# No, you ignoramuses, this \*isn't\* racist (or, "Here we go again..") **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 6, 2010, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886 "2010-01-06T11:09:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/221 "2010-01-07T03:17:37Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …indeed. I am seriously upset the Pakistanis fell over at the last hurdle: you Aussies certainly could have done with a beating!!! My Kiwi mother is staying with us at the moment, she was most disappointed that the Aussies came back. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/222 "2010-01-07T03:26:33Z")
It amuses me that the culturally sensitive Americans in this thread see a group of West Indian cricket fans as a bunch of black people while the “racist” Australians see the same group of people as a bunch of cricket fans. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/223 "2010-01-07T03:35:26Z")
> [@Lobot](#): > > Really and truly, 99% of all people living outside the US have never encountered the fried chicken stereotype. You claim that the other stereotype is wide spread and we have Cazzle claiming total bafflement of its mere existence. Banquet Bear is still doing his best to use “West Indies” in much the same way that RNAB wanted to draw a distinction between blacks and black people from Zimbabwe. Much like death ray is doing his best to pretend that racists would first wait to see if a black person was influenced by American culture before disliking them and would have nothing bad to say about blacks who weren’t Americans (bonus points for the Colbert-eque claims to not see color, just sports fans). Australia, the totally post-racial society, eh, eh? And of course Australia, as pointed out, has quite a continuing history of involvement with American culture, including our media. And a gigantic American company starts an ad campaign that features one bit about placating blacks with friend chicken, and nobody at all along the way noticed… anything? Still not buying it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/224 "2010-01-07T03:41:01Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > You claim that the other stereotype is wide spread and we have Cazzle claiming total bafflement of its mere existence. Banquet Bear is still doing his best to use “West Indies” in much the same way that RNAB wanted to draw a distinction between blacks and black people from Zimbabwe. Much like death ray is doing his best to pretend that racists would first wait to see if a black person was influenced by American culture before disliking them and would have nothing bad to say about blacks who weren’t Americans (bonus points for the Colbert-eque claims to not see color, just sports fans). Australia, the totally post-racial society, eh, eh? I didn’t draw a distinction between blacks and black people from Zimbabwe. You did. I drew a distinction between people subject to the fried chicken stereotype - American blacks - and other black people. Considering the hypothetical racists in question aren’t Americans, projecting the beliefs of American racists onto them is as stupid as projecting American context onto the commercial in question was. Now you also appear to be suggesting that Australians should know that there’s a stereotype in the US about black people liking fried chicken. _How_? How in the name of all that is holy is an Australian person supposed to know that? Did it feature prominently in a movie? Was there a _Friends_ episode about it? Was Michael Jordan well-known for his chicken binges? ---
**Author:** ![Cazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cazzle/32/75_2.png) [@Cazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cazzle)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/225 "2010-01-07T03:41:45Z")
> [@Cazzle](#): > > I don’t understand the question. What is a hook nosed money lender? Oh, ok, so this is a Jewish thing. Well, first of all, simply having a hook nose wouldn’t be clue enough for me that the person I’m looking at is supposed to be Jewish. I’d have to see, like, a yarmulke or, for preference, he would need to be dressed as a Rabbi. Even then, the money lending aspect would fly right over my head. I’ve lived my entire life in a rural area where the Jewish population is negligible. Stereotypes don’t tend to flourish where their targets don’t live. For the record, I’d never heard the word “beaner” until my ex (from Texas) used and explained it because the Mexican population around here is, also, negligible. See also: African-Americans and fried chicken (and watermelon - another thing I only learned about from the internet). We get a LOT of American media here. When was the last time you saw these stereotypes spelled out on a sitcom? An oblique reference would go over our heads, a blatant one would probably not be airing in a prime-time spot. Over saturation of American entertainment does not equal complete cultural immersion. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/226 "2010-01-07T03:42:04Z")
We can forget it now [KFC have pulled the ad](http://www.news.com.au/world/kfc-australia-pulls-racist-ad-after-us-anger/comments-e6frfkyi-1225816969895) although I’m sure I haven’t seen it since the Windies left. As someone notes in the comments **KFC chicken by name chicken by nature**. Wonder how many people will swear off KFC because of their weakness? ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/227 "2010-01-07T03:43:45Z")
FinnAgain, read this (again): > [@](#): > > It amuses me that the culturally sensitive Americans in this thread see a group of West Indian cricket fans as a bunch of black people while the “racist” Australians see the same group of people as a bunch of cricket fans. It certainly bears repeating. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/228 "2010-01-07T03:44:39Z")
I for one am glad the Americans on the board are taking the time, yet again, to explain other peoples’ cultures to them. I don’t know how the rest of you ever made it without us pointing these things about you out to you. Tomorrow, I’ll let you know what you ate for breakfast and, if you ask nicely, I’ll consider revealing the name of your first babysitter–for a fee! ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/229 "2010-01-07T03:47:31Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I didn’t draw a distinction between blacks and black people from Zimbabwe. You did. I’d ask you to cite that, but it’s pretty clear you invented it because it sounded good to you. Not that I expect it to do much good, but I’d ask you to refrain from confusing your imagination with my posts. It should be easy, as my posts do not reside in your head. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I drew a distinction between people subject to the fried chicken stereotype - American blacks - and other black people. Of course, as pointed out that’s not only bullshit but laughable bullshit. It seems to be tempting bullshit as several of your cohort are doing your best to pretend that racists will ask for a black person’s nationality before being bigoted against them. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/230 "2010-01-07T03:49:02Z")
Wait a minute… aren’t you Canadian? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/231 "2010-01-07T03:50:18Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > It certainly bears repeating. It does. I like the shtick better when Colbert does it since he at least realizes it’s autoparody. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/232 "2010-01-07T03:52:54Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Much like death ray is doing his best to pretend that racists would first wait to see if a black person was influenced by American culture before disliking them and would have nothing bad to say about blacks who weren’t Americans (bonus points for the Colbert-eque claims to not see color, just sports fans). Australia, the totally post-racial society, eh, eh? . Where have I said anything about what racists do? Do you recognise that a West Indian has nothing in common with a black American beyond the colour of their skin? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/233 "2010-01-07T03:53:47Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > UK ads for KFC have described it as “Soul Food”. They’d never get away with it in the US but the UK doesn’t have the same context, hence: not racist (plus the people eating it were a mixed group). KFC isn’t Soul Food? Let’s look: Good fried chicken? Check. Biscuits? Check. Crappy instant mashed potatoes with nasty gravy? Check. Greens with the “healthy” cooked out of them and enough pig fat to stop your heart but which taste so good you don’t care? Nope. Guess it’s not Soul Food. 😉 ETA: But you can get breaded and fried okra at Church’s Chicken. I was hungry while driving down West Madison this afternoon with hardly a dime in my pocket. Kept passing purveyors of fine, by my lights, cuisine. Nearly broke into tears when I passed [Moo & Oink](http://home.moo-oink.com/home.html) because I knew I couldn’t buy a decent hot link in my suburb. ☹ I also noted that somebody FINALLY sandblasted the century-old sign painted on a wall advertising [Gold Dust Twins](http://www.shorpy.com/images/photos/gdt.jpg) washing powder, but only since the neighborhood has been gentrified. I was stunned when I first saw it 20 years ago because I did not expect to see an unvandalized sign depicting a couple of (offensive, but historical, term warning) [pickaninnies](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny) in the Hood. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/234 "2010-01-07T03:55:17Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > I’d ask you to cite that, but it’s pretty clear you invented it because it sounded good to you. Not that I expect it to do much good, but I’d ask you to refrain from confusing your imagination with my posts. It should be easy, as my posts do not reside in your head. I invented black people in Zimbabwe? I must be good, because now there are millions of them. Go me. > [@](#): > > Of course, as pointed out that’s not only bullshit but laughable bullshit. It seems to be tempting bullshit as several of your cohort are doing your best to pretend that racists will ask for a black person’s nationality before being bigoted against them. I’m only going to explain this once more… but this time, I’ll do it really slowly. Perhaps you’ll be able to follow. NOBODY OUTSIDE THE US THINKS BLACK PEOPLE LOVE FRIED CHICKEN. It doesn’t fucking matter if Joe Q. Klansman thinks a guy from the Ivory Coast loves fried chicken, because NONE OF THE PEOPLE FOR WHOM THIS AD WAS PRODUCED KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT A FRIED CHICKEN STEREOTYPE. Would a black foreigner visiting the US encounter the same prejudices as an African-American? Probably. IT DOESN’T MATTER, because THESE PEOPLE AREN’T AMERICANS, AREN’T VISITING AMERICA, and in all probability never will. ---
**Author:** ![Lobot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@Lobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobot)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/235 "2010-01-07T03:57:41Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > And of course Australia, as pointed out, has quite a continuing history of involvement with American culture, including our media. And a gigantic American company starts an ad campaign that features one bit about placating blacks with friend chicken, and nobody at all along the way noticed… anything? > Still not buying it. Well really, the thread recently about blacks being “'gator-bait” was an eye-opener for me, and I like to think I’m more well-versed in US culture than the average Aussie. But where might this fried chicken stereotype have appeared in exported US pop culture? Popular movies or TV shows? Top 40 radio? Please, enlighten me. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/236 "2010-01-07T03:57:56Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > I still think it’s racist, if not intentionally. Why did all the other audience members have to be black, if it’s about cricket? Because almost everyone from the West Indies (whom Australia play a great deal of cricket against) _is_ black, perhaps? :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > To me, it just looks like the people who made this ad wanted to be provocative or whatever but also wanted to be able to get away with this, so they’re acting as though Americans are the only ones with cultural baggage related to racism. They didn’t and you are. In short, In the ad’s target market, it’s obvious to everyone that the white guy is an Australian team supporter and everyone else is from the Windies. The “sticky situation” is that he’s the sole Australian supporter there, but he bonds with everyone (in “the spirit of the game”) by sharing his KFC and getting into the atmosphere with the West Indians. It’s not racist at all and frankly you lot in the US really need to stop projecting your own issues onto the rest of the planet. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/237 "2010-01-07T03:59:39Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > It does. > I like the shtick better when Colbert does it since he at least realizes it’s autoparody. Compare it to whatever you like, but in this instance it’s really happening. You can’t see beyond the colour of someone’s skin and you think you’re being culturally sensitive. Sometimes a black person is just a black person and sometimes a group of West Indian cricket fans are just a group of West Indian cricket fans. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/238 "2010-01-07T04:08:08Z")
Death ray: stick to your Colbert impersonation. Your Kresksin schtick sucks. > [@Lobot](#): > > But where might this fried chicken stereotype have appeared in exported US pop culture? Popular movies or TV shows? Top 40 radio? Please, enlighten me. Where might I have learned that kidnapping Aboriginal children to raise them in my culture would be frowned upon and have a specific history attached? Surely it is unreasonable for you to ask this of me if it was not shown to me in an Australian TV show… right? ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/239 "2010-01-07T04:09:36Z")
> [@Lobot](#): > > But where might this fried chicken stereotype have appeared in exported US pop culture? Popular movies or TV shows? Top 40 radio? Please, enlighten me. I saw it mentioned in an Iron Man comic once. > [@FinnAgain](#): > > Where might I have learned that kidnapping Aboriginal children to raise them in my culture would be frowned upon and have a specific history attached? Surely it is unreasonable for you to ask this of me if it was not shown to me in an Australian TV show… right? Gee, where might someone get the idea that _kidnapping_ is frowned upon. Just quit digging. You’re embarrassing yourself. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886/240 "2010-01-07T04:12:35Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Gee, where might someone get the idea that _kidnapping_ is frowned upon. Sentences work best when you read all of them instead of stopping when a word… oh, shiny!!! The part about not being totally clueless of Australia’s cultural context (even without Australian Teeveeee shows, go figure) was the relevant one. But you know that, and figured you’d ignore it cuz it looked niftier. And, unless I miss my guess, kidnapping Aboriginals was going on in Australia until the late '60s. Obviously some folks didn’t get the message that kidnapping was wrong. But again, I can’t possibly know that, since it wasn’t on any Australian programming I’ve watched recently. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/no-you-ignoramuses-this-isnt-racist-or-here-we-go-again/523886.md?page=13)