# Norwegian prison time isn't as easy as some Americans thought (Anders Breivik) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 14, 2014, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352 "2014-02-14T18:26:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2014, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/61 "2014-02-16T23:52:27Z")
He deserves a barely functioning Intellivision console or perhaps an Atari 2600. Personally, I believe that if you can off 69 people and injure 319 and then only receive 21 years in prison, you should probably be grateful for every day that you remain alive. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/62 "2014-02-17T00:32:49Z")
> [@nevadaexile](#): > > He deserves a barely functioning Intellivision console or perhaps an Atari 2600. > > Personally, I believe that if you can off 69 people and injure 319 and then only receive 21 years in prison, you should probably be grateful for every day that you remain alive. Perhaps an Etch-a-Sketch, with a cracked screen. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/63 "2014-02-17T00:33:25Z")
> [@Septima](#): > > Again, not that it matters, but Norway isn’t a member of the EU. But it is a member of the Council of Europe; abolishing capital punishment is one of it’s membership criteria. > [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > …Doesn’t the judge tell the jury that capital punishment is a _possibility_, or is that a TV invention? > Judges can be capricious, hence the term “hanging judge.” I wanted to try to be one, but then someone told me that I actually wanted to be a “hung judge” (they was right). They do. It’s called a [death-qualified](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death-qualified_jury) jury. If the defendant is facing the death penalty then nobody who’s opposed to the death penalty is allowed to serve on the jury (neither are people who think the death penalty should be _mandatory._). ---
**Author:** ![Septima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@Septima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Septima)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/64 "2014-02-17T00:44:51Z")
[QUOTE=alphaboi867] But it is a member of the Council of Europe; abolishing capital punishment is one of it’s membership criteria. [/QUOTE] Indeed, but someone upthread was blaming the EU, and I was feeling petty and nationalistic. We may be the most memberly non-members ever, but we are not, in fact, members of the EU. And proud of it (embarrassingly so at times). As for Breivik, who cares. Withholding playstation games isn’t actually going to make anything better, so why not let him have a few, if he wants them and the prison has them. As for his other demands, I haven’t been able to dig up the full list, but it boils down to: -More meaningful recreation (of which the games were an example). -Some help paying for stamps (he gets a lot of mail). -More fresh air. -Fewer pat-downs. -More human contact. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/65 "2014-02-17T01:06:53Z")
The death penalty is decided by states in the USA. What about the various European countries? ---
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/66 "2014-02-17T01:12:59Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Perhaps an Etch-a-Sketch, with a cracked screen. And no dials. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/67 "2014-02-17T01:48:33Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > The death penalty is decided by states in the USA. > What about the various European countries? It’s only legal in Belarus. The US is highly federal and most European countries aren’t. I would guess the two best candidates to decide it at the state level would be Germany and Switzerland, and as far as I can tell they banned it at the national level and not by state/canton. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/68 "2014-02-17T03:11:20Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > It’s only legal in Belarus. The US is highly federal and most European countries aren’t. I would guess the two best candidates to decide it at the state level would be Germany and Switzerland, and as far as I can tell they banned it at the national level and not by state/canton. Federal meaning that states form a federation and make many of their own decisions? Federal to me means the central government. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/69 "2014-02-17T03:27:42Z")
Federal state as contrasted with unitary state. Or Federation, but that makes me think of Star Wars. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/70 "2014-02-17T09:13:34Z")
> [@Septima](#): > > As for his other demands, I haven’t been able to dig up the full list, but it boils down to: > _\_ > -Fewer pat-downs. > -More human contact. O.K., now he’s just being inconsistent. > [@Grim\_Render](#): > > I have a friend who has been incarcerated in Norwegian prisons as well as fairly hardcore UK ones. He say he prefers the UK ones by far. The Norwegian ones are like being an adult locked in the body of a 5-year old in the most OCD overcontrolling boarding school ever. Prettier surroundings, but you own none of your time. > [@Grim\_Render](#): > > As for the “you’re told what to do and when to do it” I’m afraid you missed that too. When discussing these matters, people often seem to assume that you’re afforded significant time to do things like play games or watch TV. The fact that this time is so restricted is why people prefer hardcore UK prisons to Norwegian ones. > [@buddha\_david](#): > > I still don’t get you. What, precisely, makes hellhole UK prisons more favorable than the plush, well-lit, gamer-friendly Norwegian ones? Yeah, **Grim Render** , I’m with **buddha\_david** on this. I really can’t tell what point you’re trying to make. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2014, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352/71 "2014-02-17T11:21:25Z")
> [@Septima](#): > > Which is actually fair enough, that’s a pretty silly restriction (the prison claims it’s a coincidence) Silly restrictions are characteristic of prisons. The entire system operates almost open loop: there is no feedback to check or correct incompetence, bastardy, or silliness. Nobody cares what the prisoners think, and nobody else can see. Depending on which prison you are in, you get varying degrees of oppression from wardens and prisoners, but you always get silliness. Levenworth might be a bit different: I’m sure you get silliness there, but it might be closer to ordinary military silliness. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/norwegian-prison-time-isnt-as-easy-as-some-americans-thought-anders-breivik/681352.md?page=3)