# NO pardons for Trump and his cronies **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777 "2019-09-24T23:31:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/1 "2019-09-24T23:31:40Z")
I’d like to jump ahead a little and talk about after the endgame. Regardless of how Trump’s administration ends, impeachment or election, there is going to be talk of pardons ala Nixon. No. Absolutely not. Assuming that the president has America’s best interests as his priority is what got us here. We can no longer coast along on that assumption. Trump, his family, and everyone in his administration need to be prosecuted for any laws they broke. I’m not interested in comparing it to Soviet purges or similar. The republicans wanted to stir things up and they elected someone whose whole history was as a liar and a conman. I don’t want that to ever happen again. We need to prosecute to the fullest extent of the law, including Treason. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/2 "2019-09-24T23:43:18Z")
If he and/or they are pardoned there will be riots. DC will burn. A lot of cities will burn. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/3 "2019-09-24T23:47:26Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > … We need to prosecute to the fullest extent of the law, including Treason. You know that “treason” has an actual definition, right? It’s not just “orange man bad”. You’ve got to be able to demonstrate the elements of the crime, and you can’t do that, because President Trump’s actions don’t meet the elements of that crime. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/4 "2019-09-24T23:51:41Z")
Well hey. As long as it’s not officially “Treason”, let’s cut the whole Trump family some slack, mkay? ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/5 "2019-09-24T23:56:03Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > Assuming that the president has America’s best interests as his priority is what got us here. We can no longer coast along on that assumption The problem is that Trump supporters COULD NOT care LESS about America’s best interests. Like Trump, they only care about themselves. But yes, don’t throw the book at him, throw the whole library. Other crooks may think twice about running for office. That might save our democracy. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/6 "2019-09-24T23:59:05Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You know that “treason” has an actual definition, right? It’s not just “orange man bad”. You’ve got to be able to demonstrate the elements of the crime, and you can’t do that, because President Trump’s actions don’t meet the elements of that crime. “Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason…” “Adheres to their enemies” would fit a number of his actions. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/7 "2019-09-25T00:36:10Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > “Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason…” > > “Adheres to their enemies” would fit a number of his actions. The Rosenburgs would agree. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/8 "2019-09-25T00:40:56Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > “Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason…” > > “Adheres to their enemies” would fit a number of his actions. Sadly, treason doesn’t apply. “Enemies” in this instance is narrowly defined as people we are at war with. Still plenty of books to throw at him, though. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/9 "2019-09-25T00:46:26Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Sadly, treason doesn’t apply. “Enemies” in this instance is narrowly defined as people we are at war with. Still plenty of books to throw at him, though. > **[What Is Treason?](https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/treason.htm)** > > Treason is a rare, but very serious crime. Learn what it's about and understand terms like "levying war" and "adhering to the enemy." ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/10 "2019-09-25T00:49:31Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Sadly, treason doesn’t apply. “Enemies” in this instance is narrowly defined as people we are at war with. Still plenty of books to throw at him, though. “Narrowly defined” is for suckers. Ask Mitch about changing the rules. Trump and his administration are a cancer. Chemotherapy is advised. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/11 "2019-09-25T00:58:18Z")
Your cite (an excellent one, thank you) states that “The requisite enemy designation typically requires a formal declaration of war.” “Typically requires” doesn’t sound all that set in stone to me. I think once this all shakes out, we are going to have evidence of Trump being under Russia’s influence. His being an idiot doesn’t excuse that. There are a lot of politicians playing fast and loose with international money. This needs to stop. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/12 "2019-09-25T01:02:04Z")
And we’re going to need to look VERY closely at the investment in Moscow Mitch’s neck of the woods by a Russian oligarch. There are way, way too many Russia (Putin) connections with the Republican Party. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/13 "2019-09-25T01:15:49Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > Your cite (an excellent one, thank you) states that “The requisite enemy designation typically requires a formal declaration of war.” > > “Typically requires” doesn’t sound all that set in stone to me. > I think once this all shakes out, we are going to have evidence of Trump being under Russia’s influence. His being an idiot doesn’t excuse that. > There are a lot of politicians playing fast and loose with international money. This needs to stop. The Rosenbergs were convicted of treason in peacetime. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/14 "2019-09-25T01:19:21Z")
Trump 2020: I’m not quite as guilty as George Bluth! ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/15 "2019-09-25T01:27:36Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > The Rosenbergs were convicted of treason in peacetime. Perhaps I should have led with that :D, thank you. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/16 "2019-09-25T01:55:19Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > The Rosenbergs were convicted of treason in peacetime. No, they were not. The ignorance in this thread is getting spread on thick. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/17 "2019-09-25T01:59:47Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > No, they were not. The ignorance in this thread is getting spread on thick. “The Rosenbergs were the first U.S. citizens to be convicted and executed for espionage during peacetime and their case remains controversial to this day.” OK. But I take it you are OK with Trump being prosecuted for all of his crimes, just not treason? Is treason kinda like “collusion” to you? ---
**Author:** ![mjmlabs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mjmlabs/32/69_2.png) [@mjmlabs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mjmlabs)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/18 "2019-09-25T02:01:01Z")
The Rosenbergs were convicted of “Conspiracy to Commit Espionage,” for those of you keeping score at home. Fun Research Project: Who can list all the persons/entities President Donald J. Trump has publicly accused of “treason,” either in spoken remarks or via tweet? Start with the moment he took the Oath to faithfully uphold the Constitution and execute the laws of the USA, back in January 2017. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/19 "2019-09-25T02:02:31Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > No, they were not. The ignorance in this thread is getting spread on thick. If there is a hair, you’re gonna split it, huh? Yes, they were convicted and executed during the Korean war. But they were originally arrested for acts committed in the late 40’s. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-pardons-for-trump-and-his-cronies/840777/20 "2019-09-25T02:03:02Z")
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