# "Northern Ireland" is a separate country, its not a description. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 1, 2012, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901 "2012-07-01T14:45:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/101 "2012-07-06T13:42:14Z")
I was correct on everything, you mean. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/102 "2012-07-06T14:21:22Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > It’s compounded by the fact that in the US state schools refer to universities (and the US distinguishes between university and college, where in the UK a college would be for grades 11 and 12). Seeing as we seem to be having a pedant-a-thon, the college for grades 11 and 12 thing is not UK-wide - it doesn’t apply in Scotland, for example. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/103 "2012-07-06T14:27:33Z")
Or in England, where a college is _primarily_ a component of a university just like it is here. I think you’re referring to a sixth-form college, which is usually called a “sixth-form college”. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/104 "2012-07-06T14:43:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Or in England, where a college is _primarily_ a component of a university just like it is here. I think you’re referring to a sixth-form college, which is usually called a “sixth-form college”. Yeah, not amazingly clear on the English education system myself. Are sixth-form colleges always a separate institution from the grade 7-10 (or whatever) ones? ---
**Author:** ![Filbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/filbert/32/3433_2.png) [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/105 "2012-07-06T14:58:12Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Or in England, where a college is _primarily_ a component of a university just like it is here. I think you’re referring to a sixth-form college, which is usually called a “sixth-form college”. Not in common usage- anyone saying they were at college when they were at University would confuse the hell out of people. Though most colleges are attached to Universities (as colleges cannot award degrees themselves, that must be done by a University), and many Universities are made up of colleges, ‘College’ is generally seen to mean you are studying at a level equivalent to 6th form\*, or a specialist institute for something like Art or Agriculture, though that would pretty much always come with the specialisation as a qualifier (‘I’m at Art College’). A student at, say, St. Anne’s College Oxford, would say they were a University student, studying at Oxford (though they might also specify which college), they certainly wouldn’t say they were a College student. Yes I know that’s confusing and makes very little sense- welcome to the English education system! \*Which we refer to as years 12 and 13 or Lower and Upper 6th form; standard school education goes up to the end of year 11, also known as 5th year, due to a non-universal change of terminology, either way, it’s known as a 6th form College, which not all schools have as an option. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/106 "2012-07-06T15:03:42Z")
Yeah, but he’s not saying “at college”. He’s just saying “college”. > [@](#): > > Yeah, not amazingly clear on the English education system myself. Are sixth-form colleges always a separate institution from the grade 7-10 (or whatever) ones? No. Lots of secondary schools run through the sixth form. All the public secondary schools do, as far as I know. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/107 "2012-07-06T17:46:15Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Yeah, not amazingly clear on the English education system myself. Are sixth-form colleges always a separate institution from the grade 7-10 (or whatever) ones? No. At my school, you just continued from the 5th year into the 6th form. ---
**Author:** ![Bilbo1967](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@Bilbo1967](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bilbo1967)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/108 "2012-07-06T18:15:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Yeah, but he’s not saying “at college”. He’s just saying “college”. > > No. Lots of secondary schools run through the sixth form. All the public secondary schools do, as far as I know. Certainly not all of them. My son’s school, for example, only opened a Sixth Form this year. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/109 "2012-07-06T18:52:20Z")
An independent school? Or did you think I meant public in the American sense? ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/110 "2012-07-06T19:31:49Z")
> [@AWB](#): > > Actually, western Virginia is _ **south** _ of West Virginia. And for some parts is father west than West Virginia. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/111 "2012-07-06T19:36:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Northern Ireland isn’t part of England anymore than New York is part of Texas. Northern Ireland and England are two different places that are located in the same country. Are they in the same country? The UK is so odd, with Scotland, Wales and England all being separate countries. ---
**Author:** ![Bilbo1967](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@Bilbo1967](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bilbo1967)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/112 "2012-07-06T19:56:52Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > An independent school? Or did you think I meant public in the American sense? I thought you meant public in the American sense. Apologies if that was an incorrect assumption. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/113 "2012-07-06T20:23:30Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > Are they in the same country? The UK is so odd, with Scotland, Wales and England all being separate countries. The UK (England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland) is one nation state. The Republic of Ireland is another, separate, nation state. A person wishing to travel to Northern Ireland needs to obtain their visa from the British governmnent. Hence, apparently, the confusion which prompted the OP. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/114 "2012-07-06T21:19:04Z")
> [@PaulParkhead](#): > > The UK (England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland) is one nation state. The Republic of Ireland is another, separate, nation state. > > A person wishing to travel to Northern Ireland needs to obtain their visa from the British governmnent. Hence, apparently, the confusion which prompted the OP. That really doesn’t answer my question at all. ---
**Author:** ![Kenm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bc79bd/32.png) [@Kenm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kenm)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/115 "2012-07-06T21:43:21Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > Are they in the same country? Just as Hawaii and Alaska are parts of the same country. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/116 "2012-07-06T21:48:33Z")
Just tell her she has to travel through Britain and get an English Visa, because Northern Ireland is _where they speak English_. Tell her in the rest of Ireland they speak Irish. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/117 "2012-07-06T23:28:47Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Western Virginia is east of West Virginia. > > America, what a country! No, the westernmost part of Virginia is west of the westernmost part of West Virginia. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/118 "2012-07-07T00:07:15Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > That really doesn’t answer my question at all. Then I apologise, as I apparently did not understand your question. Did you mean “Are the RoI and NI the same country?” Or something else? ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/119 "2012-07-07T00:16:22Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > Are they in the same country? The UK is so odd, with Scotland, Wales and England all being separate countries. Yes. The UK is a country made up of four countries. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901/120 "2012-07-07T00:51:32Z")
Yo, dawg, we heard you liked countries, so we put some countries in your country so you could visit different countries when you’re in your country. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/northern-ireland-is-a-separate-country-its-not-a-description/626901.md?page=7)