# No, you don't need a semiautomatic rifle **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 11, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705 "2021-02-11T17:51:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/1 "2021-02-11T17:51:58Z")
In another thread we had the following exchange which the mods have requested we take to Great Debates: > [@3 Dead over snow shoveling dispute - PA](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/3-dead-over-snow-shoveling-dispute-pa/932269/199): > > > [@3 Dead over snow shoveling dispute - PA](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/3-dead-over-snow-shoveling-dispute-pa/932269/191): > > > > Yeah, you definitely need a semiautomatic rifle capable of firing dozens of rounds in rapid succession in case hordes of ravenous beasts descend upon your farmstead > > The fact that you think that there is no use for semi-automatic rifles in a hunting situation tells me you’ve never hunted and don’t know much about it. > [@3 Dead over snow shoveling dispute - PA](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/3-dead-over-snow-shoveling-dispute-pa/932269/200): > > Sure, it’s EASIER to hunt with a semiautomatic rifle that can put 12 bullets into a deer in half as many seconds. But that doesn’t outweigh the multitude of Americans killed by gun violence every year. So please, enlighten us: what is so important about hunting with semiautomatic rifles that it justifies the huge number of gun deaths in the United States? And how do the British manage without? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/2 "2021-02-11T17:54:26Z")
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**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/3 "2021-02-11T17:55:52Z")
Sorry, I asked Hari to change his message and hopefully he does. This qualifies as a tired subject and I we really don’t need a fresh gun control debate. _This is not a warning._ > [@New Rules for Great Debates and Elections – January 2020](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-rules-for-great-debates-and-elections-january-2020/845726/1): > > **Thrice Told Tales are off limits.** Over the last 20 years, posters in Great Debates and Politics and Elections have debated pretty much everything. As such, there are some contentious issues about which we are tired of hearing. We just don’t want to go around and around about these things any more. In general, we’re just tired of these subjects. It may, however, be that there’s something new under the sun. Posters may start threads on these subjects only with prior approval of a Great Debates or Politics and Elections moderator. If you think you’ve got a new angle on something we’ve discussed a million times and found unpleasant, please feel free to make your case. Getting one approved is a very heavy lift, however. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/4 "2021-02-11T21:08:26Z")
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**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/5 "2021-02-11T21:11:00Z")
Reopened, Gun Debates are not in the category of Thrice Told Tales. @Babale, my apologies. Thanks to **Colibri** , we bounced this up to the Mod Loop and straighten out the interpretation of the quoted part of the rules. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/6 "2021-02-11T21:14:32Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Reopened, Gun Debates are not in the category of Thrice Told Tales. Excellent - then I repeat my question, to anyone who cares to answer it: > [@Babale](#): > > what is so important about hunting with semiautomatic rifles that it justifies the huge number of gun deaths in the United States? And how do the British manage without? ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/7 "2021-02-11T21:25:22Z")
> [@3 Dead over snow shoveling dispute - PA](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/3-dead-over-snow-shoveling-dispute-pa/932269/199): > > The fact that you think that there is no use for semi-automatic rifles in a hunting situation tells me you’ve never hunted and don’t know much about it. Oh mighty hunter, please tell me how I’ve been hunting wrong all these years using a bolt action rifle and a over/under shotgun? Please bestow your mystical knowledge upon us lesser humans. This guy is useless to talk to about this, he won’t even admit guns are weapons when he uses them to kill the ravening beasts threatening his existence. I’m not even sure this guy has been near wild animals if he thinks he needs 30 rounds to protect himself from wolves. Maybe somewhere in the world wolves are a threat to humans but it is not in the US. Sorry @Babale , meant to just quote the **MightyCurmugeon** but got your name in there instead. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/8 "2021-02-11T21:30:02Z")
I think what’s behind it is the old trope that if you don’t understand all the arcane technical details that are second nature to gun fetishists, any opinion that you hold on private gun ownership in a civilized society is invalid. I don’t know much about fusion bomb design, but I’m pretty sure we shouldn’t sell those at Walmart either. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/9 "2021-02-11T21:37:43Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Maybe somewhere in the world wolves are a threat to humans but it is not in the US. [That’s what you think…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pkaaQXvzGk) Actually I suspect that something like the above link is the closest [FriendlyCurmudgeon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriendlyCurmudgeon) has come to having to defend himself from wildlife. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/10 "2021-02-11T22:04:52Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > what is so important about hunting with semiautomatic rifles that it justifies the huge number of gun deaths in the United States? People (who aren’t me) like to have them. And letting them have them poses negligible danger to me or you. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/11 "2021-02-11T22:07:49Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Sorry @Babale , meant to just quote the **MightyCurmugeon** but got your name in there instead. Fixed quote tags. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/12 "2021-02-11T22:08:44Z")
If I remember correctly, @MightyCurmudgeon is in a rural area of Quebec, not the US. ---
**Author:** ![FriendlyCurmudgeon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friendlycurmudgeon/32/5786_2.png) [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriendlyCurmudgeon)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/13 "2021-02-11T22:10:09Z")
There’s a certain level of hostility and mockery from the start that tells me to not even bother here. I won’t be changing any minds, so have fun. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/14 "2021-02-11T22:13:53Z")
The problem with negligible danger is that if there’s a hundredth of a percent chance that an american will be imperiled by a rifle, that’s tens of thousands of cases. So yeah, sure, I personally don’t expect to be threatened by some nut with a rifle, but that doesn’t mean that their presence does no harm. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/15 "2021-02-11T22:18:53Z")
> [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](#): > > There’s a certain level of hostility and mockery from the start that tells me to not even bother here. I won’t be changing any minds, so have fun. No hostility or mockery was intended; I have no control over what people who replied before you did have posted. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/16 "2021-02-11T22:20:41Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > The problem with negligible danger is that if there’s a hundredth of a percent chance that an american will be imperiled by a rifle, that’s tens of thousands of cases. So yeah, sure, I personally don’t expect to be threatened by some nut with a rifle, but that doesn’t mean that their presence does no harm. Nonzero harm, for sure. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/17 "2021-02-11T22:20:56Z")
Nobody asked you to change minds. Just share with us why you use a weapon normally carried by someone in the military to deal with wildlife. Should be just as easy as what you already posted. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/18 "2021-02-11T22:21:54Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > People (who aren’t me) like to have them. And letting them have them poses negligible danger to me or you. Tell that to the victims of the Vegas shooting… why are their lives less important than your (the general “your”) ability to own a deadly weapon? Not to mention the multitude of other mass shootings, or the even more numerous victims of gun violence who were killed in incidents that didn’t involve a mass shooting? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/19 "2021-02-11T22:28:34Z")
That’s really the thing; when you look at it from the perspective of the number of guns of whatever type, vs the number actually used for criminal purposes, it’s kind of staggering how few it actually is. From what I have read, it’s in the [1.3 million or so “assault” rifles are sold EACH year](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/the-ar-15-americas-rifle-or-illegitimate-killing-machine/2018/02/15/743e66ca-1266-11e8-9065-e55346f6de81_story.html#:~:text=About%201.3%20million%20assault%20rifles%20are%20sold%20each,used%20against%20Soviet%20forces%20in%20World%20War%20II.). Even if all gun murders were done by newly sold assault rifles, that would represent just a hair over 1% of those rifles used in murders. But that’s not the case; the vast majority of gun deaths are not from rifles of any type; [of the 13927 gun murders in 2019, only 364 were from rifles, with about 6400 from handguns.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/195325/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-weapon-used/) So even if we limit the total pool to only newly sold guns, we’re still talking about a vanishingly small percentage that are actually used to kill anyone. But we’re really looking at the accumulated total of assault rifles sold over decades, making that percentage microscopic. If we take the 13 million rifles sold over the past decade, and divide 364 by that, we come up with 0.0028% used in a homicide. That’s tiny. I’m guessing lots of other things kill people at a higher rate than that which nobody is concerned with. It’s just that when they are used, the killings are typically very prominent. But that ultimately doesn’t trump people’s right to own them- it just seems absurdly restrictive to crack down on that type of weapon which is overwhelmingly used for normal purposes, just because one guy out of 325 million _MIGHT_ do something illegal with it. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/20 "2021-02-11T22:35:08Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Tell that to the victims of the Vegas shooting… why are their lives less important than your (the general “your”) ability to own a deadly weapon? > > Not to mention the multitude of other mass shootings, or the even more numerous victims of gun violence who were killed in incidents that didn’t involve a mass shooting? “Important” wasn’t even on my mind, but the remote possibility of someone killing me or anyone else with one of these things is so low that it is unimportant. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705.md?page=2)