# Non-smokers: How rampant and how deep is the smoker hate? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 27, 2012, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317 "2012-11-27T22:20:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/322 "2018-10-30T20:18:35Z")
> [@Crazy\_Canuck](#): > > Maybe, just maybe, the threat of spending years in jail for possession has something to do with that. If your name is accurate, that’s not a threat at all in your country anymore. It’s certainly not a threat in a number of US states now. But pot smokers don’t seem to demand extra infrastructure and the right to smoke in doorways the way tobacco addicts do, although I imagine in some places they take advantage of tobacco-use infrastructure. ---
**Author:** ![gracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8e7dd6/32.png) [@gracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gracer)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/323 "2018-10-30T22:33:28Z")
> [@Crazy\_Canuck](#): > > You don’t hate us, you just don’t think we’re human enough to be capable of love or caring for others? That’s some mighty big dehumanizing going on. I’d honestly rather be hated than not even considered human. That’s probably the real reason why “many” smokers consider you mean, not their addiction. I did explain it pretty thoroughly there, you just snipped it off. I’m not dehumanising, I’m saying this is an effect of the addiction. In any other situation, someone trying to poison someone else would not be considered being loving and considerate and caring. Smoking gets a pass. Obviously I understand that smokers have the same range of feelings non-smokers have, but due to their addiction they do not have the same capacity for considerate behaviour. You can feel loads of love for people around you but if you can’t seem to stop burning holes in their flesh, what does that say? It even gets a pass from me, because I continue to care for people who smoke. Also, I never, ever, ever say this to smokers. What I say to smokers that sets them off is “sorry, yes, it would bother me just now, thanks for understanding.” ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/324 "2018-10-30T23:13:26Z")
My attitude toward smokers isn’t hatred, it’s more, “Shit, people still do that?” ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/325 "2018-10-31T05:05:59Z")
I don’t automatically hate smokers. But as time marches on, it seems to be the dregs left who smoke. Or so it seems where we live now. We live in a large three-building compound in Waikiki, a little over 300 units total. Smoking inside the units is against the rules, I think even for the owners, and there is one smoker’s corner on the grounds, between two of the buildings. The ones who smoke there are largely just a bunch of bums. Few in number, but rednecks and proud of it. ---
**Author:** ![Kimera757](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kimera757/32/3765_2.png) [@Kimera757](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimera757)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/326 "2018-10-31T10:44:34Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > It bothers me to see people so hardened against smokers; it’s an addiction in the worst sense of the word. Have a little compassion. How does the addiction start? When a non-addicted person starts smoking. I don’t have sympathy for people who do stupid things that they know are stupid (such as using an addictive drug for the first time). Maybe they can’t control themselves now, but they should have then. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/327 "2018-10-31T13:26:31Z")
Not to mention, how many people actually like a cigarette the first time they try one? You literally have to force yourself to become an addict by learning to like something that sucks. ---
**Author:** ![gytalf2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ac91a4/32.png) [@gytalf2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gytalf2000)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/328 "2018-10-31T15:11:52Z")
I’m not crazy about the smell, but I can take it in very small doses. I certainly don’t hate smokers! ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/329 "2018-10-31T15:32:21Z")
I don’t hate smokers. I do far worse. I pity them. Addiction is . . . . undignified. Have you ever seen a guy standing outside the smoking section of a restaurant, mooching cigarettes from people passing by? I know, the people giving him smokes don’t mind. Most of them probably feel a sense of camaraderie. But the guy is begging strangers for charity. Because the nicotine is in control of him. ---
**Author:** ![Rhodes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhodes/32/273_2.png) [@Rhodes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhodes)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/330 "2018-10-31T15:39:59Z")
I don’t mind the faint smell of American cigarette smoke. I spent 2 years in Tahiti where the popular brand smelled like piss. I passed by someone smoking a Marlboro and had to slow down a bit to catch another whiff of home. But some smokers just reek. Their clothes, breath, skin, cars. I was struggling not to gag once while talking to a coworker. Then she leaned over to read something on my computer screen, and I dry-heaved loudly. She pretended not to notice. Still, I don’t think it’s fair to say that I _hate_ smokers. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/331 "2018-10-31T15:58:25Z")
Smokers, Fat People, Pedophiles, and Racists are the only people that it can be acceptable to openly hate now. I think it’s sad that people need a group to hate, but there you are. I tend to give smokers a shrug of “it’s your life”, and move on. The only thing that really makes me raise my eyebrows about smokers is when I pass a hospital, and there are people in scrubs standing around outside in the parking lot, sucking on their cancer sticks. I mean, come on! You guys, of all people should know! ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/332 "2018-10-31T16:26:27Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > Smokers, Fat People, Pedophiles, and Racists are the only people that it can be acceptable to openly hate now. I think it’s sad that people need a group to hate, but there you are. > > I tend to give smokers a shrug of “it’s your life”, and move on. The only thing that really makes me raise my eyebrows about smokers is when I pass a hospital, and there are people in scrubs standing around outside in the parking lot, sucking on their cancer sticks. I mean, come on! You guys, of all people should know! There was a bar I used to go to at 7am in the morning. The bar was open that early to accommodate the night shift crowd from a local hospital and manufacturing plant. ALL the nurses there smoked like trains. I kind of sympathize though after hearing all the horrid details of their job. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/333 "2018-10-31T20:03:15Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > ALL the nurses there smoked like trains. I kind of sympathize though after hearing all the horrid details of their job. Most Medical professionals dont smoke anymore. It is false that smoking reduces stress- actually being a nicotine addict causes more stress. ---
**Author:** ![DKW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dkw/32/3118_2.png) [@DKW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DKW)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/334 "2018-11-01T05:11:19Z")
There was far more to hate in the past (the stench more than anything). Now I barely encounter them anymore. Nowadays if you want to start, you’re completely on your own; there isn’t a club, social group, or organization that will endorse that habit, and the advertisements are ancient history. Even vaping has just about completely vanished (and it was vastly more tolerable). As I always thought, this is an industry with no redeeming values, no reason to keep it afloat other than addiction, and propped up by mindless rebelliousness. Now that we have Twitter, there simply isn’t any point anymore. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/335 "2018-11-01T11:02:14Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Most Medical professionals dont smoke anymore. Say what? Most _people_ don’t smoke anymore, and medical professionals are a subset of people. Anecdotally, my daughter, a nonsmoking nurse, tells me that an amazing number of her coworkers smoke. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/336 "2018-11-01T13:47:36Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > Smokers, Fat People, Pedophiles, and Racists are the only people that it can be acceptable to openly hate now. I think it’s sad that people need a group to hate, but there you are. I don’t think see “hate”, at least since efforts to defeat or roll back anti-indoor smoking laws have lost steam. Even the number of public butt-discarders (the world is my ashtray) has dropped a bit. I can’t hate those who’ve contributed so much to pathologists’ income over the years. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/337 "2018-11-01T16:29:42Z")
So for all those who claim they “don’t see the hate,” do you regularly get accused of murder by people who don’t hate you? I don’t. Speaking of … > [@DrDeth](#): > > You are guilty of assisting in the murder of 50000 non-smokers. Murder is the unlawful killing of someone. Since cigarettes are a legal product, it’s not murder by definition. Also, the number is over seven million dead annually worldwide. Fifty thousand is only the number of American non-smokers killed annually. It’s a big world out there, try thinking about the parts outside your borders sometime. I also find it telling how you only care about the non-smokers who died. Do you have no anger for the killing almost half a million American smokers annually? > [@Pantastic](#): > > If your name is accurate, that’s not a threat at all in your country anymore. It’s certainly not a threat in a number of US states now. But pot smokers don’t seem to demand extra infrastructure and the right to smoke in doorways the way tobacco addicts do, although I imagine in some places they take advantage of tobacco-use infrastructure. We’re talking two weeks of legalization compared to 95 years (1923 - 2018) of prohibition. Social norms don’t change that quickly. Also, tobacco has not been proven to cause paranoia in it’s users. Cannabis has. There’s also a difference in the half-life of the drugs, tobacco has a much shorter one which requires more frequent dosing to stay level. Time will tell if the pot smokers get more obnoxious. > [@gracer](#): > > I did explain it pretty thoroughly there, you just snipped it off. I’m not dehumanising, I’m saying this is an effect of the addiction. It’s still the “I don’t hate the sinner, I hate the sin” defense. I don’t find it convincing when religious types use that line to dehumanize me for being queer either. > [@adaher](#): > > Not to mention, how many people actually like a cigarette the first time they try one? You literally have to force yourself to become an addict by learning to like something that sucks. I did. I fucking loved it from day one. Admittedly it’s rare, but it does happen. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/338 "2018-11-01T17:06:27Z")
> [@Crazy\_Canuck](#): > > Murder is the unlawful killing of someone. Since cigarettes are a legal product, it’s not murder by definition. Guns are also a legal product, but if I shoot someone, I’m going to get charged with murder. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/339 "2018-11-01T17:07:21Z")
To be clear, I’m not taking a position one way or the other on “second hand smoke is murder,” I’m just pointing out that, “Legal product = not murder” doesn’t hold water. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/340 "2018-11-01T19:26:36Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > To be clear, I’m not taking a position one way or the other on “second hand smoke is murder,” I’m just pointing out that, “Legal product = not murder” doesn’t hold water. So you want to be clear that if you use an object to commit a crime, it doesn’t matter if that object is legal or not, you have still committed a crime? :rolleyes: A legal product **when used legally** , is by definition, not murder. I should have known better and put the bolded part in from the start, my bad. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317/341 "2018-11-01T19:32:07Z")
> [@Crazy\_Canuck](#): > > … > > A legal product **when used legally** , is by definition, not murder. … Tautology. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-smokers-how-rampant-and-how-deep-is-the-smoker-hate/642317.md?page=18)