# Non-Spoiler Background Thread for Game of Thrones **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 20, 2011, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608 "2011-05-20T18:40:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/1 "2011-05-20T18:40:43Z")
Since we’re absolutely, positively, not-nobody, not-nohow, supposed to post ANYTHING out of the books in the current episode threads for Game of Thrones, and the OTHER Song of Ice and Fire thread is totally spoilerific, I’m opening this thread. The purpose is to ask and answer questions which have a non-spoiler answer, about the background of the GoT world and society. Questions about religion, society, families, kingdoms, distant history (beyond, say, 25 years prior to the beginning of the books and the series), that kind of thing. If the answer to the question would be an actual plot spoiler, the people who know the answer will tell you that in-thread, but not post the spoiler, even under tags. If you really want to know despite that, post so and hopefully someone will PM you the answer. Have at it! ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/2 "2011-05-20T18:59:46Z")
I’ve got one, because I can’t remember if it’s even IN the book. Why did Viserys have a farily large scar across his nipple? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/3 "2011-05-20T19:08:12Z")
Aaaaand the very first question is one I can’t answer! 🙂 I don’t remember a scar from the books. It may just be something the actor already had rather than something that has meaning in the story. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/4 "2011-05-21T02:22:23Z")
Yeah, I don’t remember any mention of a scar. I’ve not noticed it in the show, either. I concur - it’s probably just a scar Harry Lloyd has. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/5 "2011-05-21T03:14:36Z")
Can we talk about what’s been shown in the series so far? I’ll spoil my question in case we can’t. What is Viserys’ game plan with his sister and the Dothraki? [spoiler]He gets his sister to marry Drogo so that he can control the Dothraki army, but it turns out that his sister has a lot more control over the Dothraki than he does. And now King Robert wants to kill Dany’s son? Why not just kill Viserys?[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/6 "2011-05-21T04:37:46Z")
Viserys plan was to put Drogo into his debt by gifting him Dany. Without the Dothraki, he’s harmless. Without Dany, he doesn’t have the Dothraki. And the Dothraki won’t march until the time is right - by all appearances, until Dany gives Drogo an heir. Killing Viserys ending the threat requires Dany having no ambitions of her own, nor for her child. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/7 "2011-05-21T09:52:04Z")
Not to mention that the child is also the rightful heir to the Iron Throne and the heir to the Dothraki leadership position. Long term the unborn child is a bigger threat to Robert’s Kingdom than either Dany or Viserys individually. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/8 "2011-05-21T13:28:42Z")
> [@Lakai](#): > > Can we talk about what’s been shown in the series so far? I’ll spoil my question in case we can’t. > > What is Viserys’ game plan with his sister and the Dothraki? > > [spoiler]He gets his sister to marry Drogo so that he can control the Dothraki army, but it turns out that his sister has a lot more control over the Dothraki than he does. > > And now King Robert wants to kill Dany’s son? Why not just kill Viserys?[/spoiler] He actually straight up traded his sister for a promise of conquering the seven kingdoms for him. He wasn’t just hoping things would somehow work out. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/9 "2011-05-22T00:11:52Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > Not to mention that the child is also the rightful heir to the Iron Throne and the heir to the Dothraki leadership position. Long term the unborn child is a bigger threat to Robert’s Kingdom than either Dany or Viserys individually. Would her child be the rightful heir, though? Vis, certainly, but Dany’s a girl, and girls don’t generally fall into the line of succession in the kingdom, so neither should her kid. Not that you always need to be a rightful heir to stake a claim. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/10 "2011-05-22T01:52:22Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Would her child be the rightful heir, though? Vis, certainly, but Dany’s a girl, and girls don’t generally fall into the line of succession in the kingdom, so neither should her kid. > > Not that you always need to be a rightful heir to stake a claim. That’s actually not usually how it works in the real world, nor in this case. Women often don’t fall into the line of succession, or, they are counted behind males - so, for example, a royal family with children in order of birth being Prince A, Princess B, and Prince C, would see a sucession of A, C, B. There are various levels of female pushing down the line in this way; in Westeros, speaking by and large and generalising, women come after \*any \*men in the line. So a full sister of a current king could well come some tens of much “further” men down the line, like distant cousins. However, while women are pushed down the line, the same is not true of their kids (well, male kids, anyway). In the real world, even if women are discounted entirely, their kids usually aren’t. So, in terms of the Targaryens; if Dany has a boy, the line of succession would go Viserys, Dany’s kid, Dany. If she has a girl, it would go Viserys, Dany, Dany’s kid. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/11 "2011-05-22T13:27:16Z")
Does winter ever come? Do the white walkers ever come into play? Also, is this HBO series the whole Fire and Ice or just the first book? ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/12 "2011-05-22T14:07:37Z")
This season is book 1. By book 4 winter hasn’t come yet. The white walkers are coming into play though. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/13 "2011-05-22T14:07:51Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Does winter ever come? Do the white walkers ever come into play? Also, is this HBO series the whole Fire and Ice or just the first book? Winter is coming. It’s just the first book so far. The series isn’t finished yet, and many think it may never be. I’m not sure if the first season will cover the entire first book or not, I’ve been told it does. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/14 "2011-05-22T14:21:01Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > He actually straight up traded his sister for a promise of conquering the seven kingdoms for him. He wasn’t just hoping things would somehow work out. Well… he \*thought \*he was. Like other nomadic races, the Dothraki don’t completely grasp the concept of commercial transactions. They way they see it, Viserys gave them a gift, and they’re obligated to give him a gift in return - which is \*not \*the same as trading. Viserys never really understands that. ---
**Author:** ![fusoya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecccb3/32.png) [@fusoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fusoya)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/15 "2011-05-22T17:08:35Z")
Yeah, I have a question - was there homo-eroticism between Renly and Ser Loras in the books? I’ve read books 1-3 (book 1 I just re-read before the TV series started) and I don’t remember any… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/16 "2011-05-22T17:13:56Z")
> [@fusoya](#): > > Yeah, I have a question - was there homo-eroticism between Renly and Ser Loras in the books? I’ve read books 1-3 (book 1 I just re-read before the TV series started) and I don’t remember any… It was definitely hinted at (the Hound threatening Loras with putting his sword “in places even Renly hadn’t found”), though we definitely didn’t get a scene like that one in the show! It’s also [Word of God](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WordOfGod)…Martin himself has declared it so in several different venues. ---
**Author:** ![fusoya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecccb3/32.png) [@fusoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fusoya)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/17 "2011-05-22T17:54:30Z")
Hmph, well I guess they just threw in that scene to get more female viewers? ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/18 "2011-05-22T23:20:43Z")
Subtext isn’t easy in a visual medium. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/19 "2011-05-22T23:31:58Z")
There was many many hints. Jamie, Stannis and some others basically throw it in his face several times. Not to mention Renly is shown being really close to Loras but ignoring Margaery completely every time they are together. Like Drain Bead said, it would have been something very hard to do justice on a TV show so we got a sloppy blow job instead. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608/20 "2011-05-23T00:37:50Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Well… he \*thought \*he was. Like other nomadic races, the Dothraki don’t completely grasp the concept of commercial transactions. They way they see it, Viserys gave them a gift, and they’re obligated to give him a gift in return - which is \*not \*the same as trading. Viserys never really understands that. They didn’t exactly sign a contract… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-spoiler-background-thread-for-game-of-thrones/582608.md?page=2)