# No Muslim Pope? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [November 15, 2001, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437 "2001-11-15T02:22:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![yonderboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5e925/32.png) [@yonderboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yonderboy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/1 "2001-11-15T02:22:53Z")
While I don’t want to get involved in the argument over what the Muslims believe, what the Qur’an says, what Islam is, etc., I do want to make a remark about the statement that “there’s no ‘official jihad declarer,’ nor any single leader of the faith akin to the Roman Catholic Pope.” At the moment there is no official jihad declarer (which is why there can be no legitimate jihad) but this is the job of the Sultan, whose role is very closely analagous to that of the Roman Catholic Pope. If I’m not mistaken, there hasn’t been a Sultan since 1909, and the next and final Sultan is Mahdi, the Savior, who is beleived to be on earth at the moment. He is expected to appear suddenly, and the Second Coming of Jesus is expected shortly after Mahdi’s appearance (40 days later?). [http://naqshbandi.org/ottomans/](http://naqshbandi.org/ottomans/) is a good source of info …Incidentally, the Naqshbandi Sufis ( [http://naqshbandi.org](http://naqshbandi.org) ) are the cool Muslims, not the psychos who are so visible lately. peace ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/2 "2001-11-15T02:49:16Z")
And the Staff Report being referenced is [What are the rules for declaring a jihad?](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mjihad.html) ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/3 "2001-11-15T06:35:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by yonderboy \* > At the moment there is no official jihad declarer (which is why there can be no legitimate jihad) but this is the job of the Sultan, whose role is very closely analagous to that of the Roman Catholic Pope. If I’m not mistaken, there hasn’t been a Sultan since 1909, and the next and final Sultan is Mahdi, the Savior, who is beleived to be on earth at the moment. He is expected to appear suddenly, and the Second Coming of Jesus is expected shortly after Mahdi’s appearance (40 days later?). **yonderby** : You’ve keyed in on a very tiny subset of the Muslim community. The beliefs you’ve cited are unique to the Naqshbandi order and are not accepted by the vast majority of Muslims. I agree that they’re an interesting group ( sort of the anti-Wahabis, in a way ), but they’re rather heterodox take on eschatology and religious hiearchy aren’t terribly representative of Islam as a whole. - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/4 "2001-11-15T06:36:15Z")
Goddamit - “their”. Ugh. - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![yonderboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5e925/32.png) [@yonderboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yonderboy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/5 "2001-11-15T14:21:20Z")
The original “they’re” was right! Also, I mistakenly called Mahdi “Savior,” which is what “Christ” means. I think Mahdi means “Rightly-Guided” (i.e. Caliph), and is supposed to be a sort of John the Baptist character, but there’s a good chance I’m wrong. Anyway, it’s a massive subject. There are millions in the Naqshbandi Order, but I guess that’s not such an impressive number compared against the 1 billion+ muslims around the globe… ---
**Author:** ![yonderboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5e925/32.png) [@yonderboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yonderboy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/6 "2001-11-15T14:23:54Z")
wait, no, it’s “their”. english is hard! ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2001, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/7 "2001-11-15T22:40:33Z")
Tammerlane, if you’re going to be pedantic, it really should be … but _their_ rather heterodox take on eschatology and religious hiearchy **isn’t** terribly representative of Islam as a whole. The noun is “take”, with the “and” conjunction between the objects of the preposition “on”. Their take is not representative. The rest are descriptive words. Or I suppose it could be … but they’re **a** rather heterodox take on eschatology and religious hierarchy **and** aren’t terribly representative of Islam as a whole. Which would contribute to yonderboy’s confusion. ---
**Author:** ![yonderboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5e925/32.png) [@yonderboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yonderboy)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2001, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/8 "2001-11-16T01:40:29Z")
nope, then it would become “theirs is a relatively heterodox take… and they aren’t terribly representative.” You gotta get up pretty early in the morning to pull one over on ol’ yonderboy, he he he. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2001, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/9 "2001-11-16T02:12:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Irishman \* > **Tammerlane** , if you’re going to be pedantic, it really should be One “m” dude 😛 . And I _try_ not to be pedantic, since I’m really bad at it. But my instinct towards stupid self-flagellation tends to override other concerns 😉 . - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![yonderboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5e925/32.png) [@yonderboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yonderboy)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2001, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-muslim-pope/93437/10 "2001-11-16T14:15:04Z")
Great, I’m glad we had this talk.