# "Nobody really knows what happens after death." Is that just pc BS? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 9, 2012, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278 "2012-03-09T15:39:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/201 "2014-11-21T19:31:07Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Can you support this declarative statement? In what way does the verifiable evidence collected so far not support the claim? Maybe I should rephrase, his argument is logically faulty as to know if his statement is true it would require proof of what life is and consciousness is. I have not seen such proof given, hence the lack of veritable evidence to substinaiaite the claim. Going further if the OP is indeed correct, such evidence should be obtainable. The fact that we don’t ahve such proof does not negate it, but does not prove it either. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/202 "2014-11-21T19:34:50Z")
Here is the whole of the OP: > [@Shakes](#): > > Is this just something Atheist are supposed to say out of respect for theists? > > I’m not condoning being an “in your face” Atheist. I just find it rather dubious that whenever people DO engage in religious debate; Atheists in general don’t want to say “Once you’re dead, that’s it.” > > I see that on this board even. Why is that? Please point out where he makes an argument, or even uses the word “proof”. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/203 "2014-11-21T19:59:47Z")
OK, you got me there. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/204 "2014-11-21T20:16:51Z")
What you’ve given _is_ a common argument from those who believe in an afterlife: after scientists carefully spend time, money and effort gathering verifiable evidence, and all said evidence points towards a conclusion not favorable towards the believers, the believers then step in and arbitrarily change the word “evidence” to “proof”, saying “You said you could prove that there was no life after death, and you can’t! That means our point of view is absolutely equal to yours!”…which of course is only true if all the evidence is ignored, and fact and blind conjecture are given equal footing. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/205 "2014-11-21T20:35:30Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What you’ve given _is_ a common argument from those who believe in an afterlife: after scientists carefully spend time, money and effort gathering verifiable evidence, and all said evidence points towards a conclusion not favorable towards the believers, the believers then step in and arbitrarily change the word “evidence” to “proof”, saying “You said you could prove that there was no life after death, and you can’t! That means our point of view is absolutely equal to yours!”…which of course is only true if all the evidence is ignored, and fact and blind conjecture are given equal footing. Now you are changing the subject, I never said nor went into proof of life after death, simply ‘what is life’ is needed to be defined and proven to go any further - and that should be achievable if life is strictly the biological system. Without being able to define life you are going to have a heck of a time defining or negating afterlife. Also you neglected the OP’s subject in your above retstatment of the OP: > [@](#): > > “Nobody really knows what happens after death.” Is that just pc BS? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/206 "2014-11-21T20:40:27Z")
1.And how would we go about “proving” what life was to your satisfaction? At what point would you be satisfied enough that a proper definition could be had? 2. What would it take to prove to you that there is no afterlife? ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/207 "2014-11-21T22:12:33Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Now you are changing the subject, I never said nor went into proof of life after death, simply ‘what is life’ is needed to be defined and proven to go any further - and that should be achievable if life is strictly the biological system. Without being able to define life you are going to have a heck of a time defining or negating afterlife. > > Also you neglected the OP’s subject in your above retstatment of the OP: I’m not following you. The OP is talking about human life. What issue do you have in distinguishing a living human from a dead one that is relevant to this topic? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/208 "2014-11-21T22:20:25Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > 1.And how would we go about “proving” what life was to your satisfaction? At what point would you be satisfied enough that a proper definition could be had? Not my satisfaction, there should be a scientific method of doing so. So far life is on the same ‘define-ability’ level as autism, we know it exists and we can list signs and symptom of it, but we have no idea of what it is nor can we make a 100% diagnosis. That’s a problem, a really big one. > [@](#): > > 1. What would it take to prove to you that there is no afterlife? Well afterlife, is what happens after life, so define what life is. OK that last one is a bit of a snark - but not really, as afterlife refers to the dieing of the bio-organism, and what happens to that conscientiousness that was there. But still it is incumbent on you to define what life is. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/209 "2014-11-21T22:27:55Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > I’m not following you. The OP is talking about human life. What issue do you have in distinguishing a living human from a dead one that is relevant to this topic? What is human life? If you define it you have either have to prove it or you set a definition based on the conclusion you wish. The former has not been done AFAIK, the latter is a belief. This goes to the SUBJECT of the OP more then the OP’s opening post. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/210 "2014-11-21T22:30:05Z")
^ If a loved one left you with the responsibility of taking care of his remains when he died, how difficult of a time would you have in knowing when you should give the okay to bury him? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/211 "2014-11-21T22:32:55Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Not my satisfaction, there should be a scientific method of doing so. So far life is on the same ‘define-ability’ level as autism, we know it exists and we can list signs and symptom of it, but we have no idea of what it is nor can we make a 100% diagnosis. That’s a problem, a really big one. > > Well afterlife, is what happens after life, so define what life is. > > OK that last one is a bit of a snark - but not really, as afterlife refers to the dieing of the bio-organism, and what happens to that conscientiousness that was there. But still it is incumbent on you to define what life is. [This definition of “Life” works for me.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life) Death is the termination of all biological functions that sustain a living organism. “Afterlife” is the belief that some have that their consciousness continues after death. Once again I ask you: What would it take to prove to you that there is no “afterlife”? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/212 "2014-11-21T22:40:03Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > [This definition of “Life” works for me.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life) > Death is the termination of all biological functions that sustain a living organism. > “Afterlife” is the belief that some have that their consciousness continues after death. > Once again I ask you: What would it take to prove to you that there is no “afterlife”? What definition of life did you give there, I don’t see one 😕 ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/213 "2014-11-21T22:41:08Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > What definition of life did you give there, I don’t see one 😕 You didn’t answer my question. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/214 "2014-11-21T22:42:11Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > What definition of life did you give there, I don’t see one 😕 You don’t see the first sentence? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/215 "2014-11-21T22:43:42Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > ^ If a loved one left you with the responsibility of taking care of his remains when he died, how difficult of a time would you have in knowing when you should give the okay to bury him? If I chose to bury him that is. But really no issue in that respect we have customs and laws that I would honor. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/216 "2014-11-21T22:45:29Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > If I chose to bury him that is. But really no issue in that respect we have customs and laws that I would honor. You’re avoiding answering the question. What changes would happen to your loved one that you would know that it’s okay to bury him? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/217 "2014-11-21T22:46:15Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > You don’t see the first sentence? I see the definition of death and afterlife. Perhaps some ad blocking software is blocking the part where Czarcasm says Life is… ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/218 "2014-11-21T22:49:58Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > You’re avoiding answering the question. What changes would happen to your loved one that you would know that it’s okay to bury him? No now you are changing the subject from your original question. My answer remains, I would follow local laws and customs. We have some set of guidelines which Dr’s are trained in, they are not 100% but they work for most cases, and I would use them because that is what we accept absent of really knowing and understanding and perhaps the best we can do at this time. And I am at peace with that. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2014, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/219 "2014-11-21T22:54:05Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > No now you are changing the subject from your original question. My answer remains, I would follow local laws and customs. We have some set of guidelines which Dr’s are trained in, they are not 100% but they work for most cases, and I would use them as that is what we accept and perhaps the best we can do at this time. :rolleyes: Well, those changes are the changes the OP is talking about. The OP is regarding what happens when a human goes from the former state to the latter. No requirement to define life to your satisfaction that I’m sure you’ll argue with once you figure out how to click on the link you’ve already been provided with is necessary to discuss the OP. ---
**Author:** ![zardac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/dfb087/32.png) [@zardac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zardac)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2014, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278/220 "2014-11-22T04:26:58Z")
just because it’s likely to elicit a dreary response about someone’s heartfelt religious faith…which would make me want to plug my ears with my fingers- while shouting out the words to Jingle Bells- just to avoid hearing the impending proselytization. Nevertheless, when I was a kid, I had a “near death experience” that included most of the salient features reported by true believers. At that time I woke up feeling assured of the existence of god, heaven, and an afterlife. As an adult I became aware and accepting of the prosaic neurological/asphyxia/dying brain cell explanations, and subsequently gave up all hope of ever dating Janis Joplin in heaven. Yet the experience I remember still seems like a significant one, and I think that experience (be it a few seconds, or minutes, or an eternity) followed by Bolivia\* would be a good enough afterlife. \*when discussing retirement, Mike Tyson opined that he would just fade into Bolivian. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nobody-really-knows-what-happens-after-death-is-that-just-pc-bs/615278.md?page=12)