# Non-Americans Voting in US Election **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 24, 2004, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060 "2004-03-24T02:48:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/21 "2004-03-25T19:07:49Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > The fact that your name is on a list only means that you are registered to vote, which is easy for non-citizens to do. As for showing your license when you vote, non-citizens can get driver’s licenses too, you know. I don’t see where anything I reported was “misinformation”; I had first hand experience with exactly the kind of voter fraud described in the article. If you have evidence that what was reported is false, you are free to present it. Which state allows non-citizens to register to vote? And which state allows non-citizens to obtain drivers licenses? ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/22 "2004-03-25T19:11:33Z")
We do use the terms North American or South American to refer to people in the aggregate. But the individual countries have perfectly serviceable names in English that we can use–why not use them? Besides, the people of this part of the world have been using the term before there even was a USA; I think there’s a Cotton Mather cite from the late 1600’s. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/23 "2004-03-25T19:40:44Z")
What in Christ’s name are you talking about? I have travelled extensively throughout Canada, the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, Mexico, Central and South America, Europe, South West Asia, The Carribien, and polynesia. Never, not once hase anybody expressed confusion when I stated I was American. They new exactly which country I was refering to. While it may be a topic for anal debate between college students, the rest of the world has little difficulty understanding what it means when someone says America did X, or I am from America. Anyone that thinks the speaker is talking about Bolivia or Canada is to stupid to be talking to. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/24 "2004-03-25T19:47:15Z")
Which is what she said. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/25 "2004-03-25T21:11:03Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > And which state allows non-citizens to obtain drivers licenses? Um…all of them actually. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/26 "2004-03-25T21:22:26Z")
And resident aliens can get Social Security numbers, too. **Sis** , if there were an equally-convenient, less-“confusing”, but _more_-apt name for Americans to use, I’m sure you could provide it. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/27 "2004-03-25T21:23:54Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > Um…all of them actually. [buzzer sound from that show with richard Dawson] WRONG ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/28 "2004-03-25T21:33:10Z")
Given that **Neurotik** is closer to N/50 than you, I award points to **Neurotik**. Besides I think I can dig up my Wisconsin one if I have too. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/29 "2004-03-25T21:39:32Z")
::red faced, and embarassed:: Neuro is right, I was thinking about which states allow non citizens to vote, and blurted something stupid, sorry. Gray:How in hell can you know how close I am to n/50? I am not challenging you I would just like to know how you could know. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/30 "2004-03-25T21:46:27Z")
I’m currently sitting at work with a large turbin on my head and an envelope in my hand. 🙂 And I took this > [@askeptic](#): > > And which state allows non-citizens to obtain drivers licenses? to mean M/50 where M \<=9. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/31 "2004-03-25T22:00:10Z")
> [@Sisyphus' Stone](#): > > Grey asserts: > > Not lazy, just resentful on behalf of all North and South Americans whose entitlement to the sobriquet, ‘American’ has been usurped by the most insensitive and greedy of nations on the globe. I really, really hope I’m being wooshed here. Because sliming attacks like this are better suited to the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/32 "2004-03-25T22:05:23Z")
Whoops, look at that last post. I was quoting **Sysiphus’ Stone** , but it looks like I’m quoting **Grey**. **Grey** didn’t slime us, it was **SS**. Sorry about that, **Grey**. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/33 "2004-03-25T22:09:38Z")
> [@Sisyphus' Stone](#): > > Not lazy, just resentful on behalf of all North and South Americans whose entitlement to the sobriquet, ‘American’ has been usurped by the most insensitive and greedy of nations on the globe. Ah. So you aren’t really interested in the balancing of global and national and local interests, you just like insulting Americans. Good day to you, sir. ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/34 "2004-03-25T22:17:28Z")
\*\*Grey \*\* > [@](#): > > Oh well then my apologies. I suggest you go have a talk with Aldebaran and get that whole moronic thing standardized. [Moderator Hat ON] Grey, do NOT call other posters moronic in this forum. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/35 "2004-03-25T22:20:23Z")
[Moderator Hat hurriedly put back ON] Actually, upon further review I see Grey was referring to the term “USer’s” as moronic, not any poster. Saying that is fine. Sorry, Grey. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/36 "2004-03-25T22:24:00Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > “Usurped” is much too strong a word. I would call it the natural evolution of a language. The word “American” now means “a citizen of the USA”. That’s true even among people who live in the other nations of North and South America. For example, I lived in Canada for five years, and I assure you that the normal word we used to refer to people south of the border was “American”. We’d complain about all the American tourists, for example. > > Logically, I agree, “American” should be used for a resident of the entire continents. But language is not always logical. > > Ed Canada → Canadian (or Canadien) Mexico → Mexican Brazil → Brazillian Honduras → Honduran Argentina → Argentinian …etc… but, USA → USA’er? …ugh. United States → United Statesian? …uh, no. United States of America → United States of American? …uh, not quite, but cut that down to ‘American’ out of laziness to write the whole phrase. There is some logic to this… Better yet, just call us Vespuccians for laughs… Or just dig up our founding fathers and beeatch-slap 'em a few times for this oversight… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/37 "2004-03-25T22:35:27Z")
Look, is there any country on Earth that **does** allow non-citizens to vote in its elections? (I mean, as a matter of law or policy, not as a practical result of oversights in the registration process.) ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/38 "2004-03-25T23:23:04Z")
> [@Sisyphus' Stone](#): > > Other countries, on the other hand, stand to gain and/or lose significantly, depending on the successful candidate. You’re right, the “re-election” of Saddam and the “theocratical election” (read as “installment”) of Afghanistan leadership, both pre-2002, significantly affected other countries as well. To bad we didn’t take polls on these elections…dang, another missed opportunity… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/39 "2004-03-25T23:25:06Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > ::red faced, and embarassed:: Neuro is right, I was thinking about which states allow non citizens to vote, and blurted something stupid, sorry. > > Gray:How in hell can you know how close I am to n/50? I am not challenging you I would just like to know how you could know. S’okay. It happens. But what is this n/50 you two lunatics are babbling about? ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060/40 "2004-03-26T00:16:21Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > S’okay. It happens. > > But what is this n/50 you two lunatics are babbling about? ::still a little chagrined:: as to the n/50…beats me I was just going with the flow… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-americans-voting-in-us-election/236060.md?page=3)