# No thanks, I'll take my chances with the psychopath. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135 "2012-07-23T14:22:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/401 "2012-07-26T20:33:14Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > We actually had that - minus the bunch of gun-wielding lunatics with a penchant for blood and blatant disregard for the general populace. You know - the part being conveniently framed by the imaginative fantasizers such as yourself? > > Or did you overlook that part of your so-called “plausible” scenario? That’s the part that’s plausible. The chaos that actually, you know, happened. Your scenario seems to replace all the chaos with a cool head shot from the fifth row and, I’m guessing, a snappy one-liner. Their fantasy keeps the chaos, and maybe adds a bit more because there are more people shooting at things. That seems about right, even if I don’t think it would turn into an epic bloodbath with cats marrying dogs and stuff. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/402 "2012-07-26T20:33:59Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Here in the real world, lots of us are sane and intelligent enough to realize that most people fall between those extremes in “people smart enough to realize guns aren’t always the answer in a crisis situation”. Then there’s Bob’s world where he is presumptuous enough to believe he knows what is right and what is wrong to do in a crisis situation he can only imagine. Some people recognize the options. Others live in their own little world with their minds already made up. At least you have plenty of company! ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/403 "2012-07-26T20:39:48Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Their fantasy keeps the chaos, and maybe adds a bit more… I suppose that’s where we differ, then. I’m always for less chaos, wherever possible. I remain unconvinced my scenario results in more chaos. It does in fact have a much, much lower chaos and death factor. This of course assumes belief in the plausibility factors of the given scenarios. What are the odds? One guy with a gun taking a shot or two? Six guys blazing away randomly from every direction? How many were there actually again? Please tell me, if you can. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/404 "2012-07-26T20:42:06Z")
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**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/405 "2012-07-26T20:51:00Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > Then there’s Bob’s world where he is presumptuous enough to believe he knows what is right and what is wrong to do in a crisis situation he can only imagine. I don’t mean to nitpick…but that’s kinda what you are doing too. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/406 "2012-07-26T20:57:51Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > I don’t mean to nitpick…but that’s kinda what you are doing too. Absolutely true. But only because I am taking a contrary position. I am examining options. I am saying one possible option is better in my judgement, under the given circumstances. I have not ruled anything out. They have. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/407 "2012-07-26T22:09:33Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > Thanks for re-emphasizing my comments, which constitute the closest things to actual facts we have in this thread thus far. The whimsical speculation of you cowardly peacniks far outweighs that by volume and mass alone, so the victims scrambling for their life or covering their loved ones while they take the bullet win. > > Ya think? > > Fact is (now that more of them are actually available for our perusal) the perp was wearing at most Type IIa body armor (a Tacticool vest). The authorities have not yet confirmed whether or not it actually even contained the armor plate inserts which are sold separately. If not, a small caliber weapon would have taken him down, with good shot placement. > > In any case, .45acp is more than enough to penetrate the gear he was wearing. Even a non-penetrating hit has the kinetic energy to break ribs and knock him flat on his ass. That means time for people to escape and close the deal. With the mask he wore he’d have trouble finding his opponent even after a few misses. So yeah, fighting back was certainly the best option and offered the best possible potential outcome. Too bad. > > Like I said before: Get back to me after you become qualified to have the discussion. > [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > I’ll grant your Kimber is comparable to my Glock 19 in size and accurate “enough”, but that’s even more goalpost shifting. > > You want to create your own scenario out of whole cloth where Dirty Harry is close enough to the front to matter, with a fairly specific small subclass of guns (.45 small and accurate enough to conceal), knows exactly where the shooter is, not affected enough by adrenaline to make anything other than a center mass shot realistic, unaffected by other people, unaffected by smoke, no other handgun owners nearby that may mistake him for the bad guy, etc. > > The more specific you make your scenario and claims, the more it fails because it falls further and further away from what is reasonable to expect in an ‘average’ confrontation with a maniac. > > As I stated a few times, it’s simply not credible to think all these situations can be resolved if armed people were about. It didn’t help Gabby Giffords or the other victims at that shooting. > > In fact, that’s a great example. There were concealed handgun owners in Arizona. They did the responsible thing - not shoot. In the confusion, they couldn’t clearly identify the shooter, couldn’t determine if other people were accomplices or not, and had no confidence they could pick off a target without hitting innocent people. > > But before they came forward, idiots like you were talking up the idea that a concealed weapon could have prevented or reduced the casualties. Obviously, in hindsight, that was not the case. +1 Regards, I shit you not, Reality ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/408 "2012-07-26T22:21:22Z")
_[Ah, Salmon Skin Roll](http://youtu.be/NxzTBf3iB7o)_ ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/409 "2012-07-27T00:53:01Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > _[Ah, Salmon Skin Roll](http://youtu.be/NxzTBf3iB7o)_ Yup, no doubt our friend **kwimby** is a Master of Unagi. Meanwhile, I’m sticking to sushi. You can’t imagine the kind of damage I can do with them sticks…mostly to myself. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/410 "2012-07-27T02:03:21Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Yup, no doubt our friend **kwimby** is a Master of Unagi. > > Meanwhile, I’m sticking to sushi. You can’t imagine the kind of damage I can do with them sticks…mostly to myself. The waistline is particularly susceptible to the unagi attack, especially when paired with the sake variant. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/411 "2012-07-27T09:19:40Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > so the victims scrambling for their life You’re far more likely to be murdered in the US than in any other country with a GDP higher than $31k. How does that make you feel? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/412 "2012-07-27T09:41:41Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > You’re far more likely to be murdered in the US than in any other country with a GDP higher than $31k. How does that make you feel? How do you murder someone with a GDP? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/413 "2012-07-27T10:17:24Z")
Maybe the whole problem will go away if the seats right next to ingress points are redesignated as Dirty Harry seats? No problem with panicking hordes, clear line of fire. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/414 "2012-07-27T10:27:28Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > Maybe the whole problem will go away if the seats right next to ingress points are redesignated as Dirty Harry seats? No problem with panicking hordes, clear line of fire. Yeah, but then the theatres will ban people from bringing in their own ammo and make them buy it from the snack bar at $10 per bullet. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/415 "2012-07-27T10:56:16Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Yeah, but then the theatres will ban people from bringing in their own ammo and make them buy it from the snack bar at $10 per bullet. In 100 Round Super-Sized variants I hope. I guess there will be the odd, regrettable ‘incident’ involving kids sneaking in through the Emergency Exit but I’m sure that’s a small price, well worth to paying to keep the rest of us safe from trigger-happy yahoos. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/416 "2012-07-27T11:01:43Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > You’re far more likely to be murdered in the US than in any other country with a GDP higher than $31k. How does that make you feel? Since I am not a gang member and don’t buy or sell drugs, I’d say my odds are pretty good. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/417 "2012-07-27T12:11:23Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > You’re far more likely to be murdered in the US than in any other country with a GDP higher than $31k. How does that make you feel? To reinforce **Lumpy’s** comment: When you look at the demographics, you are incorrect. If a person is involved at all in a shooting, it’s much more likekly to be a suicide, and to be white males and white females in their late teens and early 20’s, with another spike in white males in their late 60’s/eary 70’s If you take those out (suicide is not murder), then the overwhelmingly predominant murder demographic is black males in their late teens and early 20’s (it’s been a while since I looked at the CDC stats, so I’m paraphrasing by memory). The last time I looked these stats up, the murder rate among black males living in inner-city zones was around 33/100,000. The murder rate amongst white males in the same demo was comparable to England, Germany, France, etc; all those Euro countries gun control advocates wished we resembled more. IIRC, the safest demographic was black females. They’re not killing hardly anyone, much less themselves. Their stats make those European countries look like a war zone. So as a white male in my 40s, I feel fairly safe. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/418 "2012-07-27T14:03:34Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > When you look at the demographics… Thank you for that fascinating and informative post. It shows how “averages” (overall rates of something for a country, etc.) can often be so misleading. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/419 "2012-07-27T14:26:25Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > …I’m sure that’s a small price, well worth to paying to keep the rest of us safe from trigger-happy yahoos. There are too many people like Tagos who expect somebody else - the gubmit, the cops, the “authorities” (who or whatever they are) to _keep them safe_. The stark reality is nobody buy you can keep you safe. If you believe otherwise you are living under a dangerous illusion. That’s why I prompted czarcasm the “security biz” expert to elaborate. Basically what he briefly glossed over is that no other security measures presently available, feasible, affordable or practical can prevent or even mitigate an attack like this. Never have never will. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/420 "2012-07-27T14:27:33Z")
What are the stats for getting shot in a movie theatre by a complete stranger? edited to add: What are the stats for falling in a bathtub and hitting your head? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=22)