# No thanks, I'll take my chances with the psychopath. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135 "2012-07-23T14:22:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/481 "2012-08-10T02:54:05Z")
Strange asking a non-SEAL how a SEAL would react. But here goes (read 4 Marcinko books): safe your weapon, assist bystanders in getting out as quickly as possible, keep re-assessing the situation on what you should do next. The definite no-no would be to wade across the crowd, looking to get within arms-length of the shooter, and expect him to be waiting for you in a classic western draw. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/482 "2012-08-10T05:20:57Z")
Oh, look, we have a [**kwimby** soulmate!](http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/09/justice/ohio-batman-weapons-charges/index.html?hpt=hp_t1) > [@](#): > > A man faces weapons charges after authorities say he went to an Ohio movie theater showing the latest Batman movie armed with a gun, ammunition and knives. > > [snip] > > Smith was the first to arrive, 30 minutes before the movie’s start, and took a seat in the back row, directly in the middle, with his back to a wall. A manager at the theater and an off-duty police officer grew suspicious of where he sat, and they noticed the bag Smith was carrying. > > They asked to search the bag, DiSanto said, and inside found a loaded 9 mm semiautomatic handgun, two loaded magazine clips and three knives. Police said Smith was carrying another knife on his person. > > Smith told the off-duty officer he was carrying the gun and knives for protection, to protect himself and other moviegoers, said police, who took him into custody. Wow, what a prince of a guy! So determined to see to it that no joker could ever shoot up a theaterful of innocent people again, no sirree! And so perfectly positioned to carry out his mission: > [@](#): > > Westlake police Lt. Ray Arcuri said police believe Smith’s position in the movie theater was “tactical:” not only was he protected from the back, but he could have fired to his right, left and center on anyone in the theater in front of him. About 80 people attended the movie that night. Now, wouldn’t we all feel ever so much safer with someone like that in the theater? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/483 "2012-08-10T08:35:32Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > No. I’m referring to the thread starter specifically, and any dumb ass that thinks like they do, in general. > > Try reading my post in context and with a little comprehension while you’re at it. > > Gotch’it? Says the man who continues to miss the entire point of this thread. I guess being the center of a PALATR session is still better than being ignored. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/484 "2012-08-10T15:13:17Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Says the man who continues to miss the entire point of this thread. > > I guess being the center of a PALATR session is still better than being ignored. Well at least the “man” part and the “laughing” part. I’ll be laughing all the way to the shooting range for a little practice today. Right now I’m laughing to myself at all the 'tards like you who aren’t man enough to stand up to the bullshit. Being a keyboard commando with all your dope buds is kinda PALATR in it’s own right, eh? Ever wonder how many people might be reading this thread and laughing at you? Even a little? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/485 "2012-08-10T15:14:41Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > I’ll kill that mother if he was right in front of me Yeah, fuck the commie fags who think we shouldn’t resist evil and should turn the other cheek, right? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/486 "2012-08-10T15:43:00Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > Well at least the “man” part and the “laughing” part. > > I’ll be laughing all the way to the shooting range for a little practice today. > > Right now I’m laughing to myself at all the 'tards like you who aren’t man enough to stand up to the bullshit. > > Being a keyboard commando with all your dope buds is kinda PALATR in it’s own right, eh? > > Ever wonder how many people might be reading this thread and laughing at you? > > Even a little? 😛 Yup. Called it. Fifteen years old. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/487 "2012-08-11T04:09:07Z")
I stopped into my local gun shop today, to check out a Colt Officer’s Target .38 Special pistol I’d had my eye on for a while (yup, bought it), and got to chatting with the owner, “Jack”, and the employee on with him, “Bill”, about the Batman theater massacre. Both men are ex-Special Forces, with long lifetimes of weapons experience and expertise. Their verdict (once they’d finished reminiscing about their tear-gas training sessions): anyone claiming they’d have been able to take out the shooter, if only they’d been there and carrying, is an idiot and would have been a dangerous fool to even try. Bill did say if he had a clear shot in a similar situation, he would take it, but he was as firm as Jack in saying under the Colorado conditions it would have been impossible. He made this further point: “In time of crisis one reverts to one’s lowest level of training.” Chew on that, all would-be heroes. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/488 "2012-08-11T09:25:49Z")
^ Assuming you’re quoting unqualified expert opinion, it pretty much closes the discussion on the Batman shooting with regard to the armed citizen. Just remember: all of these shooting incidences are highly situational. As I mentioned, the Batman shooter came highly prepared, possibly even against a trained shooter in the crowd. I just hope this doesn’t inspire a whole lot of loonies wanting to take it out on a big crowd of defensless people. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/489 "2012-08-11T14:02:37Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Bill did say if he had a clear shot in a similar situation, he would take it, Right. > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > .. but he was as firm as Jack in saying under the Colorado conditions it would have been impossible. There’s no way for him or anybody else who wasn’t there to know that. So Teddy, do you carry? Gonna stop now? Maybe you should be like antiBob and leave it it home in case you ever have the opportunity to screw up in public with your weapon. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/490 "2012-08-11T16:01:32Z")
And **kwimby** confirms exactly what Jack and Bill had to say about hero wannabes. Hint: It weren’t purty. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/491 "2012-08-11T17:41:24Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > There’s no way for him or anybody else who wasn’t there to know that. Hasn’t stopped you yet. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/492 "2012-08-11T19:03:46Z")
I still think that the worst possible scenerio for having to shoot in self-defense does not automatically translate to “no one should ever carry guns”. As in if you can’t positively identify the threat, you don’t have a clear shot and you’re not sure of your backdrop, then you should know not to shoot. And other self-defense situations might not be as craptastic as this one. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/493 "2012-08-11T19:57:25Z")
I think you’re probably right. My main gripe, in conversations like this, is with people who basically make the argument, “If other members of the public had been carrying, this terrible tragedy would have been brought to an end more quickly, or averted altogether.” Not only is this impossible to know, but it also excludes the possibility that more people firing away might actually make things worse. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/494 "2012-08-11T20:27:43Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I think you’re probably right. > > My main gripe, in conversations like this, is with people who basically make the argument, “If other members of the public had been carrying, this terrible tragedy would have been brought to an end more quickly, or averted altogether.” > > Not only is this impossible to know, but it also excludes the possibility that more people firing away might actually make things worse. Not if we pass a law requiring bad guys to wear black hats at all times. Problem solved. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/495 "2012-08-12T01:19:25Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Hasn’t stopped you yet. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Not if we pass a law requiring bad guys to wear black hats at all times. Problem solved. It’s telling how the anti-gun side in this discussion responds to cogent arguments and factual information with snide remarks and flippant comments. Guess you gotta go with what you got. Is that all you got? Been that way pretty much the whole thread. Yawn. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/496 "2012-08-12T01:27:53Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I think you’re probably right. > > My main gripe, in conversations like this, is with people who basically make the argument, “If other members of the public had been carrying, this terrible tragedy would have been brought to an end more quickly, or averted altogether.” > > Not only is this impossible to know, but it also excludes the possibility that more people firing away might actually make things worse. Include, exclude whatever. It’s not black and white, either/or. It’s a dynamic scenario that has endless possibilities. Yet some people (for obvious reasons) continue attempting to assert it is clearly a one-sided proposition with this unrealistic assumption that it must be a better option to not offer armed resistance, if possible. I suppose it’s just too difficult for some people to comprehend in an objective, rational way. So the simplistic, pacifist, politically-motivated viewpoint is more palatable. What a disgusting way to use this as soapbox opportunity to broadcast your misinformed opinion. Sorry it can’t made easily understood for the reality challenged. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/497 "2012-08-12T01:40:03Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I think you’re probably right. > > My main gripe, in conversations like this, is with people who basically make the argument, “If other members of the public had been carrying, this terrible tragedy would have been brought to an end more quickly, or averted altogether.” > > Not only is this impossible to know, but it also excludes the possibility that more people firing away might actually make things worse. There’s a massive, gaping excluded middle. For example, I don’t believe anyone on either side of the debate felt like [my description of how I would have handled the situation was unreasonable.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15304719&postcount=182) ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/498 "2012-08-12T01:41:31Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > It’s telling how the anti-gun side in this discussion responds to cogent arguments and factual information with snide remarks and flippant comments. Guess you gotta go with what you got. Is that all you got? > > Been that way pretty much the whole thread. Yawn. :rolleyes: What I’ve seen is a wide range of people, some with extensive military and/or police experience, a lot of them _very_ “pro-gun”, saying that you are basically full of shit. My suggestion? Put away the “Executioner/Stoney Man” gun-porno paperbacks, turn off whatever shoot-em-up game you’ve got playing on your X-Box, climb out of your parent’s basement, take a bath and go talk to a real girl. There’s still a couple of weeks of summer vacation left-go participate in some real life activities before school starts back up again. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/499 "2012-08-12T01:47:35Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > There’s a massive, gaping excluded middle. For example, I don’t believe anyone on either side of the debate felt like [my description of how I would have handled the situation was unreasonable.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15304719&postcount=182) Reasonable approach…but we distracted by the clown. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2012, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135/500 "2012-08-12T01:50:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What I’ve seen is a wide range of people, some with extensive military and/or police experience, a lot of them _very_ “pro-gun”, saying that you are basically full of shit. My suggestion? Put away the “Executioner/Stoney Man” gun-porno paperbacks, turn off whatever shoot-em-up game you’ve got playing on your X-Box, climb out of your parent’s basement, take a bath and go talk to a real girl. There’s still a couple of weeks of summer vacation left-go participate in some real life activities before school starts back up again. Or better still if you’re old enough, take some real firearms tactical self-defense courses and learn just how hard it is to respond to sudden emergencies- and hopefully become better prepared for such emergencies. I recently discovered to my horror just how slow and clumsy simply drawing a concealed firearm is if you’ve never actually practiced it before. Practice, preparation and awareness are indispensable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-thanks-ill-take-my-chances-with-the-psychopath/629135.md?page=26)