# NightRabbit-When did you realize, vis-a-vis other kids, that you are a piece of shit? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 28, 2008, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096 "2008-03-28T20:11:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/261 "2008-04-01T23:15:57Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] The US not actually comitting the act, yes. The US knowing it was going to happen and did nothing cannot be disproven. [/QUOTE] Whether or not it did is nevertheless a matter of _fact_. Either it did or it didn’t. I really don’t think you are trying very hard here. I’m not trying to be a smartass. But you aren’t even responding to what people actually say. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/262 "2008-04-01T23:17:47Z")
[QUOTE=Roadfood] But the statement, “The US government was involved in bringing down the twin towers” is a statement whose truth value absolutely, positively does **NOT** depend on whether you actually believe that. If you believe it with all your heart and soul, it’s still totally false. See the difference? [/QUOTE] **NightRabbit** didn’t say that, though. She said > [@](#): > > As someone who is extremely suspicious of the information we’ve been spoonfed about 9/11 - hardly a ringing endorsement of 9/11 conspiracy theory. She went on to say: > [@](#): > > I’m not going to hijack this thread with 9/11, but a couple interesting, conglomerative sites are [http://www.911truth.org/](http://www.911truth.org/) and [http://www.ae911truth.org/](http://www.ae911truth.org/) > > I’m not 100% behind these people, but the whole thing gives me pause. I think a lot of the circumstances behind 9/11 seem suspicious and coincidental… > > …It doesn’t mean I’m going to call “conspiracy” and rally the troops and go crazy, it just means I’m agnostic about the whole thing. This hardly qualifies me, or anyone else, as a nutjob. [my parsing] Again, a far cry from what she’s been/being accused of. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/263 "2008-04-01T23:20:32Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] If she had not dismissed the 184 who died at the Pentagon so cavalierly, and had not linked to truther cites, and had not continued to debate while claiming not to, and had not mealy-mouthedly hidden (as do you) behind her right to an opinion, she may not have been Pitted. But she did, and she was. [/QUOTE] She didn’t _dismiss_ them. She didn’t know they were there. That may speak poorly of her reading comprehension, but she’s hardly earned the group tar-and-feather treatment she got. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/264 "2008-04-01T23:21:10Z")
Before Watergate was proven, someone holding the theory that it was true could have been labled an idiot for believing something _incredible_, as at one point there was no _credible_ evidence that it was anything other than a break-in. Then credible evidence surfaced. See why that’s not a good argument? And she erred about the dead, but did not disparage them. She said they were unimportant, and of course that was miscontrued- most correctly took that to mean unimportant to the top brass, same as the Iraq soldiers are personally unimportant- no Bush family members on the frontline. Just pawns in the game, same as any dead on 911 would THEORETICALLY be. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/265 "2008-04-01T23:21:52Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] She didn’t _dismiss_ them. She didn’t know they were there. That may speak poorly of her reading comprehension, but she’s hardly earned the group tar-and-feather treatment she got. [/QUOTE] No, she plainly said that by “vacant” she meant “vacant of bigwigs.” ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/266 "2008-04-01T23:22:45Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Post 243 has a paragraph addressed to you, sorry for not linking your post 🙂 [/QUOTE] That response in no way answers any of my questions, merely asserts the right to ignore questions when they are inconvenient. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/267 "2008-04-01T23:25:58Z")
[QUOTE=Bryan Ekers] That response in no way answers any of my questions, merely asserts the right to ignore questions when they are inconvenient. [/QUOTE] I have no legitimate response to your questions, because I don’t believe those things happened. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/268 "2008-04-01T23:27:39Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Before Watergate was proven, someone holding the theory that it was true could have been labled an idiot for believing something _incredible_, as at one point there was no _credible_ evidence that it was anything other than a break-in. Then credible evidence surfaced. See why that’s not a good argument? [/QUOTE] I’m sorry to say this, but fuck you for misrepresenting my words _yet again_, you worthless bag of shit. I said had _no credibility_, not \*no \*_credible evidence._ Have you no shame at all? It is almost incredible to me that you continue to compare the Watergate break-in with the idea that our government allowed 9/11. The comparison is moronic. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/269 "2008-04-01T23:29:51Z")
Anyone who starts spouting about how we have been ‘spoonfed’ information about 911 and then cites some of the worst crank-prone websites is hardly ‘agnostic’ about the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/270 "2008-04-01T23:30:45Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] No, she plainly said that by “vacant” she meant “vacant of bigwigs.” [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > …the fact that it just _happened_ to hit a completely vacant section of the structure so that no government officials, nor important files/computers/information, were harmed. And given that she is clearly arguing her point from the position of the Administration/conspiracists, what does that tell you about _her_ opinion of Pentagon underlings? It’s pretty obvious that if there _were_ some great conspiracy at play, the conspirators would need to kill a few innocents in order to inflame the public. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/271 "2008-04-01T23:32:47Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Miskatonic] When the fuck did “complete chaos” = “impeding collapse”? How did you get to that end of things? Is this your level of logic? You have implied that I was an idiot for saying something I did not say. I’d like an apology, please. [/QUOTE] Gotta an explanation for your distortion yet, **Wee Bairn**? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/272 "2008-04-01T23:37:57Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] And given that she is clearly arguing her point from the position of the Administration/conspiracists, what does that tell you about _her_ opinion of Pentagon underlings? It’s pretty obvious that if there _were_ some great conspiracy at play, the conspirators would need to kill a few innocents in order to inflame the public. [/QUOTE] I don’t follow. Run that by me again, please. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/273 "2008-04-01T23:40:58Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] I don’t follow. Run that by me again, please. [/QUOTE] Okay. She was suggesting that the conspirators (presumably the Administration) lost no critical assets (to their way of thinking) in the Pentagon crash, just some “expendables”- again, “expendables” to _their_ way of thinking, not her own. ---
**Author:** ![Roadfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@Roadfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roadfood)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/274 "2008-04-01T23:41:50Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] **NightRabbit** didn’t say that, though. [/QUOTE] But **Wee Bairn** , in making the analogy between what she did say and the statement of preference of Van Halen over Van Hagar, implied that one should be entitled to hold any opinion about the facts of 911, just as one is entitled to hold any opinion about the relative merits of one rock group over another. That is simply not the case. One is entitled to hold any opinion about music because opinions about music reside solely in the realm of personal judgment. However, one does not **not** have the same entitlement to hold any opinion about something that lives in the realm of fact. “The Earth is flat, that’s my opinion, and I’m entitled to it.” No, sorry, I’m not, because “the Earth is flat” is factually wrong. **NightRabbit** did not merely say she had some doubts about the facts of 911, she went on to enumerate some of those doubts. And those enumerations are factually incorrect, therefore her doubts have no basis in fact, and therefore her doubtful opinion is not one she is entitled to hold. I’m not saying she can’t have that opinion, since she obviously does, but what **Wee Bairn** refers to as her opinion can be shown to be wrong, in a way that an opinion that Van Halen is better than Van Hagar cannot. That’s what I mean by “not entitled to hold the opinion”. The opinion is just wrong, period. Is the difference between an opinion about music and an opinion about facts really that hard for you to distinguish? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/275 "2008-04-01T23:45:56Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] Okay. She was suggesting that the conspirators (presumably the Administration) lost no critical assets (to their way of thinking) in the Pentagon crash, just some “expendables”- again, “expendables” to _their_ way of thinking, not her own. [/QUOTE] Has she offered that as an explanation? If so I missed it. And if in fact that was her meaning, I apologize for misconstruing it. ---
**Author:** ![Roadfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@Roadfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roadfood)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/276 "2008-04-01T23:52:00Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] [my parsing] Again, a far cry from what she’s been/being accused of. [/QUOTE] Your parsing left out an important part: [QUOTE=NightRabbit] at the bottom of it, I really don’t trust that, if the Bush administration could send 4000 troops off to die for their agenda in Iraq, I don’t see how it’s so impossible that they would sacrifice however many more that died in the WTC in order to predicate a reason to go into the area to begin with. All the evidence that the government was warned about air attacks into NYC years before the attacks happened **and yet still didn’t realize or respond** to what happened until the planes actually hit. The fact that the guys who hijacked the planes were educated at US air bases. The fact that a plane could be flown into an important office building in washington and happen to hit the newly constructed area that isn’t yet fully staffed or operational. [/QUOTE] Bolding mine. As I’ve said before, that seems to me to very clearly indicate that she believes a) that the government absolutely knew, without a doubt, about the attacks beforehand, and b) people in the government consciously choose to let it happen. As opposed to the reality which is that a) some parts of some intelligence agencies may have had some hint of the possibility of some kind of an attack, and b) either suffered from the normal problem of which of the hundreds of reports to believe, or just had trouble believing that such a plan could be reality. In other words, she can more easily believe a grand conspiracy than simple human fallibility. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/277 "2008-04-01T23:53:11Z")
[Argument from ignorance](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance) ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/278 "2008-04-01T23:54:44Z")
[QUOTE=ouryL] [Argument from ignorance](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance) [/QUOTE] Good link. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2008, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/279 "2008-04-02T00:04:50Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] You can prove who won the 1975 Super Bowl… [/QUOTE] Hell, for all anyone knows the Vikings really beat the Steelers back then and there’s been a massive conspiracy to hide the truth. Granted, it makes no logical sense, there’s no evdience for it and there’s a truckload of evidence against it, but those minor considerations don’t seem to bother you regarding 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2008, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096/280 "2008-04-02T04:50:13Z")
[QUOTE=Roadfood] Regarding post 155: I believe in the basic tenant of this board, which is to fight ignorance. I don’t believe that that tenant should be tempered based on which sub-area of the board a posting is made in. When someone professes a belief in something that is patently, demonstrably absurd, it is the duty of other posters to challenge that belief. I agree that the particular way it was handled in this case was overly heavy-handed, but that doesn’t excuse NightRabbit’s initial espousal of rampant ignorance. Two wrongs still don’t make a right. [/QUOTE] Consider how important the censuses are to government planning. Consider how less accurate the census would be if people knew that could be published with names attached. While I can accept a little gentle chiding in IMHO about goofy views, this over the top reaction here actively disables any “fight against ignorance” by making it hide away. These retards who believe in the “kaplin method”, or whatever the fuck, of trying to scare people into hiding their beliefs are completely deluded. Do they really think “quiet” racists/bigots/conspiracists are neutralized? Do they really think pretending/faking these people aren’t actually out there is a good intelligent thing? Fuck those shitheads. And as I implied in my comments to Cisco, a bunch of them are really just a bunch of jackasses looking for a safe subject to feel superior about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nightrabbit-when-did-you-realize-vis-a-vis-other-kids-that-you-are-a-piece-of-shit/443096.md?page=15)