# Non-tomato Ketchup? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 12, 2002, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759 "2002-03-12T02:34:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/1 "2002-03-12T02:34:43Z")
I was sitting in Fran’s restaurant on College Street in Toronto last week enjoying some shepherds pie, and the server brought over some ketchup. The label had the word Tomato in small print, then KETCHUP in large fancy print. I know (probably from reading it here) that the word ‘ketchup’ came from an east Asian word meaning ‘fish sauce’, though I’m not sure whether tht’s ‘sauce to cover fish with’ or ‘sauce made of fish’. But… Is there such a thing as non-tomato ketchup, so that they had to specify that this particular ketchup contained tomatoes? ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/2 "2002-03-12T02:42:41Z")
You got the right idea. The original _ke-tsiap_ in South China was a fermented fish sauce, like Thai _nam pla_ or Vietnamese _nuoc nâm_. In Malaysia, _kicap_ (same word) is what they call soy sauce. So in a multicultural world, it makes sense to specify when your ketchup is made from tomatoes rather than fish or soy! ---
**Author:** ![Yeah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/dbc845/32.png) [@Yeah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeah)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/3 "2002-03-12T02:42:55Z")
In Malay, kecap (pronounced ketchap) is soy sauce and kecap manis is sweet soy sauce. I don’t think that either one has tomatoes in it. ---
**Author:** ![Operator6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c57346/32.png) [@Operator6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Operator6)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/4 "2002-03-12T02:43:20Z")
Great question!!! When I lived in England,and asked for “Ketchup”, the response was always “Tomato Ketchup?”… and my response was always… “Yes, please!”. I seem to remember something about “Mushroom Ketchup”… I’ll be back in a bit! ---
**Author:** ![Doug\_Bowe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@Doug\_Bowe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_Bowe)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/5 "2002-03-12T02:48:37Z")
Hmmm. The idea of a mushroom ketchup sounds interesting! “…it is important to realize that in the 18th and 19th centuries ketchup was a generic term for sauces whose only common ingredient was vinegar. The word is first recorded in English in 1690 in the form catchup, in 1711 in the form ketchup, and in 1730 in the form catsup. These three spelling variants of a foreign borrowing remain current.” Source: American Heritage Dictionary, Third Edition 1992 ---
**Author:** ![Operator6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c57346/32.png) [@Operator6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Operator6)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/6 "2002-03-12T02:51:19Z")
Check this out: [http://www.epinions.com/content\_1874567300](http://www.epinions.com/content_1874567300) A bit down the page it discusses the different kinds of ketchup: Quote: There were several different kinds of ketchup- from oyster, walnut, lemon, anchovy (barf), and (you guessed it) tomato. It made it into the United Sates in 1792 when a recipe for ketchup was published in a cookbook, and it took off from there. Ketchup was not popular in the states untill Henry John Heinz began mass production in 1876. Today’s Ketchup is nothing like it’s old Chineese counterpart, being made from tomatoes , vinegar, corn syrup, salt, and yadda yadda. It isn’t the fish brine sauce it used to be. Thank the Lord. … O6 ---
**Author:** ![Yeah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/dbc845/32.png) [@Yeah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeah)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/7 "2002-03-12T02:53:09Z")
There is also a “kecap ikan” which is fish ketchup, more or less the same as Nam pla (Thailand), Nuoc nam (Vietnam) and Patis (Philippines). ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/8 "2002-03-12T02:59:06Z")
[Ketchupworld](http://www.ketchupworld.com/) lists a whole lot of non tomato ketchups. I have had a banana ketchup that my kids prefered to the tomato variety for a time. ---
**Author:** ![rjk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ed655f/32.png) [@rjk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjk)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/9 "2002-03-12T04:07:14Z")
I often get Filipino banana ketchup at a couple of food-fair places here in Vancouver. It’s as red as the tomato version, but tastes different enough to notice. (_Not_ like bananas! Maybe that’s partly because it’s the hot version…) ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/10 "2002-03-12T05:10:13Z")
In his recipe book " The Complete Book of Pickles & Relishes" Garden Way Publishing, Leonard Louis Levinson devotes a chapter to catsup. Although tomato catsups dominate the chapter with 7 recipes,including one commercial recipe calling for 600 gallons of tomatos, Levinson shares 22 catsup recipes. Mostly fruit catsups they include [list=14]Garden Catsup apple catsup Hi Opal Grape-Apple Catsup Blackberry Catsup Cranberry Catsup(2) Cucumber Catsup Gooseberry Catsup(2) Guava Catsup Lemon Catsup Mushroom Catsup Green Tomato Catsup Peach Catsup Walnut Catsup [/list] Ohhhhh Walnut Catsup Yummmmm :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/11 "2002-03-12T06:07:46Z")
I’m amazed! So many kinds! SDMB comes through again! I’m gonna hafta sample some of that banana ketchup… ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-tomato-ketchup/97759/12 "2002-03-12T09:46:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Operator6 \* > **I seem to remember something about “Mushroom Ketchup”…** You may be thinking of [Geo. Watkins Mushroom Ketchup](http://www.ketchupworld.com/geowatmusket.html) - I have a bottle of this in the cupboard; it’s not a thick ketchup like tomato sauce, more of a condiment in the nature of Worcester(shire) sauce and is primarily used to flavour meat pies, stews and stocks. There is, of course, [Brown Sauce](http://www.britishtraditionals.com/pickles.htm) (hover your cursor over the names), but I’ve never heard it called ketchup.