Share with the rest of the class !!
I went looking around for some answers on the usury question and found some surprising quotes. George Washington, Ben Franklin and lots of world leaders were utterly disgusted by the usury practice of Jews. They ascribe the fate of entire nations to the swiftness in which its’ economy could be dominated by a nation of people. So whats the deal ? If a Jewish man needs a loan where does he go ?
Forgot the link.
http://christianparty.net/jewquotes.htm
…
Thank you, Hank, for adding your usual enlightened and liberal point of view to a delicate subject. The thread and the board is graced by your continued presence.
It is amazing how these quotes are contained, full within context, and without a single paraphrase or miswording. Why, I’ve not seen the like since I read Darwin’s deathbed confession.
In fact, I would like to thank Hank for showing me the truth and the light as shown here, that cranial capacity is segregated by race and has a direct relationship to testing scores. Equally interesting is the categories this site breaks the races into.
http://christianparty.net/standard.htm
Further investigation on the site suggests that they wish the 19th amendment repealed. Truly, Hank, I can not think of a better place to get information from.
All I have is this humble refutation.
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Cyprus/8815/what_they_said.html
As I said, I was surprised to find these quotes. Doesn’t surprise me that some of them are forged.
Back to the question at hand. what about usury ? Why the reluctance to discuss the truth of it here ? Just curious.
Now, Zev, I wouldn’t be so sweeping if I were you and you were more balanced in your words, stating that I have "…been consistenly wrong on your (my) “fact-opinions” of Judaism… "
I mentioned many things about Jews and Judaism that are correct; for example that Jews believe God made a bargain with Abraham called a covenant and signed by preputial circumcision in every Jewish male issue, also Jews believe in one God and His chosen people are the Jews. And many other things I write about Jews and Judaism are correct, if you should do a search of my posts and look for instances of Jews and Judaism and connected issues.
I still, dear Zev, knew there was also something else you didn’t reply to, in my earlier post on Jews; now I would like to ask you on that oversight from your part:
**
Soros, I read now and then that he finances some kind of think tank. Can you give me the details of how his project advances charity, education, and the arts for mankind?
Bill Gates, he’s not Jewish; he’s still the richest guy on earth? I seem to have the impression that at the start he was not interested in using his money for charity, education, and arts. He’s changed however. But his altruistic projects seem to be geared towards advancing his own interests(?). Anyway, I think I read somewhere that he’s an atheist.
Back to Jews, if you can just list some big givings of Jews to charity, education, and the arts, specially on behalf of non-Jews who are the poor of the world, I shall be more enlightened and definitely will have a more fair and balanced idea of Jews.
This is an additional request for explanation on another matter: Why is Israel the biggest receiver of money from the U.S. Government for all time to the present? Can you think up some earthly reasons why?
My curiosity with the Jews is purely ‘academic’, in the sense that I consider myself some kind of a sociologist, political scientist, and anthropologist, of the common sense, amateur, or armchair type. I am also curious about the lots of African peoples, why these peoples are up to the present backward, notwithstanding that their lands are so rich in natural resources. My point is this: I am not anti-Jewish. If there is anything I really abhor in this world, it is the white racist supremacists – and I believe it is a justified abhorrence.
Again, rest assured that I have nothing personal against Jews, and that is where I am certain of my own sentiment and it’s correct. Don’t tell it’s also wrong or ‘mistaken’(?).
Susma Rio Sep
PS Please don’t lose your academic composure, Zev. We are all here to hear from each other, and you should be the last one to claim that others or I are consistently wrong in their “opinions-facts”. That’s certainly not being very academic at all. Ha ha ha.
I think it’s because it’s off topic, Hank.
The topic is, “Are Catholics Christians?”
… apparently, by the way, they are.
What are the rules on linking to hate sites again?
Dear Tom:
I looked up my old college notes, and you know what I found out in the larger and longer perspectives?
How terribly much coercive power the Catholic Church has lost down the ages, as people’s mind and heart have been liberated from religious convictions.
There was a time when the Roman papacy installed and removed kings according to its enlightened discretion, and divided the world between the Portuguese and the Spaniards.
No longer. Now no earthly power pays it any serious attention. Recently the USA snubbed the Pope, when it went ahead and attacked Iraq against the repeated public entreaties of the Vatican to refrain.
That the pope used to conduct himself as the sole agent of God on earth, I think that is shown easily in the papal tiara of three tiers, symbolizing powers over heaven, earth, and hell.* Now the Catholic Church has wisely adopted a conciliatory posture and kept quiet over many powers it arrogated to itself.** Accordingly, in very recent decades the tiara has been withdrawn from public ceremonies.
Will the powers exercised in the past ever be brought out from the cupboard again, when social political circumstances turn hospitious? I am inclined to speculate that those days are forever over; unless mankind returned to the dark ages and the Catholic Church were the only institution possessed of literacy, learning, and clever mental skills.
About Orthodox churches in communion with the Vatican, that it’s not Orthodox churches but Eastern churches. I think in North America the churches with geographical origins in Eastern Europe and the Middle East not in communion with the Vatican call themselves collectively as the Eastern Orthodox Churches. Among these churches I am sure there are also splinter groups which are in communion with the Vatican. Anyway, I will agree with you that we can use the term Orthodox churches to refer to churches originating from that region not in communion with the papacy. Yet, there does not seem to be any officially established terminology or nomenclature here, much less copyrighted appellations.
Best regards, and I bow however to your superior learning and insights, notwithstanding my reservations.
Susma Rio Sep
*The following words were used in crowning the pope: “Father of princes and kings, Ruler of the world, Vicar of our Saviour Jesus Christ”. I am looking for the original Latin text, and it should be absorbing to determine whether the verse will be used again in the soon to come crowning of the successor of the present Pope John Paul II.
**That the pope has power over the whole earth: in my notes there is the remark I made during class hours that it is a theologically certain position, being a logical deduction from the Pope being the Vicar of Christ, and Christ being God. Of course, those were the days when I was taking up my studies in the Catholic university I attended.
Sorry E sabbath , but you did ask the off topic question here.
I was interested in the answer. 
Hank, did you not know that you linked to a hate site or did you just not care?
No, I didn’t know it was a hate site. I did a gooogle on Judaism and usury and I found the quotes. I was surprised when when I read them but then again not so surprised. Ever read the secessionist papers ? Some pretty venomous stuff said by supposed respected leaders, governors and the like.
I went back there and couldn’t even find a link on that page to the rest of the site. I apologize.
No problem, Hank. I realize that it’s not recognizably a hate site from that one page and that it contains no link to a homepage. The quotations should have set off warning bells, though. You should always know what kind of site you’re linking too, not just for the reason in this case but to avoid fallacious cites in general.
I don’t say this to be critical, it’s just a sincere word of advice. It’s easy to find something by Google, post it, and then be embarrassed by it later if it turns out to be a propaganda site. People tend to scrutinize cite sources pretty closely in GD so you really have to know what you’re linking to.
Vade, et jam amplius noli peccare. 
Of course, to be accurate, it should be noted that it was not a unilateral intervention by the pope, but that Spain actually asked for the Papal Bull of 1494 (and agreed to the revised line in the Treaty of Tordesillas in 1506). It should also be noted that even then it was recognized that the pope’s boundaries only applied to the lands disputed by Spain and Portugal: the French, the Dutch, and the English were never constrained by the treaties. Resolving a trade dispute between two neighbors in a way that was ignored by all the uninvolved parties, of course, does not sound nearly as imperious as declaring that the pope was “dividing the world.”
I would never claim that the pope has never, historically, claimed far too much political power. Your statement to which I objected was that the church taught that the pope was the sole agent. Even when the papacy was allowing itself to be corrupted by worldly power, there was never a claim made that the pope was the sole agent of God on earth. Sole agent indicates that God will not act through any other person. Church teaching clearly indicates that God acts through the saints–and even through sinners and unbelievers.
The Orthodox churches are quite clear in their organization and structure. Those in the U.S. are established among immigrants from the European, Asian, and African national churches and continue to maintain their relationships directly with the appropriate patriarchs in the lands from which they sprang. Similarly, the Byzantine Catholics, the Chaldean Catholics, the Alexandrian Catholics (sometimes called Catholic Copts), the Catholic Abyssinian Church, the Catholic Syrian Church, the Uniat Church of Malabar, the Catholic Armenians, and the Maronites are all clearly united with Rome although they all maintain separate structures and liturgies beneath their individual patriarchs. There are no “splinter” Orthodox in some sort of Communion with Rome. Splinter groups tend to become independent rather than joining up with bigger groups who might want to impose additional rules on them. I will admit that some of the terminology may be confusing, but the clear division is always indicated by the terms Orthodox for those ancient churches not in communion with Rome and Catholic for those in communion with Rome.
**
But you have been consistently wrong.
In this thread I corrected you regarding “Jewish blood.”
In this thread, you were corrected regarding the permissibility of male homosexual sex in Judaism.
In this thread, I corrected your assertion that I said that male homosexual sex was permitted in Judaism (something that I never said).
In this thread, I corrected you on the translation of a verse in Psalms.
**
Sorry, there is no central list of charitable donations made by Jews, so I can’t answer the question of whether Jews give more or less than anyone else.
**
This is really beyond the scope of this thread. If you want to know, I suggest you open up another thread.
**
And I have never accused you of being such. I simply “ccused” you of posting facts that were incorrect and simply asked you to be more careful and do more research in the future before posting inaccurate information.
Why should I be the “last one” to claim that your facts are wrong? In this area I happen to be fairly knowledgeable. I have had extensive learning in Judaism and am therefore qualified to state facts on these matters. However, you will not find me quoting facts on Hinduism, for example, because I don’t know anything about it. All I ask is the same of you.
Zev Steinhardt
…Can we please get a mod to fix the coding in my last post?
Thanks.
Zev Steinhardt
To Tom and Zev:
Very good!
Susma Rio Sep
<hijack of the above hijack>
I’d just like to draw everyone’s attention to the following Thomas Jefferson quote near the bottom of the above link:
“Those who labour in the earth are the chosen people of G-d, if ever he had a chosen people, whose breasts he has made his peculiar deposit for substantial and genuine virtue.”
Remember that the next time you get to second base.
Tracer, for four straight years you have been SDMB Undisputed Champion, One-Liner Hijack Category, and I suspect strongly a committee of Mods. is planning to give you a special Lifetime Achievement Award .
But with that last post you have outdone yourself! 
Hey! What about me? Don’t I get any labelling to salve my ego or throw cold water on it?
Whatever negative labels, please just be civil in your vocabulary, OK?
God bless us all.
Susma Rio Sep
PS: I like Tracer and his posts also, very interesting; all of us here, though, are very interesting to my ET visitor, Herr Martian.