# No big deal, right? She wasn't your daughter **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 18, 2009, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194 "2009-10-18T02:35:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Myself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8491ac/32.png) [@Myself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myself)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/1 "2009-10-18T02:35:26Z")
There are no words foul enough, nor in sufficient quantity to even faintly begin to describe, much less explain, the festering mental and moral sickness of, and the mad-dog inhumanity shown by, those even remotely involved in this ghastly, hideous, nauseating atrocity. The physical evidence is documented. Haliburton/KBR does nothing. (As if I’m surprised by that!) And people on the golden thrones of power simply shrug and eat their caviar. The mothers, sisters and daughters of those cowardly and inhuman scum involved in this vile act, as well as the women in the lives of the Neo-cons that plotted, pushed and perpetrated this unconscionable “elective” war, plunged the nation into monstrous debt, defiled America’s principles and ideals, in perpetuity; and let Haliburton/KBR run fearlessly amok (on so many occasions!) without so much as a whimper of protest, must be so very, very proud of their children. (And not much can be said for those who know and do nothing!) Just what does one have to do to be found guilty of war crimes? Or even ‘simple’ rape? **Senate passes measure prompted by case of woman prevented from suing over alleged rape by Halliburton/KBR colleagues** “When she awoke the next morning still affected by the drug, she found her body naked and severely bruised, with lacerations to her vagina and anus, blood running down her leg, her breast implants ruptured and her pectoral muscles torn‚ which would later require reconstructive surgery. Upon walking to the rest room, she passed out again,” the papers say. Jones was treated by a US army doctor who gave forensic evidence to company officials.” > **[Rape case to force US defence firms into the open](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/oct/15/defence-contractors-rape-claim-block)** > > Senate passes measure prompted by case of woman prevented from suing over alleged rape by Halliburton/KBR colleagues **The gang rape and the Republicans** “The most repellent part is the 30 U.S. senators – Republicans each and every one – who just stepped forth to vote against the Franken amendment, essentially saying no, women should have no right to sue if they are sexually abused or gang raped, Halliburton and its ilk must be protected at all costs, and by the way we hereby welcome Satan into our rancid souls forevermore. God bless America.” [http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2009/10/16/notes101609.DTL](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2009/10/16/notes101609.DTL) ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/2 "2009-10-18T02:51:11Z")
Where do the non-white Iraqi and Afghani women go when they get gangraped? There, I out liberalized you. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/3 "2009-10-18T02:58:42Z")
Yes, because denouncing rape has a liberal bias. ---
**Author:** ![Myself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8491ac/32.png) [@Myself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myself)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/4 "2009-10-18T03:37:25Z")
What if the article read like this: “When **marshmallow** awoke the next morning still affected by the drug, **marshmallow** found **marshmallow’s** body naked and severely bruised, with lacerations to **marshmallow’s** [sex organ] and anus, blood running down **marshmallow’s** leg, … and \*\*marshmallow’s \*\*pectoral muscles torn‚ which would later require reconstructive surgery. Upon walking to the rest room, **marshmallow** passed out again,” the papers say. **marshmallow** was treated by a US army doctor who gave forensic evidence to company officials. **marshmallow** says the firm placed **marshmallow** under guard in a shipping container and **marshmallow** was released only after **marshmallow’s** father asked the US embassy to intervene. When the forensic evidence was handed to investigators two years later, crucial photographs and notes were missing. Does that make any difference to you? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/5 "2009-10-18T03:52:22Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Yes, because denouncing rape has a liberal bias. It does. Conservatives have never had any concern for the rights or safety of women. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/6 "2009-10-18T04:08:49Z")
wrong thread ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/7 "2009-10-18T04:12:00Z")
To be far, it wasn’t exactly a vote for or against brutal gang rapes. It was a vote on whether or not to prohibit the federal government from doing business with companies that enforce binding arbitration clauses in certain cases, including but not limited to discrimination and sexual harassment cases. > [@](#): > > Sec. 8104. (a) None of the funds appropriated or otherwise made available by this Act may be used for any existing or new Federal contract if the contractor or a subcontractor at any tier requires that an employee or independent contractor, as a condition of employment, sign a contract that mandates that the employee or independent contractor performing work under the contract or subcontract resolve through arbitration any claim under title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 or any tort related to or arising out of sexual assault or harassment, including assault and battery, intentional infliction of emotional distress, false imprisonment, or negligent hiring, supervision, or retention. It is possible to support binding arbitration in such cases without actually being in favor of gang rapes. Now that I’m done being fair: Employers should not be able to arbitrarily require people to give up basic civil rights as a condition of employment. The fact that they are allowed to do so shows that too many of our judges and legislators are tools of the people with money and power. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/8 "2009-10-18T04:15:41Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > It does. Conservatives have never had any concern for the rights or safety of women. False. Nine Republicans voted for the amendment. ## I honestly thought that something like this wouldn’t be controversial, even today. Methinks those 30 are off the deep end. ## A Jon Stewart vid contains clips of Senator Sessions justifications for his no vote: [Jon Stewart Takes On 30 Republicans Who Voted Against Franken Rape Amendment (VIDEO) | HuffPost Entertainment](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/15/jon-stewart-takes-on-30-r_n_321985.html) Not to pick on TWDuke, but one of the 30 could have offered an amendment if they thought Franken’s treatment was too broad, though it seemed to me to be reasonably narrowly crafted. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/9 "2009-10-18T04:24:37Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > False. Nine Republicans voted for the amendment. > > I honestly thought that something like this wouldn’t be controversial, even today. Methinks those 30 are off the deep end. 30 is many more than 9. Those 9 represent the fringe ( or face a threat in the next election from the left ); the 30 represent the conservative norm. That’s why they outnumber the 9. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/10 "2009-10-18T04:30:55Z")
> [@Myself](#): > > Does that make any difference to you? No. I’m just being an asshole and pointing out the only reason this is even brought up is because it’s been fairly well publicized because she’s “one of us.” No one gives a shit about the natives we gang rape. Not that I do, really – monkey sphere and all that – but it’s something to keep in mind. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/11 "2009-10-18T05:15:29Z")
I seem to recall a story about a certain series of images supposedly from a video of an Iraqi woman being gang-raped by U.S. troops being circulated by the Boston Globe and CBS News. It later turned out to be complete bullshit, the photos actually taken from a porn movie (which would have been obvious to anyone who knew that our troops in Iraq do not wear obsolete BDU uniforms in the “Woodland” pattern besides.) The brazen fraud was originally posted on the website of an “AZTLAN” group (Mexican supremacists and deluded crackpots) yet that didn’t stop people from taking it seriously and making a big fuss over it. If nobody gives a shit about that, why did I hear about it? Why was it posted on the SDMB? Why did two major news sources run with it? ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/12 "2009-10-18T05:17:59Z")
Tell us of these cases of gang rapes of Iraqi women by Americans that we all just glossed over. Tell us about the non-white women who were gang raped by employees of the Federal government, imprisoned by her attackers, then had their company protect her attackers. Tell us about those. ---
**Author:** ![Myself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8491ac/32.png) [@Myself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myself)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/13 "2009-10-18T05:32:40Z")
> [@](#): > > No. I’m just being an asshole and pointing out the only reason this is even brought up is because it’s been fairly well publicized because she’s “one of us.” No one gives a shit about the natives we gang rape. Not that I do, really – monkey sphere and all that – but it’s something to keep in mind. If it’s well publicized, doesn’t that mean someone _quite possibly cares?_ Are you really saying that since we can’t stop all rapes, we shouldn’t bother worrying about the ones we can stop? Really?! Google ‘rape counseling’ and see how many people don’t care about the victims and stopping this particular abuse of human beings. At the top of the page you will see this: **Results 1 - 10 of about 494,000 for rape, counseling.** And how–_exactly_–do you know _who I am_ or _what I’ve done_…or what has happened to someone I happen to love very fucking much? Your self-description is noted. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/14 "2009-10-18T05:50:41Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Tell us of these cases of gang rapes of Iraqi women by Americans that we all just glossed over. [Here’s one](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings) Four American soldiers broke into an Iraqi family’s house, gang raped a 14 year old Iraqi girl, them murdered her, along with her entire family (including her 6 year old sister) and burned the bodies. This got very little media attention. Sean Hannity sure never talked about it. I agree with everything the OP said. Halliburton is truly corrupt and evil, as are the political meat puppets who succor them, and it’s absolutely indefensible and disgusting that a single person voted pro-gang rape on the Franken bill ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/15 "2009-10-18T07:27:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > [Here’s one](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings) > > Four American soldiers broke into an Iraqi family’s house, gang raped a 14 year old Iraqi girl, them murdered her, along with her entire family (including her 6 year old sister) and burned the bodies. This got very little media attention. Sean Hannity sure never talked about it. I have no idea what Hannity did or didn’t say. I don’t watch or listen to his shows (and I bet you don’t either) but if you are seriously saying that case got very little media attention, you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. That got TONS of media attention! ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/16 "2009-10-18T08:05:00Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > 30 is many more than 9. Those 9 represent the fringe ( or face a threat in the next election from the left ); the 30 represent the conservative norm. That’s why they outnumber the 9. Here’s the roll call: > **[U.S. Senate: U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 111th Congress - 1st Session](https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1111/vote_111_1_00308.htm?congress=111&session=1&vote=00308)** > > roll\_call\_vote.xml The evidence doesn’t contradict Der’s characterization, with some exceptions. Here are 30 opponents of the Franken amendment: Alexander (R-TN) Barrasso (R-WY) Bond (R-MO) Brownback (R-KS) Bunning (R-KY) Burr (R-NC) Chambliss (R-GA) Coburn (R-OK) Cochran (R-MS) Corker (R-TN) Cornyn (R-TX) Crapo (R-ID) DeMint (R-SC) Ensign (R-NV) Enzi (R-WY) Graham (R-SC) Gregg (R-NH) Inhofe (R-OK) Isakson (R-GA) Johanns (R-NE) Kyl (R-AZ) McCain (R-AZ) McConnell (R-KY) Risch (R-ID) Roberts (R-KS) Sessions (R-AL) Shelby (R-AL) Thune (R-SD) Vitter (R-LA) Wicker (R-MS) Here are the decent 10 (I miscounted earlier). The first group are moderate or in competitive races (off the top of my head) or female. Collins (R-ME) Grassley (R-IA) Hutchison (R-TX) LeMieux (R-FL) Lugar (R-IN) Murkowski (R-AK) Snowe (R-ME) Voinovich (R-OH) These guys are conservatives who appear to be burdened with a conscience. Bennett (R-UT) Hatch (R-UT) ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/17 "2009-10-18T08:05:16Z")
Yes - as soon as he posted that link and description, immediately the name “Mahmoudiyah” popped into my head and the face of Steven Green - and I don’t even follow the news that closely. That case was all over the news. When that soldier was convicted, it was a big deal. The whole thing got a lot of coverage. Bad example to use if you’re trying to argue that it was “glossed over.” Far from it. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/18 "2009-10-18T08:13:25Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Here are the decent 10 (I miscounted earlier). The first group are moderate or in competitive races (off the top of my head) or female. > Collins (R-ME) > Grassley (R-IA) > Hutchison (R-TX) > LeMieux (R-FL) > Lugar (R-IN) > Murkowski (R-AK) > Snowe (R-ME) > Voinovich (R-OH) > > These guys are conservatives who appear to be burdened with a conscience. > Bennett (R-UT) > Hatch (R-UT) Grassley and Lugar aren’t known as conservatives? I’m Hoosier, been voting for Lugar in every election, and have never heard, even in my Birch years, that he should be replaced by a “real conservative”. Thanks for this, btw. I was looking for a list of the Republican yeas and found the link to the Senate site via a liberal blog. Of course, I noticed plenty of liberal-to-lefty blogs quite willing to list the 30 bad Repubs votes but none that actually would list the 10 good ones. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/19 "2009-10-18T09:28:40Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > Grassley and Lugar aren’t known as conservatives? I’m Hoosier, been voting for Lugar in every election, and have never heard, even in my Birch years, that he should be replaced by a “real conservative”. This stuff is debatable and tricky to characterize. Let me give my thinking. Yeah, in my view all current Republican Senators are conservative.\* But Grassley may be facing a tough re-election fight. And Lugar is serious and sane in foreign policy-- he’s not a fire-breather in that regard. I thought that the votes of Hatch and Bennett were interesting. - This was not always the case. Lowell P. Weicker, Jr. was moderate. Bob Dole was very conservative, but he also believed in cutting deals. There even used to be a creature known as a liberal Republican: Jacob Javits was one example. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194/20 "2009-10-18T13:02:19Z")
> [@Myself](#): > > What if the article read like this: > > "When **marshmallow** awoke the next morning still affected by the drug, **marshmallow** found **marshmallow’s** body naked and severely bruised, with lacerations… > > Does that make any difference to you? A little bit. I’d heard of out of body experiences before but none that could be used as evidence in a court of law. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-big-deal-right-she-wasnt-your-daughter/514194.md?page=2)