# North Korea suspending missile testing and closing nuclear site; Trump the statesman? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 20, 2018, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829 "2018-04-20T23:09:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/461 "2018-06-10T17:56:46Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I really thought that was going to be an Onion article. Wow. > [@article](#): > > “To all Americans and the rest of the world I’m honored to call President Trump a friend. He’s one of the best negotiators of all time and I’m looking forward to him adding to his historic success at the Singapore Summit,” Rodman said. Like the Physician’s quote, this sounds as though it were written by Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/462 "2018-06-10T18:13:58Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Like the Physician’s quote, this sounds as though it were written by Trump. “Of all time” is [a signature Trump phrase](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Wahb_5Dcqw). ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/463 "2018-06-10T18:19:16Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > North Korea agreeing to dismantle any and all nuclear weapons plus agreeing to restrictions on the acquisition of raw materials similar to those included in the Iran deal. And agreeing to inspections similar to the inspections in the Iran deal. > > Now here’s a few for you. One of the main criticisms from the right regarding the “horrible horrible very bad no good” Iran deal wasn’t about the terms of the deal. It was the idea that no matter how good the deal was, Iran could not be trusted to keep it. Why do you think that North Korea is more trustworthy than Iran? > The other was that without Congressional approval that the Iran deal was invalid. Why would this one be different? As a bonus, get North Korea to return the people that it has kidnapped from neighboring countries, and as bonus bonus, get them to stop doing it in the future. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/464 "2018-06-10T18:48:04Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > North Korea agreeing to dismantle any and all nuclear weapons plus agreeing to restrictions on the acquisition of raw materials similar to those included in the Iran deal. And agreeing to inspections similar to the inspections in the Iran deal. > > Now here’s a few for you. One of the main criticisms from the right regarding the “horrible horrible very bad no good” Iran deal wasn’t about the terms of the deal. It was the idea that no matter how good the deal was, Iran could not be trusted to keep it. Why do you think that North Korea is more trustworthy than Iran? > The other was that without Congressional approval that the Iran deal was invalid. Why would this one be different? I think another question - why would North Korea believe WE would keep our end? ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/465 "2018-06-11T00:35:37Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Denuclearization, removal of advanced enrichment capabilities, and around the clock supervision by an international consortium to ensure compliance, in exchange for easing of sanctions. Iran 2.0. > > What would be the conservative response to such an agreement? Iran 2.0, meaning they get billions, and don’t sign a thing, or allow inspections when we want them without days in delay? No thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/466 "2018-06-11T00:37:30Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Iran 2.0, meaning they get billions, and don’t sign a thing, or allow inspections when we want them without days in delay? No thanks. You really have no clue what all was involved with the JCPOA, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/467 "2018-06-11T00:37:40Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Denuclearization, removal of advanced enrichment capabilities, and around the clock supervision by an international consortium to ensure compliance, in exchange for easing of sanctions. Iran 2.0. > > What would be the conservative response to such an agreement? Iran 2.0, meaning they get billions from us, and don’t sign a thing, or allow inspections when we want them without days in delay? No thanks. If Obama ever meet face to face with Ayatollah Khamenei ( Supreme leader ) ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/468 "2018-06-11T00:39:40Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > You really have no clue what all was involved with the JCPOA, do you? It was a bad deal. Iran signed **NOTHING,** and it wasn’t a treaty. Do you really trust them? They took a ton of cash and we just " hoped ". ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/469 "2018-06-11T00:40:36Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Iran 2.0, meaning they get billions, and don’t sign a thing, or allow inspections when we want them without days in delay? No thanks. This is an entirely inaccurate description of the JCPOA, but you’ve been corrected many times on this with no apparent influence on your views. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/470 "2018-06-11T00:42:44Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/471 "2018-06-11T00:55:21Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Silver lining > Before anything happens, I’d like to hear from the Presidents critics on what an initial successful meeting would look like? > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Before anything happens, I’d like to hear from the President’s supporters on what the _minimum_ is for a success. Also, what would constitute a failure. Reversing a question without answering it? You can reply later. Frist off, we know North Korea has nuclear weapons and missiles that can carry them great distances. The USA and the world has a chance to remove a threat of North Korea doing something stupid, selling nuclear equipment on the black market ( extremely dangerous ), or preventing a testing accident that could lead to something very serious. I think Kim Jong-Un is a little scared of Trump and he should be. He’s not Jimmy Carter or Barack Obama. He’s more like Reagan, who as we know had a breakthrough with the Russians, and served when the wall fell. Just getting this meeting is an accomplishment for Trump’s Presidency. Not only did North Korea destroy their nuclear mountain, they are clearing space for a USA embassy. All signs point to they are serious about diplomacy. Any of the below will constitute progress in my opinion. It will take some time, this won’t be an overnight success. A 2nd meeting after Trump leaves means we’ve got something to build upon. That’s where I set the bar. Trump has already put pressure on Kim saying he won’t get a second chance for this type of meeting and he’s prepared to walk if needed. What’s I’d like to see eventually happen: 1 ) North Korea showing us something we don’t know about their Nuclear Program. Details, amounts, locations, etc… 2 ) Allowing USA inspections, whenever we want them and where ever we want them. 3 ) North Korea loosening up their security around the demilitarized zone, and South Korea doing the same. 4 ) Eyewitness the destruction of their nuclear weapons and change their plants for power and electricity if possible In return, the USA could: 1 ) Offer North Korea protection. 2 ) Losen up sanctions. 3 ) Open up the possibility of trade. With a lot of cheap labor and South Korea’s know-how, North Korea can export goods to the USA. Kim Jon-Un’s eyes probably were opened during the Olympics. He saw South Korea’s progress and looks at his barren land. He likely knows that victory for North Korea on the world stage cannot be achieved by the strength of arms, rather by giving up what they have that is dangerous, which perhaps was his plan all along. Either way, I say take that deal. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/472 "2018-06-11T00:58:15Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > It was a bad deal. Iran signed **NOTHING,** and it wasn’t a treaty. Do you really trust them? They took a ton of cash and we just " hoped ". I trust the entity that has been stated to be in full compliance by the IAEA a lot more than a rando on a message board that’s shown to barely have a passing acquaintance with facts and citing sources. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/473 "2018-06-11T01:03:09Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > You really have no clue what all was involved with the JCPOA, do you? You really have no clue. 1 ) This was not a treaty. 2 ) Iran signed NOTHING holding them accountable. Show me either of the above and you’l have some foundation! Until then who cares if Iran says they are going to reduce their centrifuges. Why not stop spinning them? That would be a step toward a deal. Obama was such a fool. He had to know without support of Congress or Iran signing off, this deal was very flimsy, and he was caught sending a plane full of cash in the process to Iran, and did stuff he told congress he would not do. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/474 "2018-06-11T01:17:57Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > You really have no clue. > > 1 ) This was not a treaty. > > 2 ) Iran signed NOTHING holding them accountable. > > Show me either of the above and you’l have some foundation! > > Until then who cares if Iran says they are going to reduce their centrifuges. Why not stop spinning them? That would be a step toward a deal. > > Obama was such a fool. He had to know without support of Congress or Iran signing off, this deal was very flimsy, and he was caught sending a plane full of cash in the process to Iran, and did stuff he told congress he would not do. That’s crazy, because it sure looks like Iran was a signatory to the JCPOA. It sure looks like Iran was in full compliance, as stated by the IAEA and every country in the world not run by Bibi or Trump. It wasn’t an American treaty, no. A treaty requires the advice and consent of Congress. Given Congress at the time couldn’t even deign to consider a Supreme Court Justice that THEY said would be fine, based entirely on being obstructionist assholes, they probably aren’t gonna look much at a treaty, will they? ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/475 "2018-06-11T01:21:48Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > sending a plane full of cash in the process to Iran. Forgot this little gem. That “plane full of cash” was paying them back for money we pretty much stole decades ago. > [@"Liberal Biased" Politifact](#): > > March 17, 2016, letter from the U.S. State Department saying Iran had received about $1.7 billion as part of the nuclear agreement. The money was legally due to Iran. The country had paid America for military equipment in 1979, but then the Iranian revolution came and the hardware was never delivered. ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/476 "2018-06-11T01:24:53Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > You really have no clue. > > 1 ) This was not a treaty. > > 2 ) Iran signed NOTHING holding them accountable. If it were a treaty and if we had the signature of the leader of Iran on a piece of paper, and then they violated the deal, what do you suppose we’d do to hold them accountable? How is that different than what we’d do with it being an “agreement” (or whatever you want to call it)? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/477 "2018-06-11T01:25:28Z")
North Korea has wanted a meeting like this for years and years. And Trump have it to him, along with a series of ridiculous and hyperbolic statements praising Kim, in exchange for nothing. If NK agrees to get rid of their nuclear weapons entirely, I will reverse myself and praise Trump. But considering that those nukes are perhaps the only thing that has prevented NK from being invaded and toppled, that seems about as likely as Trump apologizing to Obama for spending years and years spreading a racist and evidence free conspiracy theory about him. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/478 "2018-06-11T02:59:08Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > If NK agrees to get rid of their nuclear weapons entirely, I will reverse myself and praise Trump. Kim can agree to anything. Wake me up when he actually allows UN weapons inspectors in North Korea to monitor and oversee the destruction of his program. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/479 "2018-06-11T03:06:21Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > …I think Kim Jong-Un is a little scared of Trump and he should be. He’s not Jimmy Carter or Barack Obama. He’s more like Reagan… For just a moment there, I thought about jumping in to Reagan’s defense, but then i thought about the Glory of Grenada and said, nah, fuck it, knock yerself out! ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829/480 "2018-06-11T09:38:56Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Kim can agree to anything. Wake me up when he actually allows UN weapons inspectors in North Korea to monitor and oversee the destruction of his program. Fair enough, I’ll change my answer to this, since it’s more what I meant. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/north-korea-suspending-missile-testing-and-closing-nuclear-site-trump-the-statesman/812829.md?page=25)