# No sympathy for those Stupid Hatians! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 13, 2010, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813 "2010-01-13T18:27:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/161 "2010-01-15T20:28:49Z")
> [@groo](#): > > What bugs me about judging the Haitians for their bad socio-political system is that some of us fortunate ones don’t realize how lucky we are. I figure we’ve been “human” for 50,000 to 100,000 years. In that time, we’ve gone through many variations of horrible, oppressive cultures, and it’s only in the last few hundred years that Freedom™, real Freedom that filters down to the masses, has developed. In my mind, we didn’t get it “right” until the last few decades (in the USA, at least). It’s taken hundreds of generations for us to get to a place where people can be born without a life sentence of poverty and slavery, and Freedom is a balance of political, legal and economic forces that have to be constantly monitored to ensure we don’t fall apart. > > Anyone eating food and drinking water on a regular basis is already one of the most fortunate people in human history, and really has no right to criticize people for not throwing off the yoke of their oppressors. I mean, I’m intelligent, relatively healthy and hard-working and have some economic security, but I don’t kid myself. The largest contributor to my liveable lifestyle is having been born in the US in the 20th century. > > This isn’t a situation where the Haitians need to “vote the rascals out.” To think that voting in Haiti is anything like voting in a first-world country would be laughable. If you want to critize them, criticize each and every one of them for not repeatedly running through a hail of machine gun fire to stab several dozen soldiers with a kitchen knife. Because that’s what it’ll take; if you’ve done likewise to earn your freedom, feel free to criticize. An outstanding post, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/162 "2010-01-15T20:35:45Z")
Maybe it was written by William Safire. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/163 "2010-01-15T20:37:12Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > An outstanding post, IMHO. Seconded. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/164 "2010-01-15T21:17:34Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > A useful little extract from Jared Diamond: > > [A divided island](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jan/15/forces-working-against-haiti) > > looks at the environmental and socio-historical factors in the different trajectories of the 2 countries sharing the island. Very good points-also, I pointed out (in past threads) that Haiti wasn’t too bad off in the 1950’s-the country was reasonably prosperous, with a middle class. Papa Doc (Francois Duvalier) changed all that-his goons intimidated any honest politicians, and doomed Haiti. By the time his son (Basket head) took over, the economy was in ruins-and most educated people had left. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/165 "2010-01-15T22:04:33Z")
> [@groo](#): > > This isn’t a situation where the Haitians need to “vote the rascals out.” To think that voting in Haiti is anything like voting in a first-world country would be laughable. If you want to critize them, criticize each and every one of them for not repeatedly **running through a hail of machine gun fire to stab several dozen soldiers with a kitchen knife.**** Because that’s what it’ll take**; if you’ve done likewise to earn your freedom, feel free to criticize. Bolding mine. I hope you guys REMEMBER this shit when you are wondering why common citizens would ever “need” their own firearms. Cause when the shit hits the fan, fucking corrupt or impotent courts, police, politicans, a crumbling social order, and kitchen knives don’t really cut it do they? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/166 "2010-01-16T00:05:56Z")
OK, already! William Tiberius Safire! See that plate on the table, with the pile of bones and nasty black feathers. That was the crow. I already ate the crow. I woulda posted the video but my son’s not home and I don’t know how to do that shit. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/167 "2010-01-16T00:57:23Z")
Haitians were too stupid to be born in another country like you guys were. Then they were stupid enough to be born in a country that 1 percent of the people own over 50 percent of the wealth. I feel no pity for people like that. Then, when they were born there was an oppressive corrupt government. What is wrong with those people? ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/168 "2010-01-16T01:08:09Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Bolding mine. > > I hope you guys REMEMBER this shit when you are wondering why common citizens would ever “need” their own firearms. > > Cause when the shit hits the fan, fucking corrupt or impotent courts, police, politicans, a crumbling social order, and kitchen knives don’t really cut it do they? Yes, because this is so likely to happen in the US. We’re completely comparable to Haiti. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/169 "2010-01-16T01:11:35Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > Yes, because this is so likely to happen in the US. We’re completely comparable to Haiti. Almost completely. The primary distinction between the US and Haiti is that Haiti is located on an island, and the US is not. Other than that, we’re essentially comparable. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/170 "2010-01-16T01:14:53Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > Yes, because this is so likely to happen in the US. We’re completely comparable to Haiti. They had a democracy and middle class did they not? They are humans? Whats so fucking different about us? ---
**Author:** ![groo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecd19e/32.png) [@groo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/171 "2010-01-16T01:33:16Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Seconded. Thank you and thank you. I thought I was getting a little hyperbolic there. And, despite not being able to bring myself to own one, I agree with **billfish678** ; we need the right to own guns, at least until the world stops being so … complicated. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/172 "2010-01-16T01:39:50Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > …Whats so fucking different about us? Several trillions of dollars. Most powerful military in the world. Food. Stuff like that. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/173 "2010-01-16T01:48:29Z")
> [@groo](#): > > And, despite not being able to bring myself to own one, I agree with **billfish678** ; we need the right to own guns, at least until the world stops being so … complicated. The world will always be complicated. Although I’m in favor of licensing for gun ownership, I agree that the populace should always be able to overthrow the government by force if need be. ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/174 "2010-01-16T01:52:37Z")
"A senior Haitian official said Friday that the death toll from the earthquake that flattened the country Tuesday could reach 200,000, the Reuters news agency reports. “We have already collected around 50,000 dead bodies; we anticipate there will be between 100,000 and 200,000 dead in total although we will never know the exact number,” Bien-Aime told Reuters. A senior Haitian official said Friday that the death toll from the earthquake that flattened the country Tuesday could reach 200,000, the Reuters news agency reports. So they already have 50,000 and they know there are thousands more still burried. This is getting worse than I ever imagined. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/175 "2010-01-18T00:21:12Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Bolding mine. > > I hope you guys REMEMBER this shit when you are wondering why common citizens would ever “need” their own firearms. > > Cause when the shit hits the fan, fucking corrupt or impotent courts, police, politicans, a crumbling social order, and kitchen knives don’t really cut it do they? One of the biggest problems looming in the disaster zone (and that plagued the benighted country before the disaster) is that _so many_ of the population are in fact armed. Most with machetes, but others with [bigger stuff](http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01560/haiti_looting_1560501c.jpg). I don’t see that having _more_ of the people armed in that situation would help in any way - especially in a country with poor education, corrupt as fuck, and what little rule there was being administered by gangsters and drug dealers already. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/176 "2010-01-18T03:26:33Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Bolding mine. > > I hope you guys REMEMBER this shit when you are wondering why common citizens would ever “need” their own firearms. > > Cause when the shit hits the fan, fucking corrupt or impotent courts, police, politicans, a crumbling social order, and kitchen knives don’t really cut it do they? Exactly which model of gun fixes impotent courts, police, politicians and a crumbling social order? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/177 "2010-01-18T03:52:20Z")
The one that puts you on an equal basis with an armored division. A BFG, at the very least. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/178 "2010-01-18T04:57:36Z")
There are infinite varieties of “shit hits the fan” weaponry, but a good “aw, fuck it” gun need only have a barrel that fits comfortably in one’s own mouth. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/179 "2010-01-18T05:04:31Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > They had a democracy and middle class did they not? > > They are humans? > > Whats so fucking different about us? They have never had a democracy. They have never had a middle class that was even 10% of the population. They have never had an educational system that provided even 10% literacy. Those are three differences that would make a significant difference in outcomes. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813/180 "2010-01-18T05:05:30Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > One of the biggest problems looming in the disaster zone (and that plagued the benighted country before the disaster) is that _so many_ of the population are in fact armed. It’s pretty much the same in Iraq. During Hussein’s rule and after. And in Afghanistan. And in Somalia. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-sympathy-for-those-stupid-hatians/524813.md?page=10)