# North Korea sentences U.S journalists to twelve years in labour camp **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 8, 2009, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073 "2009-06-08T05:09:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/21 "2009-06-08T18:22:28Z")
I guess I agree with MartinHyde: how on earth could anyone be so foolish as to even get NEAR the N. Korean border? That really takes the cake for stupidity…and I don’t see the USA wasting resources on trying to rescue these two. It is kind of like those guys who make extremely deep ocean dives…they get in trouble, and expect a multi-million rescue effort. Agin, sorry for these two women, but I could not say they hadn’t been warned. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/22 "2009-06-08T18:28:47Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Ah yes, the pariah of the world, North Korea. You would think that with all the posturing that the Chinese do to look tough vis-a-vis the US Navy, playing chicken with airplanes and spyships, that the Chinese would be a bit concerned with their wacky barbarian neighbors. But they are not. I say leave this problem to the Chinese. I hear constant threats against South Korea and the US, but do they threaten China in the same way? (If so, I missed it.) Maybe they think China is a kindred spirit and not likely to oppose them, so China is unconcerned. ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/23 "2009-06-08T18:33:33Z")
> [@CyclopticXander](#): > > Even in the very unlikely event that the journalists had illegally crosses a border, no civilized person in the 21st century believes that the punishment fits the crime. But once again, I’m going to take anything the North Korean government says with a mountain of salt. I agree. Guess I was looking for a double-standard, and I don’t see one here.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/24 "2009-06-08T18:35:17Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Gee, and to think the journalists involved could have avoided ANY repercussions by simply staying the fuck away from N. Korea! :rolleyes: > > I guess I’m not civilized by your measure, but IMO if you are stupid enough to travel to a foreign country and engage in activities you ought to reasonably expect that country to disapprove of, you pretty much deserve what you get. Agreed. You know you’re dealing with a madman with his own army, I won’t weep for you if your “meddling” gets you strung up, no matter how deeply it outrages me. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/25 "2009-06-08T18:59:58Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > I hear constant threats against South Korea and the US, but do they threaten China in the same way? (If so, I missed it.) Maybe they think China is a kindred spirit and not likely to oppose them, so China is unconcerned. China fears a collapse of the NoKo government, because of the specter of millions of destitute North Koreans streaming into China. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/26 "2009-06-08T19:12:50Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > China fears a collapse of the NoKo government, because of the specter of millions of destitute North Koreans streaming into China. Since the Chinese are getting so prosperous like us, this could be a plus. Somebody has to do all the lawn work. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/27 "2009-06-08T22:23:49Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > I’ve got to agree with this. These people got a trial and a release date. That’s more than a lot of people in Guantanomo get. It’s impossible to equivocate what these two journalists did with people whom are very likely involved in terrorist networks. If things are as they appear at face value, that is. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/28 "2009-06-08T22:27:29Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I just checked the [State Department site](http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/pa/pa_1766.html) and was surprised to see there is not a travel warning or alert for NK. The country-specific info does state that you can be detained there for activities that are not illegal elsewhere. That’s not so suprising, given that Americans can’t really even get into North Korea without sneaking over the border. What troubles me more is that on the surface it looks like these journalists were trying to document North Korea’s refugee problem, which of course pisses them off. “Gee, my Dear Leader is a madman and my family has nothing to eat…let’s go to China and hope for a better life”. ---
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/29 "2009-06-08T22:48:14Z")
> [@buttonjockey308](#): > > Agreed. > > You know you’re dealing with a madman with his own army… I see it more as an army with it’s own madman. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/30 "2009-06-08T23:00:57Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > It’s impossible to equivocate what these two journalists did with people whom are very likely involved in terrorist networks. If things are as they appear at face value, that is. “Very likely”? Wouldn’t happen to have a cite for that would you? Because I’ve got this one that counters your claim: [**America’s prison for terrorists often held the wrong men**](http://www.mcclatchydc.com/detainees/story/38773.html) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/31 "2009-06-08T23:06:21Z")
Simple solution. Return the journalists or cruise missiles level every government building in NK. If China doesn’t want ww3 it won’t interfere. If it wants NK’s government to remain intact it’ll see to it that the journalists are returned. I’m tired of dealing with these assholes. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/32 "2009-06-08T23:09:26Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > It’s impossible to equivocate what these two journalists did with people whom are very likely involved in terrorist networks. Why is it “very likely” that they were involved in terrorist networks? We’ve got as much evidence that these journalists had committed a crime as we do against most of the people in Guantanamo. That’s neither here nor there, though. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/33 "2009-06-08T23:14:44Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > It’s impossible to equivocate what these two journalists did with people whom are very likely involved in terrorist networks. If things are as they appear at face value, that is. Really? Because at face value the American government sent armed men 10,000 miles away to kidnap people from their own back yards, transport them halfway around the world to a country where they could be tortured without trial, and held them indefinitely. In the meantime North Korea arrested two people who illegally crossed their border, tried them, and gave them a determinate sentence. At night what keeps me awake is the thought that things are as they appear at face value. Were I a praying man, I would pray that they were not. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2009, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/34 "2009-06-08T23:21:08Z")
This thread is another reason why anyone who voted for Bush is a stupid evil piece of trash. Thanks to their treason and/or stupidity we’re no better then North Korea. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/35 "2009-06-09T00:14:27Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Are you posting in the correct thread? I’m assuming it was a “women in prison” joke. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/36 "2009-06-09T00:21:45Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > Simple solution. Return the journalists or cruise missiles level every government building in NK. > > If China doesn’t want ww3 it won’t interfere. If it wants NK’s government to remain intact it’ll see to it that the journalists are returned. > > I’m tired of dealing with these assholes. The problem with this is that any war with North Korea will result in intolerable destruction in South Korea. A significant fraction of North Korea’s GDP goes into the construction artillery pieces that are zeroed in on Seoul. Everyone know that the South would win Korean War II, but Seoul would be flattened. The South Koreans aren’t willing to see their capital city destroyed over a couple of journalists. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/37 "2009-06-09T00:28:18Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > The problem with this is that any war with North Korea will result in intolerable destruction in South Korea. A significant fraction of North Korea’s GDP goes into the construction artillery pieces that are zeroed in on Seoul. Everyone know that the South would win Korean War II, but Seoul would be flattened. The South Koreans aren’t willing to see their capital city destroyed over a couple of journalists. Ahh interesting point but isn’t the question: is NK’s government willing to be leveled over a couple of journalists? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/38 "2009-06-09T00:37:27Z")
So, the theme I seem to be hearing in this thread is that it’s ok that N. Korea snatched these two journalists because they were stupid enough to be near (or over) the NK border…and that America snatched a bunch of suspected terrorists and combatants and held them at Gitmo. Right? Assuming I have the mantra right, yeah…I’m seeing the parallels. To be sure. Bush (and now Obama) are JUST like lil’ Kimmy, and the situations are nearly identical. Suspected terrorists and combatants are nearly exactly like journalists after all…because while the folks held at Gitmo MAY have been guilty (or not), everyone KNOWS that journalists are certainly guilty and deserve to be locked up in a labor camp (and as an aside, everyone knows that NK labor camps are on par with Gitmo…practically the same exact thing!). Yep…the similarities are so, um, similar. Or something. -XT ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/39 "2009-06-09T00:51:25Z")
Doesn’t matter. As Americans our words of condemnation against NK appear self serving and shallow, they carry little, if any, moral weight. Thanks to Bush, and the tools who voted for him. Now journalists are about to be abused, tortured and suffer god knows what kind of evils for exercising ideals we hold sacred. Be they Freedom of Speech and Freedom of the Press. And what moral weight do we have to argue for their freedom? We’re the murderers of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and the torturers of god knows how many. How can our words carry moral weight? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2009, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073/40 "2009-06-09T01:08:52Z")
Well, by those standards then no one can talk about it…and, conversely, no one can condemn the US for our actions either. Seriously though, if you think that the US’s actions are remotely similar to what the NK’s have done to their own people (let alone these journalists) you are, simply put, delusional. -XT [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-sentences-u-s-journalists-to-twelve-years-in-labour-camp/499073.md?page=3)