# No German beer in Amsterdam, no Stella Artois in Brussels. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** beer\ **Created:** [September 1, 2017, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220 "2017-09-01T03:01:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/41 "2017-09-04T04:33:45Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > I didn’t ask for them. I just noticed that neither were present. Did you look for them in bottles? The Dutch pubs I was looking at earlier all seemed to have Becks on the bottle list, but not on draft. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/42 "2017-09-04T04:36:20Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Have you seen Heineken in the UK? While I almost always prefer ales in the UK, I’ve only seen Amstel when I’ve been at a bar that only has lagers available. It’s always been Amstel, kronenbourg 1664, Carling, Fosters, along with perhaps a cider, London Lager, Brewdog Punk IPA, or some similar beers. FWIW, in 5 years living in Central and Eastern Europe (mostly Hungary), I don’t ever recall seeing Beck’s around. The typical German draft beers were HB, Warsteiner, and Bitburger, for the most part. I’m sure it must have been around somewhere in bottles, but I don’t recall seeing it. (Perhaps surprisingly, Corona was everywhere, though.) Then again, I didn’t notice it in Germany the dozen times or so I’ve been there, so I may just have a blind spot for it. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/43 "2017-09-04T14:15:28Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > In Brussels I was stunned to find very few bars/restaurants/stores selling Stella Artois. I like it, but once again, wouldn’t have drank it there as I can get it in over abundance here. There are plenty of places in Brussels which sell Stella Artois. Perhaps it isn’t sold quite as much in the pure tourist areas around the Grand Place. There is also a definite push to sell expensive high strength tourist beers around the tourist areas too. I lived in Brussels for three months, and there were plenty of places which sold Stella, as well as Jupiler, Maes and Primus. Also note, that Stella is brewed differently in different countries. In Belgium it is far less gassy than the horrible stuff they sell in the UK, a country which is very fond of overgassing their lagers. Stella is called “wifebeater” in the UK. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/44 "2017-09-04T14:56:26Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > There are plenty of places in Brussels which sell Stella Artois. Perhaps it isn’t sold quite as much in the pure tourist areas around the Grand Place. That’s the other thing I was wondering. If you go to the hip (and even some not-so-hip) bars in Chicago, you might not even notice the existence of Bud or Miller if you don’t ask for it. They certainly won’t be on tap, but they generally (or something similar like PBR) will be available in bottles. Of the bars I regularly frequent, I can only think of one that has an American macro on tap, but they all have bottles of something. (Of course, I self-select the bars I go to, and they tend to be bars with good beer and/or whiskey selections.) That said, you can usually see spot someone drinking an MGD, unless you’re specifically at a brewpub. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/45 "2017-09-04T15:14:08Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > Stella is called “wifebeater” in the UK. Because of Marlon Brando? ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/46 "2017-09-04T15:19:23Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Because of Marlon Brando? Because of it’s relatively high alcohol content. :o ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/47 "2017-09-04T15:29:49Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Because of it’s relatively high alcohol content. :o I’d be very surprised if Brando doesn’t have something to do with it — [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/S1A0p0F_iH8/hqdefault.jpg "Marlon Brando ~ 'Hey Stella!'~ A Streetcar Named Desire") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1A0p0F_iH8) ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/48 "2017-09-04T16:34:21Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I’d be very surprised if Brando doesn’t have something to do with it — > > [https://youtu.be/S1A0p0F\_iH8](https://youtu.be/S1A0p0F_iH8) It has to do with Chav culture. They would know nothing of an old b&w film. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/49 "2017-09-04T16:40:38Z")
Offtopic, but the Scots have a tradition of naming alcohol, especially of an overstrong nature. Eldorado, a fortified wine favoured by hobo’s/tramps/bum’s in Scotland has a number of names: A bottle of “Batterthewife” or “Electricsoup” or “Whothef\*\*kyoulookingat?” My favourite name is for monk brewed caffinated fortified wine, Buckfast, which I’ve known as simply: A bottle of “goodmorningyourhonor”. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/50 "2017-09-04T17:08:30Z")
[quote=“Smid, post:43, topic:795220”] There is also a definite push to sell expensive high strength tourist beers around the tourist areas too. I did notice that a lot of the beers offered in Brussels restaurants/bars/stores had ABV’s far in excess of 6%. Many being over 8%. > [@Smid](#): > > Also note, that Stella is brewed differently in different countries. In Belgium it is far less gassy than the horrible stuff they sell in the UK, a country which is very fond of overgassing their lagers. Stella is called “wifebeater” in the UK. 2 years ago I noticed in Rio that most of the Brazilian beers were way over carbonated. I never thought about it being a cultural thing. I have over 950 ratings on Ratebeer.com if anyone actually gives a hoot what I think. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/51 "2017-09-04T17:31:30Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > It has to do with Chav culture. They would know nothing of an old b&w film. They could have picked it up from someone who did know. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/52 "2017-09-04T17:36:43Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > [I did notice that a lot of the beers offered in Brussels restaurants/bars/stores had ABV’s far in excess of 6%. Many being over 8%… I’ve noticed this also with IPA’s in the United States. More worryingly, the ABV is often not on the pump, or the menu, so you don’t know you’re drinking a 8.9% beer. When I’ve mentioned this before on here, people have insisted that the beer ABV is usually publicised clearly in bars. Yet, as someone who doesn’t want a drink over 5.5%, I’ve had trouble with this in: San Diego, Vegas, Los Angeles, Santa Monica, San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, Reno, Stateline Tahoe, Phoenix, Page, Denver, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Washington, yes, pretty much everywhere I’ve been in the states. I guess I must be unlucky. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/53 "2017-09-04T17:56:50Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > They could have picked it up from someone who did know. And an African swallow could carry a coconut by its husk. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/54 "2017-09-04T18:23:30Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > I’ve noticed this also with IPA’s in the United States. More worryingly, the ABV is often not on the pump, or the menu, so you don’t know you’re drinking a 8.9% beer. > > When I’ve mentioned this before on here, people have insisted that the beer ABV is usually publicised clearly in bars. Yet, as someone who doesn’t want a drink over 5.5%, I’ve had trouble with this in: San Diego, Vegas, Los Angeles, Santa Monica, San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, Reno, Stateline Tahoe, Phoenix, Page, Denver, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Washington, yes, pretty much everywhere I’ve been in the states. I guess I must be unlucky. That is odd. At bars here that are likely to sell high abv beer on tap, the typically mention not only the ABV, but also what size glass (and sometimes what type) they’re served in. I’m pretty sure even places like Buffalo Wild Wings will have ABVs on the menu. I quite often want to keep the ABV down, so I look out for these things. A regular IPA should not be 8% or over. Those are almost all invariably imperial or double IPA, and they are NOT served in pint glasses. You can make a reasonable guess as to your ABV by the glass you’re served beer in. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/55 "2017-09-04T20:38:23Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > I’ve noticed this also with IPA’s in the United States. More worryingly, the ABV is often not on the pump, or the menu, so you don’t know you’re drinking a 8.9% beer. > > When I’ve mentioned this before on here, people have insisted that the beer ABV is usually publicised clearly in bars. Yet, as someone who doesn’t want a drink over 5.5%, I’ve had trouble with this in: San Diego, Vegas, Los Angeles, Santa Monica, San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, Reno, Stateline Tahoe, Phoenix, Page, Denver, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Washington, yes, pretty much everywhere I’ve been in the states. I guess I must be unlucky. Sounds like you want to focus on “session” IPAs. Traditionally sub 4%, now as high as maybe 6%. Much of the IPA flavor, I also find that the aren’t hop bombs. I haven’t noticed this problem in those cities that I’ve been to. Breweries put their ABV front and center. Other places might require you to check a paper menu. But any place that only serves macrobrews might not know the ABV. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/56 "2017-09-04T21:27:21Z")
For examples, [here’s the menu of a local watering hole in Cicero, Illinois, that I frequent](https://www.beermenus.com/places/1382-cigars-and-stripes-b-b-q-lounge). It’s not exactly a hipster bar (it’s in Cicero, for one), but it is a bar that takes pride in beer and barbecue. All their beers have the ABV listed, and all the drafts served in pint glasses are under 8% ABV. The only one that is higher (well, at 8%, and is labeled as a double IPA) is served in a 13 oz snifter. Their cheap beer of choice happens to be Hamm’s. While most of their draft beers do reside in the 5.5%-7% territory, they do have a 3.5% beer on tap (!). Now, your average macrobrew bar that has one or two taps of something more crafty on tap will not have ABVs on their menu (if they even have a menu.) With those, you can generally assume the macros are around 5% abv, with the light beers 4.2%-ish. And the crafts are probably going to be not much higher than 6 or 7%. Places like that tend to have something like a Sierra Nevada or a Lagunitas IPA or just plain old Goose Island beers on tap around here, as a gratuitous tap for those who don’t like macros. I tend not to drink craft beers at places like this, but rather go for the macros, as those crafts (at least in my experience) do tend to sit around for awhile. But any bar that is a “beer bar,” at least around here, will have ABVs listed. And even places like [Hooters](https://www.yelp.com/biz_photos/hooters-mishawaka?select=K6w2QtA5X-tQJej26EiIJw) will have it on their menu, so it’s not just esoteric beer bars everywhere. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/57 "2017-09-05T00:18:58Z")
> [@polar\_bear](#): > > So a few things to consider. > > In the Netherlands (and as far as I know, Belgium and Germany as well), people drink a lot of local beer and this is reflected even stronger in the beer that is served in bars. What you typical lager is concerned, Amsterdam is very much Heineken centered (maybe some Amstel as well). In the south it is mostly Bavaria, with some Brand. In the East there is a lot of Grolsch and in some places there is quite a bit of diversity in the lagers you get in different bars. > > Many bars give you the choice between two lagers. If you can get Heineken, you probably can get Brand as well. If you can get Dommelsch, you can mostly get Jupiler as well. This is related to the brewery you do business with. In Holland it is kind of common that bars lease the draft equipment from the brewery, but this does mean that you will have to serve the beer (and other products) that the brewery produces. > > A typical bar will have a handfull choices from draft. Two lagers, a “white beer” (Hoegaarden if it is inbev, Wiekse Witte if it is Heinken… nowadays they might also choose a Germand style Weizen) and two Belgian style beers (Blond, double, triple, bock, etc.). All of this linked to the brewery that does the leasing. > > In addition there will be other bottled beers that you can get. In the majority of bars this will include one or two Weissbeers: Erdinger, Franziskaner, Paulaner etc. > > One reason why there is relatively little German beer in the bars (super markets do carry some), is that there is a consensus that lager is better form draft, than from a bottle. The idea of having a bottle of “normal” beer, when draft is available is kind of unheard of (except for some millenials that suddenly have taken to ordering bottles of Hertog Jan in some cities). > > So people mostly don’t buy bottled lager in bars and the lager that is being served, is linked to the breweries that provide the installations. None of which are German per se. > > btw I don’t think you’ll find much Heineken in Germany either. Pretty much this. There’s just no great need to serve foreign beer in the Netherlands, Belgium or Germany, because what’s typically served is GOOD local beer. And the lease/what’s on tap relationship in a pub is the same in Germany. I live in Southern Westphalia, and almost all the pubs have either Krombacher, Veltins or Warsteiner on tap, because that’s all brewed in a 50 km radius from here, most have an Altbier as well and some Weißbiers from a bottle, but travel 50 km south to the Rhineland, and it’s all Kölsch or Alt, respectively, and that’s true for all of Germany. When I first visited Belgium after having hit the drinking age, I marveled at their pubs with often 10-15 local brews on tap, which all were delicious. The Netherlands too have great beer brands (not as good and variable as Belgian or German, but still good), so neither of these countries have the need to offer much foreign beer because the local stuff is good enough. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/58 "2017-09-05T04:53:11Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > When I’ve mentioned this before on here, people have insisted that the beer ABV is usually publicised clearly in bars. It’s somewhat of a newer thing to have the ABV published on the menu, and then that only happens in some fancier or hipster places. You’re average corner bar usually isn’t publishing the ABV even when they have an IPA on a tapper. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/59 "2017-09-05T08:20:46Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > It’s somewhat of a newer thing to have the ABV published on the menu, and then that only happens in some fancier or hipster places. You’re average corner bar usually isn’t publishing the ABV even when they have an IPA on a tapper. I think this is the case. It is perhaps my assumption that everywhere should do this, in the uk it’s always on the pump nowadays, and of course a lot of times in the US the pump is too decorated with gooses or whatever thing, and hasn’t got space for it on there. Plus it’s on the far wall of the bar. The menu, well, it just lists the beer names a lot of times. Terminology doesn’t help too. We don’t have double IPAs, or session IPAs in the uk. Indeed, IPA is a term which had long since gone out of fashion until the US Craft beer fashion started up. The Uk has had a reasonably solid “real ale” industry for forever (with some shakey periods in the 80-90’s when nine different lagers seemed to be knocking out even a single ale). Also habit might help, knowing that Goose Island IPA is 5.9% (definitely on the high end for me), and Lagunita’s is also high at 6.2% is remembered over time, but I’m only over in the US occasionally. Traditionally, an ale would be 3.5-5% in the UK, higher than that and it would be syrupy. Recent technological improvements meant that higher percentages are much more drinkable. However, the US did suffer from lower percentage ales which also happened to taste like crap (Bud and it’s mass produced competitors), so seems to have went the other way in the sense that ABV is more of a sign of authenticity than taste. Another thing to note, is that the high strength Belgian beers became popular around the late 90s too, and the Belgians and many europeans typically are ok with this because they don’t drink them very fast, and could easily only drink one every two hours. This doesn’t work for us UK people and I’ve seen proper destruction with a brit starting the evening with a few Belgian beers (8.5% for Duvel). ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220/60 "2017-09-05T08:46:12Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > In Amsterdam Heineken is everywhere to an absurd ridiculous extreme (I like Heineken but when I’m overseas I like to drink beer I can’t get in the states). But what we didn’t see (in stores nor bars/restaurants) was any German beer. All over Europe you at least see Becks. Didn’t see it anywhere in Amsterdam. Nor any other German brew. Becks is crap. Avoid. > [@BorgHunter](#): > > Wikipedia has [Beck’s as fourth best-selling](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_in_Germany#Brands_and_breweries), now, barely edging out Warsteiner. A good thing, IMO, as Warsteiner is terrible. (I had it on a Lufthansa flight, as it was the only beer they had, and I hated it. Tasted like stale Bud. That a German brewery could make beer worse than American macros caused me great surprise at the time.) Word to the wise: the best German breweries don’t advertise. I have never once seen an ad anywhere for Augustiner, Tegernseer, Andechser, or any of the other really good ones. Weihenstephan does some advertisement, but less for beer and more for its milk products. The only beers that really advertise are the ones that people in the know wouldn’t freely choose - Becks, Wahrsteiner, Mixxery, Desperados… Shit like that. Hell, even if you go to the budget, sub-50-cent-can category, the good one is “5,0”, which also doesn’t advertise (in fact, that’s kind of their gimmick - no ads, no flashy label, just decent, extremely cheap beer in an unassuming single-color can). Please note that the inverse is no guarantee of quality. Nobody is advertising for Perlenbacher, and that’s a good thing. Fuck Perlenbacher. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-german-beer-in-amsterdam-no-stella-artois-in-brussels/795220.md?page=4)