# Non-US Dopers: Do You Have 4 Way Stops? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 18, 2009, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838 "2009-01-18T06:13:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/61 "2009-01-20T00:15:35Z")
> [@Petrobey\_Mavromihalis](#): > > There are 4-way stops on minor roads in Greece. Often these are in urban situations where you can’t see whether there is any traffic coming on the road you are crossing. The procedure is to sound your horn and keep going at twice the speed limit. Excellent - this halves the time you are in the junction space, halving your risk of accident! ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/62 "2009-01-20T03:00:07Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > **mnemosyne** , you live in Quebec. Have you ever heard someone in a position of any importance complain about “STOP” on stop signs? Of course not. There are many important unresolved language issues in Canada and Quebec, so please do not reduce them to some idiocies “those French people” do, which in reality nobody cares about. (Of course I’d expect the English Canadian media to focus on these idiocies and not on the real stuff, but that’s a topic for another day.) > > In fact, that’s not even the purpose of this thread, which is “do four-way stop signs exist where you live?” Yes, four-way stop signs are quite common in Quebec, and I suppose in most places in Canada. > > And if “stop” is a word in English and French and every other language, it’s still worth noting that many if not most places have stop signs with a word in the local language on it. I believe I’ve seen a picture of a stop sign in Northern Quebec with Cree writing on it. I was specifically commenting on the words “4 way” not being found on signs in Québec, as a direct response to an on-topic post by **Kayla.** Having a pictogram to deal with language on an otherwise unilingual sign strikes me as funny. Even you can’t deny that the use of pictograms IS because of the two major languages here, as well as all of the minor ones. A picture is clear to everyone in all languages while “4 way”, “all ways” or “toutes directions” (though I have seen that one, too) is unilingual, and the whole silliness \*has \*been a topic of debate in many towns over the years. I have in fact heard someone in a position of importance complain about “Stop” on stop signs… there was a fairly big deal made (admittedly several years ago) about it back in Lennoxville. I’m afraid I can’t tell you who or when exactly (I was quite young), but it WAS something that was discussed a lot and made the local news/newspapers, etc (in both languages). Several stop signs were changed at the time as a result. I should have been more clear that I found the article funny - I found it at random while searching for images, I did not seek it out. I don’t have a preference for “English Canadian media” (I get my news from both language sources - I am bilingual, btw) - I posted it because 1) I found it and 2) it happened to be in English and this is an English-language message board. I would think, though, that for the town councils etc. that have to deal with these types of complaints from francophones and anglophones alike, it does waste a lot of time. I don’t want to continue this hijack; you are correct that it is entirely off-topic. If you want to go into it further, feel free to open another thread or PM me. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/63 "2009-01-20T07:35:42Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Excellent - this halves the time you are in the junction space, halving your risk of accident! Similar to my risk mitigation technique if I’ve had a few drinks. I recognise that I’m probably a danger to other road users so I drive as fast as I can in order to limit my time spent on the road and therefore reduce the risk to other people. ---
**Author:** ![Petrobey\_Mavromihalis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bcef8e/32.png) [@Petrobey\_Mavromihalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Petrobey_Mavromihalis)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/64 "2009-01-20T08:50:24Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Excellent - this halves the time you are in the junction space, halving your risk of accident! You’ve got it! Don’t forget that the Greeks invented logic. And then promptly forgot all about it. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/65 "2009-01-20T15:31:56Z")
4 Way stop? Bah no real chellenge there. Here is the PH.D level course in intersection navigation. Outside Denver. > **[Yahoo Search - Web Search](https://search.yahoo.com/)** > > The search engine that helps you find exactly what you're looking for. Find the most relevant information, video, images, and answers from all across the Web. Essentially one big intersection light system controls that place. 60th going East-west, Vasquez going North-South, the frontage road, Dahlia, also going north-south, and Parkway to the Northeast. Basically works out as a 7 way intersection, with about 60 possible combinations of Entering and leaving. A big enough pain when the lights are working. But when the power goes out, you get a real challenge with folks trying to navigate a 7-way full stop intersection. Even when the cops show up to direct they have no idea what to do, and kinda stare and point aimlessly. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/66 "2009-01-22T02:02:32Z")
> [@Tabby\_Cat](#): > > I’m a bit confused here. They want to remove the roundabout, and replace it with a 4-way stop, because the roundabout slows them down? Isn’t the whole point of a 4-way stop… stopping? How is that any faster than a roundabout? No, they think it should have been left as it was, with stop signs on the minor road, and nothing at all on the main highway. I went through that roundabout yesterday. I was nearly rear-ended by a truck, because an elderly driver was confused by the roundabout, and came to a nearly complete stop in the middle of it, while he tried to figure it out. So 3 vehicles trying to enter it had to suddenly stop, and I was really worried that the 4th vehicle, behind me, was not going to stop! ---
**Author:** ![Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laughing_Lagomorph)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/67 "2009-01-22T02:29:56Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Am I right in thinking that vehicles entering a traffic circle have right of way (as opposed to vehicles _circulating_ having right of way on a UK roundabout)? > > If so, I’m not surprised people hate traffic circles. That isn’t the case now in New England although from what I have been able to determine it was done that way in some states at some point in the past. Traffic entering one of our rotaries has to yield to traffic already in the rotary, this has been the case here in Mass. for at least 35 years. I seem to remember when I first arrived in the area about 20 years ago there was a lot more confusion over this than there seems to be now, I think the change was then still recent enough that people were occasionally confused. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/68 "2009-01-22T04:34:26Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > That shows why roundabouts are an abomination and an indicator of an uncivilized civilization. We also have roundabouts in New England and they work poorly to say the least and create ill-will among citizens in the Boston area. I have nothing against four-way stops; in fact, i quite like them. But roundabouts are also excellent, as long as the people in the cars actually know how to use the things. Which seems not to apply to about 95 percent of the American driving population. Also, your comment about roundabouts and Boston-area citizens demonstrates little except that Boston-area citizens are fucking awful drivers. Which will be confirmed by anyone who has ever set foot in Boston, including most Bostonians. > [@guizot](#): > > Huh? They’re all over the place in California. Typically the stop signs will have the words “All Ways” underneath to indicate it’s a “four-way” stop. What really annoys me is the inconsistency with this practice. Here in San Diego, and also in San Francisco, there are lots of four-way stops. Some have the “All Ways” signs on them, and some do not, which means that when you arrive at a STOP sign you not only have to stop and check for traffic, but you also have to work out whether the cross traffic will be stopping or not. I think that all four-way stops should have the “All Ways” signs on them, to avoid confusion. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/69 "2009-01-22T06:44:20Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Some have the “All Ways” signs on them, and some do not, which means that when you arrive at a STOP sign you not only have to stop and check for traffic, but you also have to work out whether the cross traffic will be stopping or not. Well, how difficult can that be? Either way you have to check for oncoming traffic. But I see your point. They should at least put the “All Ways” sign on when it applies. After all, I’ve seen some pretty superfluous street signs, and if they can put these up, why not more “All Ways” signs. Probably two of the most useless signs I’ve seen: 1) In Marin County, a sign by the freeway that says “Hill.” Beyond the sign is–you guessed it–a hill. And 2) in the Elysian Heights area of L.A., next to the 2 freeway, a sign that says “End,” on a street that, 10 yards ahead and in clear, visible sight, has barriers ending the street because it otherwise would spill onto the freeway. In the first case, do they expect people to see the sign and suddenly make a U-turn on the freeway because they don’t like hills? In the second case, do they think that someone is going to continue on the street despite the fact that it obviously is finished, and therefore need to see a sign that says “End”? ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838/70 "2009-01-22T06:50:31Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > Well, how difficult can that be? Either way you have to check for oncoming traffic. Yes, you do. But exactly what you have to check for changes depending on the type of intersection. If you stop and look, and the only car you see is coming from your right, and is, say, fifty feet from the intersection, it makes a great deal of difference which type of Stop sign you’re at. If you’re at a four-way stop, you can safely proceed because that car will also have to stop at the intersection before carrying on; but if you’re at a regular stop, that car is just going to keep on going, and you will have to wait for it to pass. > [@guizot](#): > > In Marin County, a sign by the freeway that says “Hill.” Beyond the sign is–you guessed it–a hill. Here’s a [picture](http://www.pbase.com/mhendo/image/11661972) i took in San Francisco a few years back. In a neighborhood called Russian Hill. I can’t think of a city in which such a sign would be more pointless. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/non-us-dopers-do-you-have-4-way-stops/481838.md?page=3)