# No thanks, I'll take my chances with the psychopath. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135 "2012-07-23T14:22:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/361 "2012-07-25T16:54:53Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > No it’s not. There are few self-defense advocates more strident than I, and I protested when Kansas recently reduced the qualifications for CCW. I think the qualifications for CCW should be much higher, but the freedoms exercised should be much greater in return. But then no one on either side seems to agree with that, so I don’t push it much. Hey, I’m totally for both parts of your proposal…but I can also recall the terms “slippery slope” and “anti-gun fanatic” being used(not by _you_) when the topic has come up elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/362 "2012-07-25T17:23:27Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > How does that make him “typical?” What are the stats on negligent discharges from CCW holders versus non? Of course this idiot isn’t typical, if he was typical then there would be thousands of such shootings every day. But can we agree that for every CCW holder who shoots a spree-killer at a Batman premiere, there are [some number] of fuckheads who shoot toddlers at a Walmart? I’m not scared of guns, I grew up in Alaska were everyone has guns, and people hunt and shoot as a way of life. The only problem is, there are lots of idiots, so there were also the people who ended up shooting themselves or their little brother in the face. Invariably, alcohol was a factor. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/363 "2012-07-25T17:28:26Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Oh, for fuck’s sake. Just once can we not have one of these threads turn into a general debate on guns? Was that not the intent of the original thread posting? To incite the anti-gun crowd into a back-slapping orgy of self-righteous affirmation? Sorry if I got that wrong. These would be the same people who said an AK-47 was used and later referred to one of the weapons as a “machine gun?” Riiiiight. The knowledge level of the subject matter alone is enough to make a reasonably intelligent person shrug their shoulders. Get back to me after you become qualified to discuss it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/364 "2012-07-25T17:32:04Z")
No, it didn’t have a fucking thing to do with the anti-gun crowd. It was about sensible people- gun owners and gun haters alike- who find “experts” like yourself irritating. Put another way, I’ll see your AK-47 and raise you a headshot from the fifth row. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/365 "2012-07-25T21:12:25Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > But can we agree that for every CCW holder who shoots a spree-killer at a Batman premiere, there are [some number] of fuckheads who shoot toddlers at a Walmart? No, pedantically, because AFAIK no CCW holder has ever done such. If your real meaning is “the cost of having firearms in amongst society is in part occasional accidents and incidents where innocents may be injured or killed,” then the answer is yes. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/366 "2012-07-26T00:13:50Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > What I want to know is how he came in the fire exit. Aren’t those supposed to be locked from the outside? I’ve seen this question asked oh…100 times since the shooting spree? And I honestly don’t understand why so many people have such a hard time with it. I mean you can go into just about _any_ public/commercial facility and simply go to the emergency exit and _jam it_ in order to come back in. Hardly a master move. I mean, jeez, way back in time (talking 70’s here) I did it a time or two with my friends just for the thrill of it (catching a second movie for “free”). So, again, don’t really understand why so many people find that part of the plan so difficult to accomplish when it’s likely the easiest. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/367 "2012-07-26T00:31:30Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > …A perfectly aimed head shot is of course unlikely, but even with all the protective gear he wore, a close range hit with a large caliber handgun would be enough to daze him at least momentarily, possibly even knock him down or injure him enough in some way as to stop him from continued shooting. I like those odds. > > Shit happens. Sometime people get hurt. You do what you gotta do. I’m not going to be the victim there unless he hits me first. The rest of you can take your chances with the psychopath. Regards, Dirty Harry ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/368 "2012-07-26T13:19:47Z")
[Only surviving alternate universe Aurora resident praises actions of every gun owner](http://newsthump.com/2012/07/25/only-surviving-alternate-universe-aurora-resident-praises-actions-of-every-gun-owner/#ixzz21jaSkGF0) > [@](#): > > Lone survivor Simon Matthews told us, “He only got away two or three rounds before the first shot came back at him from the other side of the cinema.” > > “Of course, it’s really dark in there, so it wasn’t him that they hit clean in the chest – but at least he knew he wasn’t going to have it all his own way from that point.” > > “Within seconds there were dozens of assault weapons firing in all directions in between people fleeing for the door.” > > “However it was that first shot from those fleeing outside that really saw things start to escalate.” > > “Passing drivers stopped their cars to return fire, and people in the houses close by heard the gun fire and started firing back in self-defence.” > > \ > > “By midnight, all 325,000 residents were shot dead – except me, but that’s only because I played dead outside Dunkin’ Doughnuts when it all kicked off in the car park. I’d left my gun at home y’see.” ---
**Author:** ![HansGrosse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@HansGrosse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HansGrosse)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/369 "2012-07-26T14:07:45Z")
People enjoy feeling smug with the benefit of hindsight bias and underestimate just how chaotic that scene was. When you’re in a dark place with bullets flying everywhere, people are going to be scrambling around in a fucking panic. That is not the place to whip out your pistol and try to be a hero, especially against a guy who’s decked out in armor and carrying automatic weapons and gas. You’re probably going to screw up and get someone hurt, let alone get yourself killed. This isn’t the fucking Wild Wild West or something where everyone’s a vigilante. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/370 "2012-07-26T15:28:26Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > [Only surviving alternate universe Aurora resident praises actions of every gun owner](http://newsthump.com/2012/07/25/only-surviving-alternate-universe-aurora-resident-praises-actions-of-every-gun-owner/#ixzz21jaSkGF0) You know, this may come as a surprise- even a shock- to you; but the majority of people who own and carry guns are not goddamn retards. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/371 "2012-07-26T15:28:29Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > go to the emergency exit and jam it Shouldn’t that set off an alarm? Weren’t there surveillance cameras? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/372 "2012-07-26T15:30:43Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > You know, this may come as a surprise- even a shock- to you; but the majority of people who own and carry guns are not goddamn retards. Just the ones posting here then? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/373 "2012-07-26T16:58:24Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Scootch over in the seat in between shots and use the variance in sound arrival to triangulate the location of the shooter, duh. Great, you’ll have people shooting at the grassy knoll. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/374 "2012-07-26T17:08:34Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > Shouldn’t that set off an alarm? Weren’t there surveillance cameras? I’m in the security biz, There may or may not be alarms, and most security cameras in situations like that go to recording for reviewing later-there usually isn’t somebody in a booth watching the cameras live. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/375 "2012-07-26T17:34:04Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Regards, Thanks for re-emphasizing my comments, which constitute the closest things to actual facts we have in this thread thus far. The whimsical speculation of you cowardly peacniks far outweighs that by volume and mass alone, so the victims scrambling for their life or covering their loved ones while they take the bullet win. Ya think? Fact is (now that more of them are actually available for our perusal) the perp was wearing at most Type IIa body armor (a Tacticool vest). The authorities have not yet confirmed whether or not it actually even contained the armor plate inserts which are sold separately. If not, a small caliber weapon would have taken him down, with good shot placement. In any case, .45acp is more than enough to penetrate the gear he was wearing. Even a non-penetrating hit has the kinetic energy to break ribs and knock him flat on his ass. That means time for people to escape and close the deal. With the mask he wore he’d have trouble finding his opponent even after a few misses. So yeah, fighting back was certainly the best option and offered the best possible potential outcome. Too bad. Like I said before: Get back to me after you become qualified to have the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/376 "2012-07-26T17:37:04Z")
First, let’s see some evidence you’re qualified to have this discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/377 "2012-07-26T17:52:54Z")
So, the goalposts shift. We go from a generic concealed handgun to .45ACP. Nice. For the record, I typically carry 9 mm, and it’s a more popular concealed carry caliber than .45. It’s non-trivial, unless you’re a larger person or using a durable and large purse, to conceal such a large caliber gun in the first place. And there’s still the “good shot placement”. That may be possible under ideal conditions. But in a dark theater with smoke and confusion about? You’re lucky to be hitting center mass. In other words, our idiot friend **kwimby** is resorting to using the most favorable situation possible for our would-be Dirty Harry and still failing miserably at making his point. ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/378 "2012-07-26T17:54:53Z")
That’s not the point of his posts. The point is to troll the fuck out of you guys, in which case he’s a spectacular success. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/379 "2012-07-26T17:57:21Z")
It’s possible kwimby is a troll. It’s also possible he’s an idiot. Given the established posters who have advocated similar positions, I don’t think it’s out of the realm of the possible that he’s actually that stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/380 "2012-07-26T18:09:48Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > It’s possible kwimby is a troll. It’s also possible he’s an idiot. Given the established posters who have advocated similar positions, I don’t think it’s out of the realm of the possible that he’s actually that stupid. Actually, he sounds like he’s addicted to Mack Bolin/Executioner/Stony Man weapons-porno paperbacks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=20)