# No more Mother's and Father's Day? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 9, 2001, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843 "2001-05-09T04:39:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2001, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/21 "2001-05-10T13:13:30Z")
For a lot of kids, certain holidays can bring up a lot of feelings. My kid is adopted. Adopted kids (not mine, he is too little) often have very mixed feeling about Mothers’ Day. They mourn the loss of their birthmom. They may feel like she isn’t acknowledged, and if she is, they may feel this to be a betrayal of their adoptive Moms. Should making mother’s day cards be banned…I don’t see any reason to make them in the first place, but if you are going to make them, you need to be prepared for all the issues it raises for kids…those whose moms have abandoned them, those who are adopted, those whose moms have died, those being raised by two dads with no knowledge of their birthmom. Even those who just hate mom right now because she wouldn’t let them wear their pajamas to school. Yeah, life is tough and not fair. But we don’t need to go out of our way to make it more unfair for a seven year old. Some adoptive parents choose to go out of their way to explain these things to teachers at the beginning of the year. Few demand that the school change the ciriculum, but most want some notice so if their kid withdraws (because they don’t always tell you what’s bugging them) it can be addressed. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 10:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/22 "2001-05-11T10:20:31Z")
While I don’t find the concept of “Parent’s Day” all that bad, I think PunditLisa brings up a good point. What next? How far will this thinking take us? Sure, this was just one private school (for now.) But I do find this to be a potentially disturbing trend. We can’t keep getting rid of things that most people enjoy, in order to spare a few peoples’ feelings. Life doesn’t work like that. And since all holidays hold some potential threat to _someone’s_ self-esteem or feelings, why don’t schools refuse to acknowledge them ALL, right now? I mean, that’s where this is heading. ---
**Author:** ![dixiechiq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@dixiechiq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dixiechiq)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/23 "2001-05-11T12:29:12Z")
since kids are forced to go to school, we need to accomodate all of them. why sould we ignore a child’s self-esteem just because she is a minority?? i do think if we are not willing to acknowledge everyone’s feelings about a holiday then it should not be observed at all. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/24 "2001-05-11T13:02:08Z")
\*Originally posted by \*_Yosemitebabe_ > [@](#): > > We can’t keep getting rid of things that most people enjoy, in order to spare a few peoples’ feelings. Life doesn’t work like that. And since all holidays hold some potential threat to someone’s self-esteem or feelings, why don’t schools refuse to acknowledge them ALL, right now? I mean, that’s where this is heading \*\* again, some holidays are mandated by law as ‘legal holidays’ only in the sense of no mail delivery etc. Each of us individually are allowed to express/follow ignore/laud/honor/whatever **any** damned day we want. Any private entity is allowed to do so as well (my dad used to close his business up for ‘baseball’ - my kid brother went to the little league world series). No one is ‘banning’ mothers day. A private school has chosen, as **is their right** to either observe or not observe any ‘holiday’. IMHO this is \*\*not \*\* the begining of the end of modern civilization. this is our system of invididual liberties working at it’s peak. So a school decides not to make cards for mothers day. So what? So even **all** schools decide not to make cards for mothers day? so what? Let’s even take it to an extreme. All schools choose not to ‘celebrate’ any holiday. So? In the case of a public school, they’d be mandated to not have school on certain national and state holidays anyhow. What would be the net effect of ‘not celebrating any holidays’? gee, the kids wouldn’t color pictures of Abe Lincoln in Feb, make construction paper turkeys in November. I don’t see what the fuss is about. ---
**Author:** ![Wrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ee7513/32.png) [@Wrath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrath)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/25 "2001-05-11T14:14:17Z")
> [@](#): > > i do think if we are not willing to acknowledge everyone’s feelings about a holiday then it should not be observed at all. Would you like to give that statement a second thought? By this reasoning, there isn’t one single holiday that should ever be celebrated. Almost anyone can be offended by any celebration of any kind. Are you saying that the masses must all cater to a single individual’s feelings? Watch the South Park Cristmas play. **PunditLisa** is absolutely correct. We have no obligation to honor everyone’s feelings at every moment. A very large portion of life revolves around dealing with disappointment and loss. Not _everyone_ can win, not _everyone_ can be rich, not _everyone_ can get their way all the time, just because they wish it so. Sometimes we must put our feelings aside and act responsibly. One person’s sorrow, while deserving of sympathy, is not the measure of everyone else’s joy. We are not celebrating an event to spite and laugh at the unfortnuate ones; it is extremely selfish, self-centered and childish to force everyone to not be happy and joyful because you might be sad. ---
**Author:** ![Zarathustra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/898d66/32.png) [@Zarathustra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zarathustra)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/26 "2001-05-11T15:16:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Wrath \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > i do think if we are not willing to acknowledge everyone’s feelings about a holiday then it should not be observed at all. > > Would you like to give that statement a second thought? By this reasoning, there isn’t one single holiday that should ever be celebrated. Almost anyone can be offended by any celebration of any kind. Are you saying that the masses must all cater to a single individual’s feelings? Watch the South Park Cristmas play. > > **PunditLisa** is absolutely correct. We have no obligation to honor everyone’s feelings at every moment. A very large portion of life revolves around dealing with disappointment and loss. Not _everyone_ can win, not _everyone_ can be rich, not _everyone_ can get their way all the time, just because they wish it so. > > Sometimes we must put our feelings aside and act responsibly. One person’s sorrow, while deserving of sympathy, is not the measure of everyone else’s joy. We are not celebrating an event to spite and laugh at the unfortnuate ones; it is extremely selfish, self-centered and childish to force everyone to not be happy and joyful because you might be sad. \*\* This thread brings up some painful memories for me, and Wrath is making me feel oppressed. Moderators, I demand that you close this thread at once. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/27 "2001-05-11T19:32:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wring \* > IMHO this is \*\*not \*\* the begining of the end of modern civilization. this is our system of invididual liberties working at it’s peak. So a school decides not to make cards for mothers day. So what? So even **all** schools decide not to make cards for mothers day? so what? Let’s even take it to an extreme. All schools choose not to ‘celebrate’ any holiday. So? Eh. I am not so concerned about what schools choose to celebrate, or acknowledge. But I am concerned about a mindset that says if one person is offended or upset by something, that they get to expect everyone to stop doing it. For instance (this is a way-out one) a friend of mine was studying art, but SUCKED at drawing. (Her talents were elsewhere in the artistic area.) On the other hand, I draw well, and often. This particular friend has many delicate feelings, about many things. Well, I could tell that when I pulled out my sketchbook and drew (which was rather often, I LOVE to draw) that it distressed her to see me drawing with ease. She glowered at me. Should I have put away my sketchbook, since it obviously made her “feel bad”? Where is the cut-off point with this sort of thing? ---
**Author:** ![Wrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ee7513/32.png) [@Wrath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrath)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/28 "2001-05-11T20:01:04Z")
Yosemitebabe, your anecdote is not only right on, but is reminiscent of Saliere’s jealousy over Mozart’s genius. Should the world have been denied Mozart because it hurt Saliere’s feelings? Unfortunately, your delicate friend is too little (emotionally) to deal with someone’s superiority over her own shortcomings. So, shall we all be denied your artistic contributions over her lack of self esteem? Next, of course, will be school dances, which are offensive to… ugly kids without dates, social misfits without friends, poor people who can’t afford to go… This trend of egotistical, selfish and shameless attitudes of “pity poor me” has outlived its welcome. Get over it and get on with it. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/29 "2001-05-11T20:34:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by yosemitebabe \* > \*\*Eh. I am not so concerned about what schools choose to celebrate, or acknowledge. But I am concerned about a mindset that says if one person is offended or upset by something, that they get to expect everyone to stop doing it. \*\* As far as I could tell, the school was acting out of a generalized concern that acitivities geared towards motherss day/fathers day could be better spent in other areas, with the added benefit of not causing those children in other than mom/pop families (who are now the majority, IIRC) distress. this seems to me to be a good thing. > [@](#): > > \*\*For instance (this is a way-out one) a friend of mine was studying art, (snip)that it distressed her to see me drawing with ease. She glowered at me. Should I have put away my sketchbook, since it obviously made her “feel bad”? Where is the cut-off point with this sort of thing? \*\* for me, personally? or society as a whole? My ex-husband used to glower at me when I picked up my guitar (he couldn’t play). I divorced him - worked for me 😃 For society as a whole, I feel that we each should make realistic attempts to not do stuff to single others out for ridicule - as in, don’t point and laugh at the person struggling to make their way up a curb while using a wheelchair. re: the mothers/fathers day thing - no one (I feel I’m repeating myself here) was asking the advertisers to stop advertising “Mothers day sale” or the restaurants to stop putting on mothers’ day banquets (ok, so there was poster here who wanted to do away with them but that’s different). A private entity chose to not celebrate the holiday. My private company doesn’t celebrate Columbus day, either. So what? Doesn’t mean a damn thing. I really wouldn’t have a problem with all schools deciding to do away with ‘holiday themes’ as teaching tools or whatever anyhow, in the interest of furthering education time. Your analogy would be more apt if the situation was the school deciding to do away with awards assemblies and tests, contests etc so that those who didn’t win them wouldn’t feel bad. Since this isn’t the case, I don’t think the analogy works. Again - this is a private entity deciding to **not** bring attention to a date on the calendar that the retailers, calendar makers, restaurants etc have emphasized as being the one day a year we ‘honor our moms’. nothing more incidious than that. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/30 "2001-05-11T20:52:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kayeby \* > I still remember making gifts for Mother’s Day in school, and having a girl sob her eyes out because her mother had recently died. ☹ \*\* Kayeby, I think that teacher missed a golden opportunity. For example, the Order of DeMolay has a ritual called “Flower Talk” which is dedicated to mothers. The person performing the ritual asks those DeMolay present to come and pick up a red flower to present to their mothers. He also indicates the white flowers on the altar for those whose mothers have passed away. These are for the DeMolay to remember her. It’s a nice way to include all those present in a rather touching ceremony. Now the teacher could’ve exercises some imagination and tried to do something along the lines of a montage, or a drawing, or _something_, for that child to show her care for her recently-deceased mother. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/31 "2001-05-11T20:59:58Z")
feel I should clarify : difference between public/private and individual and society. we, as a society **should** act in a manner consistent with displaying respect for all members of said society, some of which behavior may be legislated (ie not allowed to discriminate in hiring based on sex/race etc.). We, as individuals are allowed in our private life to be as demeaning/crass/rude/discriminatory etc. as we wish (understanding, of course, that others may see us as bigots/racists/idiots etc. and choose not to associate with us). So, as a society, we’ve selected certain days to be ‘named’. Some have been elevated to the status of legal holidays - which the government has decreed to be ‘days off work or at least paid more’. Some have been elevated to the status of ‘retailers dream days’. Some have been named, but are relegated to the category of ‘news filler items’ such as “are you aware that today is national eat two artichokes day?”. We, as private citizens are allowed to celebrate or ignore any and or all of the above as matters of personal choice. ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/32 "2001-05-11T22:12:16Z")
I disagree wring, imagine if something as good as the civil war flag was taken down because black people were offended by it? Screw them, why should everyone else have to worry about their feelings? Since there are just a few of them they don’t matter. To me that anology is much more valid than a person who has low self esteem. Mothers day does not produce anything of value, or at least has as much value as the confederate battle flag. Or maybe theres a better one. Most of the kids at my school are christan. We should make the school christan and ignore those offended because of the happiness it causes the rest of the school. > [@](#): > > Next, of course, will be school dances, which are offensive to… ugly kids without dates, social misfits without friends, poor people who can’t afford to go… If you can’t include everyone why should it be a school sponsored activity? You on your own private time have the right to exclude anyone you want. However public schools should not ignore the minority because the majority is happy. [sub]I just don’t see why its egotistical and selfish to care about other peoples feelings[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2001, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/33 "2001-05-11T22:19:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Asmodean \* > \*\*I disagree wring (snip)[sub]I just don’t see why its egotistical and selfish to care about other peoples feelings[/sub] \*\* I read your post 3 times and still am not certain where we’re in disagreement if this last part of your posting is correct and not sarcastic. ---
**Author:** ![dixiechiq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@dixiechiq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dixiechiq)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2001, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/34 "2001-05-13T12:09:44Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Zarathustra \* \*\* > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Wrath \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > i do think if we are not willing to acknowledge everyone’s feelings about a holiday then it should not be observed at all. > > Would you like to give that statement a second thought? By this reasoning, there isn’t one single holiday that should ever be celebrated. \*\* it could mean that, or it could mean we need to rethink celebrating only those that are in concurrence with the majority. for example, xmas. at least when i was in school, we recognized xmas in various ways, but made no mention of equivilent holidays of other religions. so i say, eliminate xmas from school ciriculum or start including others. \*\* > [@](#): > > This thread brings up some painful memories for me, and Wrath is making me feel oppressed. Moderators, I demand that you close this thread at once. \*\* there is a difference. children are forced to go to school. you are not forced to read this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2001, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/35 "2001-05-13T12:22:38Z")
> [@](#): > > I read your post 3 times and still am not certain where we’re in disagreement if this last part of your posting is correct and not sarcastic. Bah, I thought I was being pretty clear. I am in agreement with you wring. Wheres that sarcastic smiley when you need it?🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Wrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ee7513/32.png) [@Wrath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrath)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2001, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843/36 "2001-05-14T13:01:12Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Asmodean \* > I just don’t see why its egotistical and selfish to care about other peoples feelings_\* Sorry, I think you got my meaning backwards. It’s egotistical and selfish to prevent others peoples’ celebratory joy just because you have an emotional difficulty with the celebration. Should every birthday party, for instance, be denied, because some people are now dead and can’t have any more birthday parties? Children honoring their parents should not be viewed as affronting those children without the qualifying parent. Certainly we should all care and be respectful of others’ feelings, but that doesn’t mean the joys of life must come to a halt. And, as **Monty** points out, lemonade can often be made of the lemons. So mote it be, **Monty**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-more-mothers-and-fathers-day/64843.md?page=1)