# No Severance pay for Officer Wilson **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 1, 2014, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002 "2014-12-01T03:20:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/21 "2014-12-01T18:40:15Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The guy got over half a million dollars in donations from his admirers last I heard, and no doubt will be offered book deals and the like. He’s not hurting. Boy howdy, talk about your blood money. Wonder how he’ll title the book? º Trigger Finger Nation º Just A Regular Guy º Acceptable Losses º Do The Right Thing Oops, that one’s taken already. But… by a black man. So, yanno, in the World Of Officer Wilson, that doesn’t mean a thing. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Simus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@Don\_Simus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Simus)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/22 "2014-12-01T19:17:02Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Huh? Care to elaborate? It is a well known fact that white Americans are intimidated by blacks. Are afraid of them. This fear causes inadequate use of arms. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/23 "2014-12-01T19:32:41Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The guy got over half a million dollars in donations from his admirers last I heard, and no doubt will be offered book deals and the like. He’s not hurting. There are reports the amount is in excess of one million dollars from supporters. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/24 "2014-12-01T19:35:48Z")
Does the “paid administrative leave” eat into his accumulated vacation or PTO balance? Or is it entirely separate? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/25 "2014-12-01T19:45:29Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > Severence pay can be all sorts of things- it can be an incentive to prod someone into leaving voluntarily ( perhaps to avoid layoffs of other people- although that’s usually called a buyout , not severance ), it can be given in exchange for an agreement not to sue after termination . You could even call a payment in lieu of notice severence pay. But paying for accrued leave an overtime is not severence pay - Wilson would have received those payments at some point even if he continued employment. When I left AT&T, I got a buyout for voluntarily quitting, and a separate amount for agreeing not to sue, all of which was distinct from the money I got for my unused vacation - a whole year’s worth of which had arrived two weeks before. Mostly companies don’t do this anymore, since they lose the people they want to keep and keep the people they want to lose. As for Wilson, one wonders if there was some kind of deal about him going quietly in return for not getting indicted. I know they are talking about threats to other cops, but I doubt they will stop just because Wilson is not on the force any more. But I’m probably being paranoid. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/26 "2014-12-01T20:08:31Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > As for Wilson, one wonders if there was some kind of deal about him going quietly in return for not getting indicted. I know they are talking about threats to other cops, but I doubt they will stop just because Wilson is not on the force any more. But I’m probably being paranoid. I would really be skeptical of a deal on indictment. I don’t think the political forces have that kind of sway on grand juries. However, I do think there were conversations with Wilson pointing out that he had become a distraction, a target, etc. And that, within the police industry he would have no trouble getting a job somewhere else. (And of course, there is all the $ flowing to him from the adoring fans (the less said about them the better…)). ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/27 "2014-12-01T20:22:16Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > I would really be skeptical of a deal on indictment. I don’t think the political forces have that kind of sway on grand juries. Grand jury no. Prosecutor, maybe. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/28 "2014-12-01T20:23:52Z")
Do his lawyers expect to be paid out of the donated funds? I think some lawyers take on high-profile cases like this pro bono. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/29 "2014-12-01T21:34:03Z")
I do know. At least for state gov. AFAIK we have never paid anybody off to quit. They’d laugh you out of the room for even suggesting it. There’s a state procedure for firing Classified employees. Starting with written warnings in their personnel file. Non-Classified can be fired with notice at any time. Non-Classified are the administrators and Faculty. Classified are office workers and physical plant. Tenured Faculty are a special case. I’m not sure how they are terminated. Our office doesn’t deal with them. The Faculty Deans hire and terminate Faculty. The Deans answer to the Provost. I guess in the private sector or with Union jobs it’s different. > [@Enginerd](#): > > How the hell does somebody who worked in [HR and Payroll for 25 years](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17912754&postcount=145) not know what severance pay is? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/30 "2014-12-01T21:52:00Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Grand jury no. Prosecutor, maybe. This. The prosecutor has enomrmous leverage over what evidence the grand jury sees, and what instructions it is given. I’d be really shocked if the grand jury was paid off or threatened or otherwise tampered with. But the prosecutor? Dunno. Honestly, my guess is that the local law gives police officers enough leeway that the grand jury returned the technically correct ruling, though. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/31 "2014-12-01T22:03:27Z")
He was earning $45,000 a year? Sounds very little to me for a dangerous job. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/32 "2014-12-01T22:05:55Z")
If I recall correctly, Wilson only worked three years in the Ferguson PD. I worked in a civil service job (albeit in another state) and you had to work at least ten years before you had any pension. If you left before then, you just walked away with the money you had earned. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/33 "2014-12-01T22:09:30Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > He was earning $45,000 a year? > > Sounds very little to me for a dangerous job. He had only been working for three years, and this is, I think, a fairly low cost-of-living area of the country. That might partly explain the salary. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/34 "2014-12-01T22:18:11Z")
45k is good money in Arkansas. Nice homes in Little Rock are between 80k and a 100k. It’s much cheaper living here than many places. A 45k salary would be middle class. Missouri and Ark share a border and I think the economy’s are similar too. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/35 "2014-12-01T22:22:43Z")
Okay- thanks guys. I just tried to research the average pay of a police officer in Qld after a few years and I think it is about $60K. Hard to tell as they lump all employees in together (including office workers). And not a point for discussion but they wouldn’t run the same risk with firearms- although there are sufficient around here (please note I am not making a comment about forearm laws). ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/36 "2014-12-02T01:27:25Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > This. The prosecutor has enomrmous leverage over what evidence the grand jury sees, and what instructions it is given. I’d be really shocked if the grand jury was paid off or threatened or otherwise tampered with. But the prosecutor? Dunno. Oh, I’d very much doubt that the prosecutor was paid off or pressured in any way. Sometimes it just isn’t necessary. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/37 "2014-12-02T01:57:33Z")
> [@Don\_Simus](#): > > It is a well known fact that white Americans are intimidated by blacks. Are afraid of them. This fear causes inadequate use of arms. I think you’re trying to sound “edgy” by implying that Wilson should’ve killed Brown even sooner than he did, but the non-sequitur really isn’t helping you get there. Whites are afraid of blacks (Simus, Don._The Big Book of True White Facts_. SDMB: Simus & Shyster, 2014. Thread post.) and this mortal fear makes them reluctant to use guns on them? ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/38 "2014-12-02T03:34:19Z")
I believe that Wilson was also denied an office pizza party on his very last day. Is there no end to his suffering? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/39 "2014-12-02T04:08:32Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > 45k is good money in Arkansas. Nice homes in Little Rock are between 80k and a 100k. It’s much cheaper living here than many places. A 45k salary would be middle class. Missouri and Ark share a border and I think the economy’s are similar too. Jesus, stop embarrassing yourself with the unceasing stream of ignorance. Look at a map; Ferguson is a suburb of St. Louis; it isn’t anywhere near the Arkansas (literally half the state away) and [the median house price in the St. Louis metropolitan area is $201,888 according to Truila](http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/Saint_Louis-Missouri/market-trends/). US$45k is lower middle class; well above the federal poverty guidelines of $23,850 for a family of four, but hardly “good money”, especially for someone who will be facing years of legal bills and uncertain future employment in his original field. “Severance payment” or “severance package” is universally understood to be a offer of money and benefits above and beyond already earned benefits (e.g. accumulated vacation, personal leave, stock options, et cetera) which is offered in lieu of notice or claim of unfair dismissal, and is in my experience accompanied by a waiver to that effect. Any human resources professional who isn’t familiar with the general concept is of questionable qualification regardless of the specific industry they work in. Compensation for accumulated leave, COBRA extensions, et cetera are not part of a severance package and are separate payments that are due to any employee regardless of the circumstances of their termination (voluntary, reduction in force, involuntary for cause, invalidation of qualifications, et cetera). Being placed on administrate leave is not a “severance package”; it is being held in limbo while not knowing the future of your employment. Whether Wilson was legally and ethically correct or not in his actions, he will be subject to scrutiny in his employment for the rest of his life. A grand jury has decided that his actions in responding to a previously aggressive thug who entered his vehicle and by the physical evidence attempted to assault (and allegedly take the duty sidearm of) a police officer were not worth of criminal prosecution. How many respondents in this thread have ever been in the position of being held accountable for life or death decisions, or being expected of placing their own person in harm’s way for the public benefit, or otherwise subject to the _post hoc_ critical evaluation of temporal decisions by millions of Monday morning quarterbacks? If Wilson genuinely acted out of malice he should certainly be subject to punctuation, but the [corroborated evidence indicates](http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/12/01/witness-10-proves-darren-wilson-had-a-reasonable-belief-he-needed-to-shoot/) that at most responded with excessive force to a vicious and provoked attack by an individual who had already committed assault on another individual. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002/40 "2014-12-02T18:53:14Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > This. The prosecutor has enomrmous leverage over what evidence the grand jury sees, and what instructions it is given. I’d be really shocked if the grand jury was paid off or threatened or otherwise tampered with. But the prosecutor? Dunno. There would hardly be any need for that; the prosecutor in question has a history of shielding racist & thuggish cops. Him shielding Wilson is simply him doing what he always does. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-severance-pay-for-officer-wilson/706002.md?page=3)