# North Korea suspending missile testing and closing nuclear site; Trump the statesman? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 20, 2018, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829 "2018-04-20T23:09:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/181 "2018-05-03T00:24:29Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > And if the meeting falls through, they are stuck in a Pyongyang re-education center. Where they are beaten for eating a grain of corn they found in the dirt. Yep. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/182 "2018-05-03T08:36:26Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Not so fast: > > Sounds like Kim is using them as bait. Do you think Trump will make them stay there for another month? Translation: “Donald, you can either send an envoy now to bring the Americans home, which would be more humane, or you can make them wait in our re-education camp and bring them home personally with all the photo ops that will provide for you. And if you don’t turn up, you’ll look like the selfish bitch you are.” Kim or his team have just played Donald like a harp, knowing there’s no way he’ll bring them home early and no way he can skip out on the talks. (Mind you, if he does bring them home early I’ll be mightily impressed at whoever convinced him to do it. Steve Doocey, maybe.) ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/183 "2018-05-03T13:12:47Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Translation: “Donald, you can either send an envoy now to bring the Americans home, which would be more humane, or you can make them wait in our re-education camp and bring them home personally with all the photo ops that will provide for you. And if you don’t turn up, you’ll look like the selfish bitch you are.” > > Kim or his team have just played Donald like a harp, knowing there’s no way he’ll bring them home early and no way he can skip out on the talks. (Mind you, if he does bring them home early I’ll be mightily impressed at whoever convinced him to do it. Steve Doocey, maybe.) [I guess we will see today](http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/giuliani-says-3-americans-held-by-north-korea-to-be-released-thursday/ar-AAwFn0D?ocid=ientp). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/184 "2018-05-03T13:30:24Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > [I guess we will see today](http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/giuliani-says-3-americans-held-by-north-korea-to-be-released-thursday/ar-AAwFn0D?ocid=ientp). > > Regards, > Shodan Outstanding! ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/185 "2018-05-03T14:41:14Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Outstanding! Will this actually happen? Probably. Would it have happened under any other President (who wanted to negotiate with the Northies)? Probably. Is it a sign that NK is going to negotiate in good faith? Almost certainly not. Will the negotiations lead to NK de-nuclearizing? Hell no. Is it a good thing anyway? Yes. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/186 "2018-05-03T14:43:36Z")
I think this is a combination of a lot of things. 1. Trump, Moon, and Kim want US troops out of Korea. It’s a win/win/win. 2. Kim’s nuke test site is destroyed. 3. China’s finally putting on considerable pressure. 4. Trump is the first president credibly crazy enough to attack NK without giving SK’s safety much thought. NK has never had to deal with that before. 5. Kim knows he can start pulling crap again in a few years anyway. Only this time, there will be no American troops there. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/187 "2018-05-03T14:55:17Z")
Well I’ll be. A good thing is likely to happen. I tip my hat to whomever was responsible. Going by that article, even SHS appears to be striking the right tone, despite Rudy’s best efforts to screw everything up. If they come home today I will be thrilled. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/188 "2018-05-03T14:57:15Z")
“Troops” are a bit of a misnomer, they are mostly armed and uniformed hostages. They are nestled amidst a much larger group, neither armed nor uniformed, which, for the sake of convenience, we may refer to as “everybody else”. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/189 "2018-05-03T15:47:19Z")
> [@Ashtura](#): > > 1. China’s finally putting on considerable pressure. > 2. Trump is the first president credibly crazy enough to attack NK without giving SK’s safety much thought. NK has never had to deal with that before. > 3. Kim knows he can start pulling crap again in a few years anyway. Only this time, there will be no American troops there. These are the three key ones. And I believe 3 and 4 are linked. China fears that Trump really could invade NK and they do not want that. So better to put some pressure on NK, at least while Trump is in charge. #4 is exactly why Trump will not, and should not, get the Nobel Peace Prize. Although, I heard Trump’s nomination is past the deadline anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/190 "2018-05-06T19:18:11Z")
Well, if we’re just up and believing North Korea, looks like [Trump didn’t have shit to do with it](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/nkorea-says-denuclearisation-pledge-not-result-of-us-led-sanctions/ar-AAwOQt4). ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/191 "2018-05-06T19:52:52Z")
> [@](#): > > Moon said Trump deserved a Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts to end the standoff with the North. Which source do you consider more credible? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/192 "2018-05-06T20:18:50Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Which source do you consider more credible? Are you asking whether we should take someone’s word about why they are doing something, or take someone else’s word why someone else is going something? As negotiations are barely started, and there is no denuclearization to be seen as of yet, I don’t know that anyone can be credited for anything. But, as the actual party in question, and the one that is being asked to denuclearize is the one explaining what is causing them to have the reactions that they are, it is at least useful to listen to them, and not immediately label them as liars. Though, I suppose I could see trump doing exactly that. Touting his negotiation skills, calling Kim out on what trump perceives as a slight, and moving us back away from the negotiation table. Remember, nothing is yet accomplished. Giving trump credit for things that are not yet done does not make much sense. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/193 "2018-05-06T21:06:12Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Which source do you consider more credible? Do you believe Moon’s statement was directed towards the Norwegian Nobel Committee or Donald Trump? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/194 "2018-05-06T22:00:22Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Do you believe Moon’s statement was directed towards the Norwegian Nobel Committee or Donald Trump? That is what I was going to suggest, he is sucking up to the US President. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/195 "2018-05-06T22:18:47Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Moon, like anyone else who has to deal with our president and isn’t a complete fool, has ascertained that a flattered Trump is a pacified Trump. So, sure, give him the Nobel Peace Prize. Give him four or five of them. Give him toys to play with and trophies to wave around— whatever it takes to keep him distracted so other people can try to get things accomplished without him fucking it up. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > That’s it. In addition, he \*is \*the President and he does have all the power of the United States at his command. If being on the good side of that power means a little self-humiliation at times, well, that’s what you signed up for when you went into politics, right? > [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Do you believe Moon’s statement was directed towards the Norwegian Nobel Committee or Donald Trump? > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > That is what I was going to suggest, he is sucking up to the US President. You know who doesn’t have to suck up to the US President? [Kim Jong Un](https://apnews.com/da90eb1c420345ff982f14e3dfe35040/North-Korea-says-US-ruining-mood-of-detente-ahead-of-summit). > [@](#): > > With just weeks to go before President Donald Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un are expected to hold their first-ever summit, Pyongyang on Sunday criticized what it called “misleading” claims that Trump’s policy of maximum political pressure and sanctions are what drove the North to the negotiating table. > > The North’s official news agency quoted a Foreign Ministry spokesman warning the claims are a “dangerous attempt” to ruin a budding detente on the Korean Peninsula after Kim’s summit late last month with South Korean President Moon Jae-in. > [@](#): > > Trump and senior U.S. officials have suggested repeatedly that Washington’s tough policy toward North Korea, along with pressure on its main trading partner China, have played a decisive role in turning around what had been an extremely tense situation. Just last year, as Kim was launching long-range missiles at a record pace and trading vulgar insults with Trump, it would have seemed unthinkable for the topic of denuclearization to be on the table. > > But the North’s statement on Sunday seemed to be aimed at strengthening Kim’s position going into his meeting with Trump. **Pyongyang claims Kim himself is the driver of the current situation**. > > “The U.S. is deliberately provoking the DPRK at the time when the situation on the Korean Peninsula is moving toward peace and reconciliation,” the spokesman was quoted as saying. (bolding mine) ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/196 "2018-05-06T23:15:46Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > You know who doesn’t have to suck up to the US President? [Kim Jong Un](https://apnews.com/da90eb1c420345ff982f14e3dfe35040/North-Korea-says-US-ruining-mood-of-detente-ahead-of-summit).(bolding mine) So your impression is that Kim is a fearless truth-teller? Willing to give us the unvarnished truth? Is that it? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2018, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/197 "2018-05-06T23:32:49Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So your impression is that Kim is a fearless truth-teller? Willing to give us the unvarnished truth? Is that it? Sort of like a certain current president I could name. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2018, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/198 "2018-05-07T00:12:33Z")
An irresistible force meets and unmovable object. It will be interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2018, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/199 "2018-05-07T00:16:11Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So your impression is that Kim is a fearless truth-teller? Willing to give us the unvarnished truth? Is that it? This is entire thread was STARTED based on someone claiming exactly that. Who could that person possibly be, and could he possibly be invited back to the thread to share why he felt Kim Jong Un was being utterly truthful when he claimed North Korea was ending their nuclear ambitions? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2018, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/200 "2018-05-07T02:56:20Z")
> [@Ashtura](#): > > I think this is a combination of a lot of things. > > 1. Trump, Moon, and Kim want US troops out of Korea. It’s a win/win/win. > 2. Kim’s nuke test site is destroyed. > 3. China’s finally putting on considerable pressure. > 4. Trump is the first president credibly crazy enough to attack NK without giving SK’s safety much thought. NK has never had to deal with that before. > 5. Kim knows he can start pulling crap again in a few years anyway. Only this time, there will be no American troops there. 1. The potential for a US/China trade war has probably (well, definitely) got the Chinese spooked, as they can’t be sure if Trump is crazy and stupid enough to go all in, and so they are trying to do what they can and exert what leverage they can on the NK situation and probably through back channels get the message to Trump that they are doing so. I think that mainly this is NK doing what they have always done…they pushed the situation to the max, now they want to appear to be making concessions and are expecting some sort of pay off. We’ve gone through this cycle several times in the past, and I have no doubt it will be rinse and repeat down the road, until the regime finally collapses. I doubt any serious changes will be made, structurally, to NK, as any change would just push they over the edge. I don’t expect an actual peace treaty with SK, and I doubt they will do more than back burner their missile or nuke program…probably they will continue working on it with simulations or by buying tech (or getting it from one of the Chinese factions opposed to Xi), to re-emerge down the road when they want to push things again for more handouts. I will say that Trump had a non-zero effect on this, IMHO anyway. I think he IS crazy and stupid, and that his willingness to do unexpected and stupid shit (I could give a laundry list of actions, but just consider the first Syrian strike and this idiotic trade war brinksmanship as military and economic things that have everyone wondering what the fuck he might do next) has spooked a lot of more rational (and isn’t it ironic that the CCP would be a more rational player?? :(:eek:) nations, and probably has the NK’s actually wondering what he and the US might do next. It’s one thing to play brinksman games when you figure the bigger guy won’t do anything but view with alarm, but when he might decide to send in an air and missile strike seemingly out of the blue and without regard to the broader ramifications? Screw that noise, perhaps it’s time to simmer things down and look like the rational party…plus, maybe get some nice swag or concessions for appearing to do so! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829.md?page=11)