# Non-Racist Trump voters wondering why they're getting shit about racism **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 14, 2016, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963 "2016-11-14T14:57:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2016, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/81 "2016-11-17T19:47:38Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > But you just did it, didn’t you? You’re noting, _right there,_ that racism is a subset of “bigotry”. You add that it has a lot in common with other forms of “bigotry”. You go on to note at the end that, even if we do for some reason use “racism” to cover this, it still wouldn’t describe other “bigots” who despise, for example, homosexuals. > > So why not just use “bigots” and “bigotry” to be accurate with accuracy? If you prefer to use “bigot” instead of “racist” in certain cases, I’m cool with that. But one of the big current hot buttons is the treatment of Muslims (and the tragic case of Syrian refugees as part of that) and, as I noted, the hate and fear that is advanced by the Trumpsters is very closely aligned with racism. I would prefer to use the term “racist” in this specific context precisely because “bigot” is too broad a term and “racist” here actually conveys a more accurate sense of the intended meaning. I might call someone a “bigot” because he’s exclusively a baseball fanatic and refuses to acknowledge what a fantastic sport hockey is despite knowing nothing about it – the word can mean almost anything relating to prejudicial opinion. Whereas “racist” in the context of Islamophobia seems to convey the intended sense of an ignorant, offensive assault on the human rights of the foreign and the different. ---
**Author:** ![Neo-Calredic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/96bed5/32.png) [@Neo-Calredic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neo-Calredic)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2016, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/82 "2016-11-17T19:59:05Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > I don’t know what was the biggest slap of the face to me last Weds morning. Finding out that nearly half the electorate voted for the most hateful windbag of malfeasant incompetence I’ve ever seen in my lifetime or finding out so many Dems think the real problem is that “we” aren’t sweet talking whites enough. > > And while black folks like me are now contemplating the implications of a President who advocates “stop and frisk” despite its unconstitutionality, while also reeling from an America with cops who will now feel even more empowered to kill us in the name of law and order, we can’t even express outrage at the people who made this happen without hearing people from our own party cry “calling them names is why we lost the election! Wah!” To the extent that I can as a white guy, I share your anger over this and apologize for the stupidity of this country. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2016, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/83 "2016-11-17T21:29:27Z")
Doesn’t matter, wrong is wrong. If black people appreciate our help, that’s good, if they don’t, well, that’s up to them. Can’t say as I can blame them, but its not why I do it. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2016, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/84 "2016-11-17T21:47:08Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > Of course, if you never manage to see any racism/sexism even when it is right in front of you, then yes, you will disappoint. How are you feeling about Steve Bannon’s appointment, if I may ask? > [@Shodan](#): > > As mentioned, I will wait until \*\*\*I see \*\*\*a politician put forth a racist or sexist position, and then speak against it. From Bannon? I think you might see something if you look. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2016, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/85 "2016-11-17T21:55:03Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > From Bannon? I think you might see something if you look. Some people work very hard to not look. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/86 "2016-11-18T10:29:54Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > As mentioned, I will wait until \*\*\*I see \*\*\*a politician put forth a racist or sexist position, and then speak against it. > > What is right in front of me might not be the same as what is right in front of you. > > Regards, > Shodan Like appointing Steve Bannon to a position in the white house? ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bruce\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/87 "2016-11-18T13:40:40Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > No one didn’t vote Clinton because of BLM. Please. I know a few police officers who didn’t vote for Clinton because of BLM movement. From what I’ve seen the Mayor of NYC doesn’t have a lot of support from the police either. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/88 "2016-11-18T15:01:30Z")
> [@Neo-Calredic](#): > > To the extent that I can as a white guy, I share your anger over this and apologize for the stupidity of this country. ☹ To the extent that it matters, I’m relieved that you and others are also angry. ---
**Author:** ![irae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f0a364/32.png) [@irae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irae)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/89 "2016-11-18T20:20:13Z")
What I find odd is that, while I’ve heard no end of TRUMPublicans decry HRC’s ‘deplorables’ comment, I’ve never heard even one claim to represent the _other_ half of Trump’s voters. ---
**Author:** ![UberArchetype](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/2bfe46/32.png) [@UberArchetype](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UberArchetype)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/90 "2016-11-18T20:40:23Z")
Starting to look like [Living in the Past](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsCyC1dZiN8) is going to be a mighty frustrating, ongoing debacle for alot of you cretins. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/91 "2016-11-18T21:25:28Z")
> [@irae](#): > > What I find odd is that, while I’ve heard no end of TRUMPublicans decry HRC’s ‘deplorables’ comment, I’ve never heard even one claim to represent the _other_ half of Trump’s voters. That’s because they don’t exist. Hillary was being _generous._ ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/92 "2016-11-18T21:36:24Z")
Came across this nugget of insight on Reddit. For those inclined to see Nazis as an entirely different species from Trump supporters (because reasons), the point might be lost on you. But for everyone else, perhaps it will be a good reminder that 1) people are amazingly skilled at self-delusion and rationalization and 2) history repeats itself. > [@Factoid from Reddit](#): > > In 1938, just after Kristallnacht, the psychologist Muller-Claudius interviewed 41 randomly selected Nazi Party members on their attitudes towards racial persecution. Of the interviewed party-members 63% expressed extreme indignation against it, while only 5% expressed approval of racial persecution, the rest being noncommittal. A study conducted in 1933 had then shown that 33% of Nazi Party members held no racial prejudice while 13% supported persecution. The poster didn’t supply a cite for this, but I corroborated [here](https://books.google.com/books?id=01mCQQZ8YeEC&pg=PA11&lpg=PA11&dq=Muller-Claudius+nazi&source=bl&ots=mEfIFg29MG&sig=0c798Qv6JhwpCimnETB8-qhzM6s&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiR4aPGmbPQAhUB-WMKHdPeDVQQ6AEIKTAC#v=onepage&q=Muller-Claudius%20nazi&f=false). If we could go back in time, what would be the appropriate message to send the 63% of Nazi members who profess to being against racial persecution? The first thing I’d tell them is how history ended up judging them. I’d tell them what the Nazi name has come to mean in the 21st century. I’d tell them that because of what was done in the name of Nazism, every member of that party is painted with the same brush as the 5% honest enough to admit what they wanted, and _no one gives a goddamn if people signed up for non-racist reasons_. Then I would make clear to them that by maintaining allegiance with the Nazis, they accept moral responsibilty for everything done in the name of that party’s cause. So unless they want the slaughter of 11 million people weighing on their conscience for as long as the live and possibly beyond, they need to wake up and get the fuck out. And join those opposing Hilter. Anyone here think the message should be something else? Something softer, something less inclined to hurt their feelings? If you were a “good” Nazi member, what would you need to hear to change your mind? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/93 "2016-11-18T21:50:14Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > If you were a “good” Nazi member, what would you need to hear to change your mind? History showed that it required hearing the American and British forces heading into downtown Berlin. I do hope their wake-up call does not need to be so disruptive. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/94 "2016-11-18T22:21:26Z")
I’m willing to give Trump voters – my fellow Americans – the benefit of the doubt, and that they didn’t vote for Trump because he and they were racists. I believe that they honed in on his message of trade deals/bring the jobs back, and everything else was just noise. They were willing to peel off the racism, misogyny and xenophobia, like leaves on an artichoke, to get to the heart of American Jobs. Somebody on The Daily Show summarized this best: “hey, immigrants, minorities, women…we don’t \*hate \*you. We just _don’t care_ about you.” ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2016, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/95 "2016-11-18T23:58:06Z")
There are no non racist Trump voters. Throwing your support behind someone sprouting racist things and promising racist policies and surrounding himself with fellow racists is a blatantly racist act. Supporting racism makes you a racist, period. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2016, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/96 "2016-11-19T00:13:12Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > There are no non racist Trump voters. Throwing your support behind someone sprouting racist things and promising racist policies and surrounding himself with fellow racists is a blatantly racist act. Supporting racism makes you a racist, period. This. it’s not like he was remotely subtle about it. But it’s clear that a lot of people wouldn’t call him a racist even if he carved a swastika on his forehead and used black babies for targets in skeet shooting. ---
**Author:** ![HeweyLogan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heweylogan/32/547_2.png) [@HeweyLogan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeweyLogan)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2016, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/97 "2016-11-19T02:13:27Z")
You’re insane. Completely nuts. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2016, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/98 "2016-11-19T02:18:31Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > History showed that it required hearing the American and British forces heading into downtown Berlin. I do hope their wake-up call does not need to be so disruptive. Er, Russian, actually. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2016, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/99 "2016-11-19T02:35:48Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > Starting to look like [Living in the Past](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsCyC1dZiN8) is going to be a mighty frustrating, ongoing debacle for alot of you cretins. Dumb fuck complains about people living in the past, posts a song from 1969. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2016, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963/100 "2016-11-19T03:27:11Z")
> [@Bruce\_Wayne](#): > > Please. I know a few police officers who didn’t vote for Clinton because of BLM movement. From what I’ve seen the Mayor of NYC doesn’t have a lot of support from the police either. First off, I seriously doubt you do. You aren’t exactly the most honest poster here. But let’s say you think you do. Go ask them. Say “if it wasn’t for BLM, would you have voted for Clinton?” I guarantee you they will not say yes. BLM is not why they didn’t vote for Clinton. If BLM were some big reason, it would be cited everywhere as the reason. Yet no one is doing it. There were some small stories that didn’t catch on early on. But there were as many saying that Clinton hated BLM. Seriously, BLM was not why Clinton lost. It just wasn’t. She lost because more Democrats wouldn’t vote for her than Republicans who wouldn’t vote for Trump. She lost because Democrats hate her. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-racist-trump-voters-wondering-why-theyre-getting-shit-about-racism/771963.md?page=6)