# Nobility in the Americas? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 15, 2006, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225 "2006-12-15T02:11:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/41 "2006-12-21T16:04:41Z")
[QUOTE=Agnostic Pagan] I am ashamed that I completely forgot about our beloved Emperor, especially after Neil Gaiman wrote a wonderful tale about him in the Sandman chronicles. [/QUOTE] He’s also a modern-day character in Chritopher Moore’s comical vampire novel [Bloodsucking Fiends.](http://www.amazon.com/Bloodsucking-Fiends-Christopher-Moore/dp/0060735414/sr=8-1/qid=1166716997/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-4111052-8714213?ie=UTF8&s=books) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/42 "2006-12-21T16:36:35Z")
[QUOTE=Polycarp] Haiti was twice briefly a monarchy. [/QUOTE] Specifically, [Jean-Jacques Dessalines](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Jacques_Dessalines) declared himself Emperor and ruled 1805-1806. [Henri Christophe](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henri_Christophe) ruled as King Henry I from 1811-1820. > [@](#): > > [Henri] also erected a Haïtian Peerage, eventually creating 4 princes, 8 dukes, 22 counts, 37 barons and 14 knights. He also founded a College of Arms to provide armorial bearings to the newly ennobled. In Mexico, after the Mexican War of Independence, Agustin Iturbide briefly ruled as Emperor Agustin I (1822-1823) before being forced to abdicate. Interestingly, Iturbide’s grandson [Agustín de Iturbide y Green](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agust%C3%ADn_de_Iturbide_y_Green) was adopted by Mexico’s other Emperor, [Maximilian I](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximilian_of_Habsburg), previously mentioned, and given the title of “His Highness, Prince of Iturbide.” ---
**Author:** ![Agnostic\_Pagan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c4cdca/32.png) [@Agnostic\_Pagan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agnostic_Pagan)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/43 "2006-12-22T06:06:09Z")
[QUOTE=Lissa] He’s also a modern-day character in Chritopher Moore’s comical vampire novel [Bloodsucking Fiends.](http://www.amazon.com/Bloodsucking-Fiends-Christopher-Moore/dp/0060735414/sr=8-1/qid=1166716997/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-4111052-8714213?ie=UTF8&s=books) [/QUOTE] That author had slipped under my radar, but I will have to track him down now. Thanks for the link. Looks like the [sequel](http://www.amazon.com/You-Suck-Story-Christopher-Moore/dp/0060590297/sr=1-4/qid=1166767073/ref=sr_1_4/104-9132921-6780708?ie=UTF8&s=books) is coming out soon. (Just in time to miss the holidays! Way to go publisher, YAY!!!) ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/44 "2006-12-22T10:33:08Z")
[QUOTE=Polycarp] There is a probably moribund difference between Viceroy and the assorted Governor roles, including Governor General, in terms of the personal embodiment of sovereignty and the exercise of elements of the royal prerogative – and I’m not totally clear on the details there, or when they would have applied while still significant. Someone who’s a real expert on British or Spanish constitutional law might want to sort out the distinction; for our purposes in this thread, suffice it to say that there **was** a difference in empowerment and delegated authority, and it no longer has any practical meaning. [/QUOTE] ? I would actually have said that the “Governor General” is quite close to it, with exceptions related not to how important his position is, but to how important the position of the King is and to whether the location governed has a Parliament. Examples, both are from the Habsburgs and early Borbones, XV-XVIII centuries, at which time the American Colonies were part of the Crown of Castilla and therefore did not have Parliaments, but Navarra was its own Kingdom with its own Parliament: the Virreyes de Navarra had many of the Rights and Duties of the King. They could not call Parliament; since country-wide laws had to be approved by Parliament, they could also not create new laws nor change existing ones… but neither could the King! (which pissed Phillip V no end) the Virreyes de Nueva España (Mexico) again had most of the Rights and Duties of the King. There were some local-level laws they could create, valid only in their territory, but this was considered a “delegation” of the King’s powers. Those laws could not contradict Castillian Law (similar to how nowadays the laws of the Autonomous Regions can not contradict those of Spain). Logically I’m not very familiar with the Australian and Canadian legal systems, but to me the differences between a General Governor in a British Commonwealth country and a Virrey de las Españas seems to be more linked to the different definition of the _King’s_ job - both the General Governor and the Virrey are the King’s personal delegate/representative. It’s only that nowadays Kings are more “decorative” and things like lawmaking rest in other hands. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/45 "2006-12-22T16:50:22Z")
Despite the Constitution’s Art. I, Sec. 9, cl. 8 provision that “no title of nobility shall be granted by the United States,” of _course_ we’ve had a King: [http://www.memphisflyer.com/binary/d8ca35ad/elvis-presley-2.jpg](http://www.memphisflyer.com/binary/d8ca35ad/elvis-presley-2.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Ol\_Gaffer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Ol\_Gaffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ol_Gaffer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/46 "2006-12-22T18:26:57Z")
[QUOTE=lokij] Not strictly in reply to your op but I thought it deserved an honorable mention. Josiah Harlan was the first American to visit Afghanistan and after an amazing real life adventure was briefly crowned king of the Hazara tribe, later given the title “Prince of Ghor” in perpetuity. [/QUOTE] Hi great-great-great grandson is the actor [Scott Reiniger](http://imdb.com/name/nm0718203/) who starred in George Romero’s **Dawn of the Dead**. ---
**Author:** ![Will\_Repair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a698b9/32.png) [@Will\_Repair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Will_Repair)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225/47 "2006-12-22T21:24:11Z")
According to [American Royalty](http://americanroyalty.com/) there can only be 50 (plus 10 corporations.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobility-in-the-americas/384225.md?page=2)