# Non-newtonian fluid.. could it be clear? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 31, 2007, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683 "2007-10-31T06:20:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Chrismoody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f6c823/32.png) [@Chrismoody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chrismoody)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/1 "2007-10-31T06:20:25Z")
[I got distracted](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=442256) but now to the real reason I came to the SDMB this evening… Non-newtonian liquid Mythbusters did a piece on it using corn starch (and food dye… but that doesn’t matter). I also saw [a piece on youtube](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2XQ97XHjVw) using an unidentified additive. I don’t know if its corn starch or not. Is there an additive that you could use that would be _clear_? Obviously, corn starch is out. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/2 "2007-10-31T06:57:14Z")
Shear-thickening fluids (dilatant fluids) are rare, so the choices are few. There are some that claim to be, but I’ve never seen them. Senson, a protective coating for metals, is one example; another might be the new generation of impact-resistant compounds like 3D0. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/3 "2007-10-31T06:57:40Z")
My guess is probably not, at least for a non-Newtonian liquid which behaves the same way (there’s only one way to be Newtonian, but countless ways to be non). Ooblek (cornstarch solution) behaves the way it does because of (relatively) long polymer strands in the fluid, which tangle together. Those polymers will also scatter light haphazardly, making the mixture appear to be milky white. ---
**Author:** ![Chrismoody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f6c823/32.png) [@Chrismoody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chrismoody)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/4 "2007-10-31T07:04:02Z")
Anything approaching something of water? Even water you see in a pool that hasn’t been cleaned in a week? Just something that doesn’t look like milk? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/5 "2007-10-31T11:03:40Z")
As Chronos mentions, there are many ways to be non-Newtonian. IIRC, liquids like honey and highly viscous oils display non-Newtonian behavior. It “folds up” or “copils up” when you pour it into itself, making folds or self-coiling loops that rest on top of the fluid for a while before “melting” into the general body of the lquid. These liquids are definitely clear. But I wouldn’t try walking on them a la _Mythbusters_. Jearl Walker’s **Flying Circus of Physics** has mini-sections devoted to these liquids, with references. In my youth there was a competitor to Silly Putty that sold under the name “Flubber” (This was for the _first_ version of Disney’s **The Absent Minded Professor/Flubber** , a movie they’ve done three times now, to show you how long ago that was). It behaved much like Silly Putty, which is a non-Newtonian fluid that you probably _could_ walk on. Only “Flubber” was transparent. I have no idea what it was made of. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/6 "2007-10-31T12:21:26Z")
Coiling behavior of non-newtonian (and clear) fluids: [http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/1742-5468/2006/10/N10001/jstat6\_10\_n10001.html](http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/1742-5468/2006/10/N10001/jstat6_10_n10001.html) Hair Gel is apparently a non-newtonian fluid, although _shear-thinning_, rather than _shear-thickening_, as cornstarch + water is: > [@](#): > > Pseudoplastic, or shear-thinning fluids have a lower apparent viscosity at higher shear rates, and are usually solutions of large, polymeric molecules in a solvent with smaller molecules. It is generally supposed that the large molecular chains tumble at random and affect large volumes of fluid under low shear, but that they gradually align themselves in the direction of increasing shear and produce less resistance. > > A common household example of a strongly shear-thinning fluid is styling gel, which primarily composed of water and a fixative such as a vinyl acetate/vinylpyrrolidone copolymer (PVP/PA). If one were to hold a sample of hair gel in one hand and a sample of corn syrup or glycerine in the other, they would find that the hair gel is much harder to pour off the fingers (a low shear application), but that it produces much less resistance when rubbed between the fingers (a high shear application). > **[Power-law fluid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-law_fluid)** > > In continuum mechanics, a power-law fluid, or the Ostwald–de Waele relationship, is a type of generalized Newtonian fluid. This mathematical relationship is useful because of its simplicity, but only approximately describes the behaviour of a real non-Newtonian fluid. Power-law fluids can be subdivided into three different types of fluids based on the value of their flow behaviour index: pseudoplastic, Newtonian fluid, and dilatant. A first-order fluid is a power-law fluid with exponential depen... That’s a clear non-newtonian fluid. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/7 "2007-10-31T12:24:48Z")
More Shear-Thinning clear Newtonian fluids: [http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/1742-5468/2006/07/P07007/jstat6\_07\_p07007.html](http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/1742-5468/2006/07/P07007/jstat6_07_p07007.html) I completely forgot about shampoos! But all these examples are the opposite of that corn starch and water mix, aside from the “Flubber” of my youth. Bt I’ll see if I can find any other clear shear-thickening examples. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/8 "2007-10-31T12:32:34Z")
Googling “shear thickening” and “transparent” (It’s fun! Try it!) yields lots of papers like this one (which itself says that there are lots of papers like it) about shear-thickening fluids that are transparent: [http://www.physics.nyu.edu/pine/reprints/1998-09-00-JOR-Hu-I.pdf](http://www.physics.nyu.edu/pine/reprints/1998-09-00-JOR-Hu-I.pdf) This study uses “tris 2-hydroxyethyl) tallowackyl ammonium acetate” (TTAA) mixed with sodium salicylate, which is not something you run into every day (I love the “tallowackyl” part). Here’s a buncha other papers: [http://search.yahoo.com/search;\_ylt=A0geu5C7cShHV7EA\_QZXNyoA?p="shear-thickening"+transparent&fr=yfp-t-471](http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0geu5C7cShHV7EA_QZXNyoA?p=%22shear-thickening%22+transparent&fr=yfp-t-471) ---
**Author:** ![bbs2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e495f1/32.png) [@bbs2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bbs2k)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2007, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-newtonian-fluid-could-it-be-clear/424683/9 "2007-10-31T13:17:47Z")
Ah, the rare but beautiful quadruple post. Take it in kids, we don’t see these very often, especially such poignant ones rather than just ramblings. _:: Looks in awe ::_