# No State of the Union thread? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 6, 2019, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059 "2019-02-06T13:22:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/21 "2019-02-06T16:23:33Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > [76 percent of viewers approved of Trump’s speech, however, that was in part due to the TV audience being more Trump-leaning.](https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2019-02-06/polls-partisan-audience-drives-approval-of-trumps-state-of-the-union) Yeah, that’s more like it. “Approval of the speech among Republicans was higher than among Democrats, 97 percent compared to just 30 percent.” I’m surprised that 30% of Democrats approved. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/22 "2019-02-06T16:26:59Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > … I’m surprised that 30% of Democrats approved. I’m not. It was generally a good speech. For President Trump, it was an excellent speech. ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/23 "2019-02-06T16:28:25Z")
My opinion – God help us, he has a shot to win in 2020. It was an election pivot. He assuaged his base with tough immigration talk, but he reached out to moderates. He repudiated traditional Republican views that don’t sit well with the electorate (foreign interventionism, free trade, anti-Obama care) and coopted Democratic views that do (no pre-existing condition denial, paid maternity leave, Joe Biden’s cancer ‘moonshot’, ) This isn’t to say that this is a masterstroke and fortunately he still has plenty of weaknesses to exploit, but he’s pushing Democrats into a corner. What exactly are they standing for in 2020? He’s grabbing the populist issues like trade and punishing China as well as anti-war and pro-healthcare and he’s pushing women’s rights issues so where does that leave unique Democratic positions? It forces them to tack far left. That has always been a difficult platform to win on in the US. Their big advantage is civil rights, but he actually called for raising the number of legal immigration visas and he keeps pushing that (true) narrative that minority unemployment is at an all-time low, that’s not necessarily fooling anyone, but it makes the case harder. You can only pound on Charlottesville so long before people tune it out. Dems are in a tough position. They can either advance those moderate popular items and then Trump takes credit for them or they can obstruct and Trump can say “Look, I wanted to give you this, but they won’t let me.” Of course, my real prediction is that he’ll forget about most of them by tomorrow and go back to name-calling, but if he does play the hand, it could mean trouble for us. I think also that late-term abortion is going to be a thorn in Dem candidates sides. It’s not a popular view except among the far left, but they’ll be forced to support it to win their primaries. It’s not good and Trump knows it. The speech though was disjointed and to me it seemed obvious that he is an extremely lazy person. He missed pauses and cues which indicates that he didn’t bother to actually study the speech before he gave it. I would have loved to have seen a question-answer afterwards with him since I doubt he even really knew all of the stuff he was saying let alone a plan to get there. Overall, I think that he came out the ‘winner’ last night. Of course, I’m also an incurable pessimist, so it might just be I like to see negative things. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/24 "2019-02-06T16:45:06Z")
> [@senoy](#): > > My opinion – God help us, he has a shot to win in 2020. > > It was an election pivot. He assuaged his base with tough immigration talk, but he reached out to moderates. He repudiated traditional Republican views that don’t sit well with the electorate (foreign interventionism, free trade, anti-Obama care) and coopted Democratic views that do (no pre-existing condition denial, paid maternity leave, Joe Biden’s cancer ‘moonshot’, ) This isn’t to say that this is a masterstroke and fortunately he still has plenty of weaknesses to exploit, but he’s pushing Democrats into a corner. What exactly are they standing for in 2020? He’s grabbing the populist issues like trade and punishing China as well as anti-war and pro-healthcare and he’s pushing women’s rights issues so where does that leave unique Democratic positions? It forces them to tack far left. That has always been a difficult platform to win on in the US. Their big advantage is civil rights, but he actually called for raising the number of legal immigration visas and he keeps pushing that (true) narrative that minority unemployment is at an all-time low, that’s not necessarily fooling anyone, but it makes the case harder. You can only pound on Charlottesville so long before people tune it out. Dems are in a tough position. They can either advance those moderate popular items and then Trump takes credit for them or they can obstruct and Trump can say “Look, I wanted to give you this, but they won’t let me.” Of course, my real prediction is that he’ll forget about most of them by tomorrow and go back to name-calling, but if he does play the hand, it could mean trouble for us. I think also that late-term abortion is going to be a thorn in Dem candidates sides. It’s not a popular view except among the far left, but they’ll be forced to support it to win their primaries. It’s not good and Trump knows it. > > The speech though was disjointed and to me it seemed obvious that he is an extremely lazy person. He missed pauses and cues which indicates that he didn’t bother to actually study the speech before he gave it. I would have loved to have seen a question-answer afterwards with him since I doubt he even really knew all of the stuff he was saying let alone a plan to get there. Overall, I think that he came out the ‘winner’ last night. Of course, I’m also an incurable pessimist, so it might just be I like to see negative things. I agree with most of this. As much as Trump has screwed up, through their actions the Dems seems to be wanting to hand him a second term by their pivot to the left. Why, in the time of a good economy does the left start calling for socialism of all things? Last night Trump said that the U.S. would never be a socialist country. Come on guys, that’s an easy one to get on your feet and applaud. But, very few Democrats stood up and cheered that one. This spate of late term abortion laws is also baffling. Depending on how a poll is worded, the Dems probably have a majority for legal abortion in the first trimester. And I understand that with Gorsuch and Kavanaugh, they are afraid that Roe is in danger. But you already have state laws permitting abortion. As you said, very very few people support third trimester abortions except in the most dire of circumstances where the mother’s life is in danger. To push these bills the Dems are feeding into the pro-life propaganda that they are militantly in favor of, not choice, but abortion. Further, while the public is coming around to embrace Obamacare, the Dems again double down and propose Medicare for all. They just cannot seem to grasp victory when it is dangling in front of them. The economy is smoking hot, people are back to work and not feeling the pinch, so what do they do? Wealth taxes. 70% marginal rates. If a Republican strategist could have had a wish list of what Democrats would do to hurt themselves at the next election, I don’t think he could be happier. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/25 "2019-02-06T17:01:22Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > [76 percent of viewers approved of Trump’s speech, however, that was in part due to the TV audience being more Trump-leaning.](https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2019-02-06/polls-partisan-audience-drives-approval-of-trumps-state-of-the-union) To spell it out for everyone, for the CNN poll, 43% of viewers identified as Republican, 24% as Dems, and 30% as independents. Polling on the general public results in 25% reporting as Republicans, 34% as Dems, and 39% as independents. > **[Party Affiliation](https://news.gallup.com/poll/15370/party-affiliation.aspx)** > > In politics, as of today, do you consider yourself a Republican, a Democrat, or an Independent? (Asked of independents: As of today, do you lean more to the Democratic Party or the Republican Party?) In other news, 99 percent of Super Bowl attendees report that they had a great time watching the game. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/26 "2019-02-06T17:20:09Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > None of that happened. > > Trump said something along the lines of how many new jobs were created for women under his administration and the newly elected female congresspersons started mock applauding and cheering each other (as if congressional seats are somehow “new” jobs that are created). > > Far from “thinking they were cheering him” Trump smiled at them and said “you weren’t supposed to do that.” Yeah, here’s the speech as released by the Whitehouse, bolding mine: > [@](#): > > No one has benefitted more from our thriving economy than women, who have filled 58 percent of the newly created jobs last year. (Applause.) > > You weren’t supposed to do that. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. > > All Americans can be proud that we have more women in the workforce than ever before. (Applause.) > > Don’t sit yet. You’re going to like this. (Laughter.) > > And exactly one century after Congress passed the constitutional amendment giving women the right to vote, \*\*we also have more women serving in Congress than at any time before. \*\*(Applause.) [https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/) ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/27 "2019-02-06T17:26:17Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Yeah, here’s the speech as released by the Whitehouse, bolding mine: > > [https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/) > > But hey, who are you going to believe? That line happened later. The line that he is referring to is just prior to that > [@](#): > > As we work to defend our people’s safety, we must also ensure our economic resurgence continues at a rapid pace. No one has benefitted more from our thriving economy than women, who have filled 58 percent of the newly created jobs last year. (Applause.) > > You weren’t supposed to do that. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. EDIT: The original post I was referring to was changed, so you did get that line. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/28 "2019-02-06T17:41:56Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Yeah, here’s the speech as released by the Whitehouse, bolding mine: > [https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-state-union-address-2/) Right, Trump realized the mock cheer and humorously told them that they would really like the next thing so keep standing. Far from taking credit for the women winning their Congressional seats, he noted that on the 100th anniversary of suffrage, there were more women in Congress than ever. At no time did he suggest that he was due the credit for it, nor did he stare like a dunce and believe that these women, all of whom are outspoken critics of him, were cheering him on. The post that I was responding to contained not one single element of what actually happened. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/29 "2019-02-06T17:59:22Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > Right, Trump realized the mock cheer and humorously told them that they would really like the next thing so keep standing. Far from taking credit for the women winning their Congressional seats, he noted that on the 100th anniversary of suffrage, there were more women in Congress than ever. > > **At no time did he suggest that he was due the credit for it** , nor did he stare like a dunce and believe that these women, all of whom are outspoken critics of him, were cheering him on. The post that I was responding to contained not one single element of what actually happened. (bolding mine) Dude, the entire speech was Trump taking credit for everything. Your attempts to re-interpret everything through your partisan lens are not going to take hold here. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/30 "2019-02-06T18:01:46Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > Right, Trump realized the mock cheer and humorously told them that they would really like the next thing so keep standing. Far from taking credit for the women winning their Congressional seats, he noted that on the 100th anniversary of suffrage, there were more women in Congress than ever. > > At no time did he suggest that he was due the credit for it, nor did he stare like a dunce and believe that these women, all of whom are outspoken critics of him, were cheering him on. The post that I was responding to contained not one single element of what actually happened. Apologies, I initially didn’t see the line a few sentences above. After seeing the whole thing, my take would be that the applause was both a mixture of genuine cheering for more women in the workforce, as well as some sarcastic mocking that part of the reason they all got elected (women in _their_ workforce) was as an electoral counter-reaction from Trump-ism. Which is somewhere between your take and **Czarcasms**. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2019, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/31 "2019-02-06T18:08:24Z")
> [@senoy](#): > > My opinion – God help us, he has a shot to win in 2020. > > It was an election pivot. He assuaged his base with tough immigration talk, but he reached out to moderates. He does this[every year at this time.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trump-calling-for-comity-thats-comedy/2019/02/05/776c5dfe-29bf-11e9-b011-d8500644dc98_story.html?utm_term=.08714ff9cfd3) and then goes right back to twitter. > [@senoy](#): > > Of course, my real prediction is that he’ll forget about most of them by tomorrow and go back to name-calling, but if he does play the hand, it could mean trouble for us… Nope, you were right the first time. ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/32 "2019-02-07T00:18:27Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > To spell it out for everyone, for the CNN poll, 43% of viewers identified as Republican, 24% as Dems, and 30% as independents. Polling on the general public results in 25% reporting as Republicans, 34% as Dems, and 39% as independents. [A longstanding , if obvious pattern](https://fivethirtyeight.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/rakich-skelley-SOTUGUIDE-3.png?w=575). ([full article](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/3-reasons-that-state-of-the-union-speeches-dont-matter/)). _edit: fixed link._ ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/33 "2019-02-07T00:34:27Z")
Has there ever been a State of the Union speech that did NOT get a thumbs-up from the majority of those polled? I’m sure they’re always split more or less along party lines, but I can’t remember a time in my lifetime when a SOTU address resulted in negative poll numbers. Isn’t that why Trump was so eager to get the SOTU televised and in front of all of Congress, etc.? It’s always a credit-grab for the POTUS, and Trump relishes nothing more than a good credit-grab with lots of applause. Plus it helps people forget his huge Wall debacle. ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/34 "2019-02-07T00:39:15Z")
In that figure I just posted, what actually surprised me was that the R-identified viewers for Trump (2017 and 2018) were low compared to Bush. Is the real story that fewer viewers wanted to identify as R under Trump? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/35 "2019-02-07T00:41:18Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > (bolding mine) > > Dude, the entire speech was Trump taking credit for everything. Your attempts to re-interpret everything through your partisan lens are not going to take hold here. No kidding. He literally took credit for not being at war with North Korea – after his White House seriously discussed STARTING a war with North Korea! > **[Opinion | The dangers of a ‘bloody nose’ for North Korea](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/the-dangers-of-a-bloody-nose-for-north-korea/2018/02/04/b32124a0-083d-11e8-b48c-b07fea957bd5_story.html?utm_term=.adead4ca829e)** > > The U.S. cannot assume that a preemptive strike would deter Kim Jong Un from responding in kind. It’s like saying that I deserve credit for you being alive after I seriously considered murdering you. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/36 "2019-02-07T02:11:57Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Apologies, I initially didn’t see the line a few sentences above. After seeing the whole thing, my take would be that the applause was both a mixture of genuine cheering for more women in the workforce, as well as some sarcastic mocking that part of the reason they all got elected (women in _their_ workforce) was as an electoral counter-reaction from Trump-ism. Which is somewhere between your take and **Czarcasms**. Right, but if you watch the video, there is no moment where Trump is standing like a doofus thinking that AOC and these other women are cheering for him. The prior post was absolutely incorrect about that. That’s not a partisan lens. Anyone can watch the video. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/37 "2019-02-07T02:18:14Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > Right, but if you watch the video, there is no moment where Trump is standing like a doofus thinking that AOC and these other women are cheering for him. The prior post was absolutely incorrect about that. > > That’s not a partisan lens. Anyone can watch the video. You do a barely competent job refuting arguments that no one has made; congratulations on successfully battling your own [del]demons[/del]strawmen! ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/38 "2019-02-07T02:26:52Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > Right, but if you watch the video, there is no moment where Trump is standing like a doofus thinking that AOC and these other women are cheering for him. The prior post was absolutely incorrect about that. > > That’s not a partisan lens. Anyone can watch the video. I reject your alternative reality where Trump isn’t standing like a doofus, in any context. Well, if he’s sitting, I guess he technically isn’t _standing_ like a doofus. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/39 "2019-02-07T02:32:57Z")
I hope this is not just Trump’s last SOTU, but the last televised SOTU at all. Whole thing has been a transparent political jerkoff for many years now. This time last year my antipathy to Trump would have made me tune in to figure out what nefarious schemes he’s up to, and what valiant heroes oppose him. This year I didn’t watch it or even follow the coverage. His words are predictable and uninventive. His allies are abandoning ship. Law enforcement and congressional oversight are tightening the noose by the day. If he suggested tossing all the immigrants in the incinerator I wouldn’t care, the man will be lucky if he himself isn’t facing the death penalty for espionage within the next 2 years. He’s done and I don’t care what he says he’s going to do. So if we want to stop the televised SOTU starting now, fine, I’m all on board as you can tell. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059/40 "2019-02-07T03:27:26Z")
Sorry, brother, but I doubt that’s going to happen any time soon: > [@Paul Begala](#): > > Politics is show business for ugly people. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-state-of-the-union-thread/829059.md?page=3)