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2021, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/135 "2021-09-15T03:30:26Z")
There’s plenty of stupid NFL takes. You can literally find the terms game manager used in discussion of any NFL QB. Including Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. In 2018 Wilson was the selected to his 5th Pro Bowl. Led the NFL in passer rating in 2015. Finished in the top 10 nine times. In 2014 and 2015 finished in the top 10 in long passes. Was in the top 10 eight times in yards per pass attempt and yards per pass completion. He was in the top 4 of OPOY voting in 2013 and 2015. He threw for 4200 yards in 2016. And lead the NFL in TD passes in 2017. And he quarterbacked back-to-back Super Bowl teams (he had a better passer rating than Brady when he won the MVP). Calling Wilson a game manager at any point of his career after his first Super Bowl appearance is not supported by the tape or the status for any rational interpretation of the word. And being a highly productive QB on a team that happens to have a good defense and running game does not fit the criteria except for hack journalists. Edit: Richard Sherman’s pettiness also doesn’t qualify as conventional wisdom, for the record. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2021, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/136 "2021-09-15T04:08:29Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > There’s plenty of stupid NFL takes. You can literally find the terms game manager used in discussion of any NFL QB. Including Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. Okay, then show me. I showed you mine, you show me yours. Back up your assertions if you’re going to get unnecessarily aggressive and start accusing me of making things up. You said I put up a straw man, prove it. Here is The Guardian, a hack newspaper going by your words, talking about the Super Bowl winning QB Wilson. > **[Yes, Russell Wilson is a game manager. He might also be the NFL's best...](https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/dec/15/russell-wilson-game-manager-seattle-seahawks-nfl)** > > Seattle no longer has the No1 defence, and their offensive weapons are bad. Yet the Seahawks QB has found new ways to keep winning – and that’s why he’s so good Yes it’s praising him but keeping the narrative going. A narrative which was already ridiculous at that point, as you admit to and I appreciate. > **[Russell Wilson is killing it in the best start of his career](https://12thmanrising.com/2019/10/03/russell-wilson-best-start-career/)** > > The Seahawks are off to a fine start at 3-1. There's no doubt it's mostly because Russell Wilson is off to the absolute best start of his career. I mean, clearly, I’m making this up. I’m pulling it out of nowhere. It’s time for you to back down. This was a nice thread until you decided to get huffy and start throwing around baseless accusations. Just drop it already. I could pull these out all day because I’ve been reading them for years. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2021, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058/137 "2021-09-16T16:09:57Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Take away those two TD passes of 55+ yards and the Rams offense wasn’t better than the Bears. With no ground game as a threat, Stafford was 20 of 26 for 321 yards, 3 TDs, zero interceptions, and a QB rating of 156.1. In any case the 16 remaining games should render judgment regarding how good he is and how much he improves the team. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nfl-week-one-good-turn-deserves-another/950058.md?page=6)