# No, you don't need a semiautomatic rifle **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 11, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705 "2021-02-11T17:51:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/141 "2021-02-12T20:48:09Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > [Hogs](https://www.hogmanoutdoors.com/blog/diy-hog-hunting-bait-tips-and-tricks-for-taking-feral-hogs) and [coyotes](https://www.outdoorlife.com/articles/hunting/predators-small-game/predator-techniques/2011/01/predators-hunt-hunters/) are both typically bated That’s not hunting, that’s baiting a trap. Turkey shoot. Fish in a barrel. Whatever you call it it’s not hunting. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/142 "2021-02-12T20:49:05Z")
Sure. From now on you can only support legislation that will prevent guns from hurting others and we can repeal stupid laws like the NFA and title 2. I’ll keep my guns locked up separately from their ammo and always ensure I’m shooting in a way that is safe to people. I also won’t transfer guns to people who won’t do likewise. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/143 "2021-02-12T20:56:56Z")
How do you want to define hunting then? Trapping and baiting have been part of hunting forever. Is it not hunting to wait at water that birds want to land in so you can shoot them on landing? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/144 "2021-02-12T20:59:17Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > I also won’t transfer guns to people who won’t do likewise. How would you know? ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/145 "2021-02-12T20:59:40Z")
Simple. I don’t transfer guns. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/146 "2021-02-12T21:09:40Z")
Ooops. my mistake. All this pics of the protesters or their kindred spirits show them with guns of all kinds, but it seems they decided to to attempt open carry at the Capitol. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/147 "2021-02-12T21:16:09Z")
" If you don’t want to use the generally accepted definition of a term, then I’m afraid there is little point in discussion with you" And WHAT is the generally accepted definition of the term? I thought this had been covered already. At the expense of repeating myself, it is easy - if illegal - to convert an AR-15 to a fully automatic version, you just need to change a few parts. The basic design permits automatic fire. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/148 "2021-02-12T21:24:43Z")
Do you need a “not” in there? ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/149 "2021-02-12T21:28:59Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Historically the salient point was as much about the intermediate cartridge as it was the selective fire and box magazine. > > You’re right in that the confusion in the civilian world comes in with the fact that semi auto versions of the same rifles are sold to civilians and function 99% the same as the selective fire military versions. So to many, it seems like a trivial distinction that the military ones allow you to hold the trigger down and it’ll fire until the magazine is empty, versus the civilian one requires you to pull the trigger once per shot. Especially when you consider that most infantry training does not emphasize fully automatic fire these days. > > Fully auto weaponry has been highly restricted for a long time- it requires special licensing that is quite expensive, and since no new-production weapons have been allowed for sale in decades, the prices are eye-wateringly high for full-auto weapons in the US. Legal ones just aren’t used in crimes. > > But ultimately there’s very little difference between a [Ruger 10/22](https://www.ruger.com/products/1022/overview.html?r=y) and an [AR-15 “assault rifle”](https://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com/prodimages/15433-DEFAULT-l.jpg) except for the amount of powder in the cartridge and about a 10x price difference. _One is apparently terrifying because it’s black and military, and the other isn’t, because it has a wood stock and fires a lighter bullet out of a less powerful cartridge._ Same bore diameter, interestingly enough. > > And that’s what makes this absurd; nobody’s getting bent out of shape over 10/22s, or even large-bore rifles like [Browning BAR ShortTracs](https://www.outdoorlife.com/resizer/lNJ_UCKw8mSfssAzVK51gm9H5-Q=/800x157/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-bonnier.s3.amazonaws.com/public/CW7ZNO6A2QL4HTBV767YBKRW7Y.jpg), or [Benelli R1s](https://www.outdoorlife.com/resizer/KTHl-UXZsud1-jeyqonTUCT3Wa4=/800x171/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-bonnier.s3.amazonaws.com/public/73QRS7ZWEY63BC4QINFCHGHOTI.jpg) , even though they’re all semi-automatic and the latter two fire bigger, deadlier bullets than the AR-15. (my emphasis) That “scary” aesthetic, though, is exactly what makes quote-unquote “assault rifles” more dangerous, to my mind. Because that’s what appeals to the gun fetishists and soldier cosplayers that imagine themselves the Minute Men of the new American Revolution; it’s about _perception_. An AR-15 might be functionally equivalent to a Ruger 10/22, just as a Honda Accord will get you around town just as well as a BMW 330. But it doesn’t serve the fantasy. If Kyle Rittenhouse had really wanted to defend property, a 12 ga. shotgun would have been a more effective weapon. But that wouldn’t have played as well in his imagined narrative of “bravely defending Kenosha from the ravening hordes of Antifa looters”. Or so it seems to me. Not sure there’s any legislative solution to gun fetishization, though; that might require the sort of cultural re-programming that was used against smoking and drunk driving. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/150 "2021-02-12T21:34:18Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > How do you want to define hunting then? Trapping and baiting have been part of hunting forever. Is it not hunting to wait at water that birds want to land in so you can shoot them on landing? Hunting is the stalking and killing of animals for food. Trapping and baiting is slaughter. Even if you are a “sport” hunter, how is that sport? I do hunt waterfowl but I don’t use blinds or camo boats or decoys or calls. Waterfowl is so prevalent in most of the US it’s simple to do without all the extras. Just learn a little woodcraft and patience. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/151 "2021-02-12T22:13:32Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > I’ll keep my guns locked up separately from their ammo and always ensure I’m shooting in a way that is safe to people. I also won’t transfer guns to people who won’t do likewise. Can I throw you in prison if you don’t? Like real prison, with real criminals, tiny terrible cells you get to live in for a few years and you have a felony on your record for the rest of your life and can’t get a decent job when you get out kind of prison? Can the police check up on your storage methodology anytime they want, or do you expect plenty of advance warning so you can clean up your unsafe practices? ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/152 "2021-02-12T22:14:27Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Waterfowl is so prevalent in most of the US it’s simple to do without all the extras. Just learn a little woodcraft and patience I’ve heard stories of those parts of the US but certainly in my part of the western US getting ducks or geese to even approach your piece of water in a miracle and without blinds, decoys and calls would be impossible. Luckily the elk are everywhere. I’ve tried eating feral hogs and they were disgusting. I certainly have never shot prarie dogs or coyotes for food. Hitting a prarie dog at 100 yards certainly takes lots of skill and hitting a coyote isn’t easy since they are normally on the move even if you’ve called them in another skill they aren’t close which is why semi autos are preferred for quick follow up shots. But sure by your definition hogs, coyotes, and prarie dogs aren’t hunting. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/153 "2021-02-12T22:19:55Z")
Sure. I’m down with that. But I can also go buy an uzi and unlimited ammo without a waiting period so I can go play this weekend. It’s absolutely unconstitutional but I’d be down with creating a gun owning class and and underclass without them. In my ideal world we’d keep guns away from the crazies and the rest of us would get to do what we want as long as we don’t hurt anyone. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/154 "2021-02-12T22:21:03Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > But I can also go buy an uzi and unlimited ammo without a waiting period so I can go play this weekend Why do you feel the need to “play” with a deadly weapon of war? ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/155 "2021-02-12T22:21:21Z")
Because it’s fun. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/156 "2021-02-12T22:22:33Z")
It’s all fun and games until someone blows their own head off. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/157 "2021-02-12T22:25:28Z")
Sometimes achieved even without weapons, too! ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/158 "2021-02-12T22:30:06Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > semi autos are preferred for quick follow up shots Just so I’m clear. I have nothing against semi-auto rifles. I object to large magazines. You can have a M4/AK knockoff, I just want around a 5 round limit. Outside of military use, even with semi-auto only, they are not the best choice of rifle for anything. ---
**Author:** ![MrMrmrmr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrmrmrmr/32/5828_2.png) [@MrMrmrmr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrMrmrmr)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/159 "2021-02-12T22:37:51Z")
According to the US government l need a rifle. “ Section 6.0 of your CMP Rulebook and Section 3 of your NRA Rulebook defines authorized equipment. Obviously, you will need a rifle.” CMP is a government program, civilian marksmanship program. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2021, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705/160 "2021-02-12T22:47:43Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Just so I’m clear. I have nothing against semi-auto rifles. I object to large magazines. And just so I’m clear I don’t even own a semi-auto rifle. I’ve used them many times but have never owned one mainly because their use cases don’t match well to what I’m willing to fund. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-dont-need-a-semiautomatic-rifle/932705.md?page=9)