# No-tell Motel of Sidekicks Unspoiled Heroes Mafia Thread (Players Stay Out!) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 15, 2011, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680 "2011-01-15T03:35:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/61 "2011-01-27T17:22:20Z")
OK. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/62 "2011-01-27T18:46:23Z")
I will be very surprised if Pleonast ends up being scum. I simply don’t see how Town can be so cavalier about lynching someone who not only claims Detective, but has proven investigative power. On top of that Pleonast is getting strung up easily. It should NOT be so easy to lynch a scum player in this position. Lynching scum is HARD. Lynching a scum false claiming Detective is DOUBLY hard. The lynch is going too easily for Pleonast to be scum. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/63 "2011-01-27T18:48:31Z")
I can’t believe I’m so in sync with storyteller this game. I don’t think that’s ever happened before. And I thought of another anomaly that I can’t explain. Why hasn’t anyone gone vote happy against those jumping on the Pleonast Wagon? Something isn’t adding up. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/64 "2011-01-27T19:26:26Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I will be very surprised if Pleonast ends up being scum. I simply don’t see how Town can be so cavalier about lynching someone who not only claims Detective, but has proven investigative power. On top of that Pleonast is getting strung up easily. It should NOT be so easy to lynch a scum player in this position. Lynching scum is HARD. Lynching a scum false claiming Detective is DOUBLY hard. > > The lynch is going too easily for Pleonast to be scum. This is one of the craziest lynches I’ve ever seen. It seems to me that lots of people are annoyed at **Pleonast** and that annoyance is driving the lynch, rather than rational thought. This is a powerful role with a testable claim - it’s ludicrous to lynch him now. Of course, he’s not doing himself any favors by being absent, but that could be for OOG reasons, so again, give the guy some time. If this lynch holds (and he turns up Town), I’ll definitely be rooting for scum just to punish Town’s poor play. If he flips scum, I’ll grudgingly apologize, but I still think it’s poor play. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/65 "2011-01-27T20:00:28Z")
Wow. Mega-inertia. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/66 "2011-01-27T20:08:05Z")
Holy crap! That was the weirdest lynch I’ve ever seen. Pleonast’s lack of revisit probably should have tipped me off. A Town player would have at least put in a full claim and/or tirade. But I figured Pleonast really was busy and not laying low/giving up. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/67 "2011-01-27T20:37:53Z")
Do I get a cookie? 🙂 The lynch went too easily because it is usually only townies who strongly protest a “bad” lynch of a scum player. For whatever reason (probably in fact annoyance; perhaps also subtle scum tells), no townie but Storyteller (if he is one, and I have to admit he’s doing a decent impression\*) had any interest in doing so. The scum just can’t afford to make a spectacle of themselves in such a situation. Same thing regarding people on the Pleonast wagon. The scum know it’s a correct lynch, so again they’re not sticking their necks out. (Plus, there IS scum on the bandwagon, of course.) - I can’t help myself, I’m always paranoid about him. The townier he acts the worse it gets. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/68 "2011-01-27T22:13:35Z")
Yes yes yes, you’re very smart. Have a cookie. I actually put out cookies today for the grad students. You can have one of those. Better hurry though, grad students love free food. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/69 "2011-01-27T22:25:05Z")
LOL. It’s a lot easier when you’re not playing. Things like “but nobody’s counterclaimed” and “ohmygodwhatifwe’relynchingourrealcop” never occur to you. No reason to second-guess instinct, and sometimes instinct is right. It’s been 11 minutes so I assume I’m too late for the cookies. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/70 "2011-01-27T22:55:44Z")
“but nobody’s counterclaimed” wasn’t a good reason. I wouldn’t expect a cop to counterclaim in that position, especially with Pleonast still in the lead. “OMG Cop!” is more reasonable. I agree that sometimes cop claims need to be lynched. But Cookies confirmed Pleonast’s power, which is additional confirmation that usually isn’t present. I feel it makes the risk of lynching Pleonast un-necessarily high. I considered the possibility that Pleonast was piggybacking on another scum’s power, but that would be unnecessarily risky. In other words, the chances of just happening upon a scum investigator were equivalent to happening upon the town investigator. On a sidenote: Cookies should be annoyed. Not only is this the second time she gets outed by an investigator as ‘third party’ but it is the second time she gets outed by the SCUM investigator. If she had denied denied denied either time, she could have skated. Once Pleonast was revealed as scum, Pleonast’s investigation would become suspect. In retrospect Pleonast should have called out Cookies as (1) a killer [true] and (2) not Town [also true]. Town would happily have lynched Cookies instead of Pleonast in that case. It would have bolstered Pleonast’s Town credentials and eliminated Cookies. I wonder why he didn’t. I suppose we could think Cookies is scum, but that really really doesn’t make sense. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/71 "2011-01-28T03:48:40Z")
OK, I grudgingly apologize to the town for the bad things I said about them. But it was still suboptimal play. They got lucky. **sach** , your idea of revealing Cookies as [killer] and [not Town] is perfect. It would have been brilliant. Of course, with this group it may not have mattered - they may have lynched \*\*Pleonast \*\*anyway! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/72 "2011-01-28T14:54:52Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > On a sidenote: Cookies should be annoyed. Not only is this the second time she gets outed by an investigator as ‘third party’ but it is the second time she gets outed by the SCUM investigator. If she had denied denied denied either time, she could have skated. Once Pleonast was revealed as scum, Pleonast’s investigation would become suspect. Cookies was caught by a Town investigator; I (subbing for Guiri) was the one who was caught by scum. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/73 "2011-01-28T15:02:13Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > **sach** , your idea of revealing Cookies as [killer] and [not Town] is perfect. It would have been brilliant. Of course, with this group it may not have mattered - they may have lynched \*\*Pleonast \*\*anyway! 🙂 Nice idea, but I do have to follow the pre-game setup rules. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/74 "2011-01-28T15:11:59Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Nice idea, but I do have to follow the pre-game setup rules. You would have still given \*\*Pleonast \*\*the same information, but then instead of \*\*Pleo \*\*being 100% truthful with his reveal of **Cookies** , if he had said that he only got Town vs Non-Town he probably could have pushed **Cookies** ’ lynch through much easier. Also he needed to have a fake Town aligned Detective claim ready. Not fully claiming and then outing an unaligned 3rd party weren’t enough to convince those who thought he was Scum. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/75 "2011-01-28T15:36:40Z")
Scuba Ben is going to get flack for his “sorry I was away post”. At least one person will try to make it into a Scum slip - “Why the sad face? Why say “Bugger” when we caught Scum”? That person will almost certainly be Town. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2011, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/76 "2011-01-28T16:19:13Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > You would have still given \*\*Pleonast \*\*the same information, but then instead of \*\*Pleo \*\*being 100% truthful with his reveal of **Cookies** , if he had said that he only got Town vs Non-Town he probably could have pushed **Cookies** ’ lynch through much easier. Also he needed to have a fake Town aligned Detective claim ready. Not fully claiming and then outing an unaligned 3rd party weren’t enough to convince those who thought he was Scum. Yes. That’s what I meant, for **Pleonast** to tailor his reveal to maximize potential for Cookies to get lynched. In fact, he could have simply claimed Cookies to be not Town and skipped the killer part all-together. Given that situation I’m hard-pressed to think that Town would lynch Pleonast. They would lynch Cookies to _test his claim_. Though, I was also hard-pressed to see Town lynching Pleonast in the situation that actually happened so what do I know. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/77 "2011-01-29T20:06:03Z")
And, yes, that was rather insane. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/78 "2011-01-29T20:08:59Z")
Eeeenteresting. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/79 "2011-01-29T20:10:45Z")
Wow. So I’m guessing we have a half-masonry now unconfirmable. (Unless someone breadcrumbed somehow - have to look at the discussion around Chip I guess). ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680/80 "2011-01-29T20:49:18Z")
Cookies has claimed responsibility for Chip, which is interesting since many in this unspoiled board were suspicious of Chipacabra. I was suspicious of MentalGuy, but I’ve since learned that when wrong, scum often pick up on the same signals. In other words, at times where I think someone is scum, scum will think that person a power role. OAOW wasn’t on my radar. Like at all. I honestly didn’t even know he was in the game. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-tell-motel-of-sidekicks-unspoiled-heroes-mafia-thread-players-stay-out/567680.md?page=5)