# Note To Winemakers: Get Rid of those Stupid, Effin Corks! **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 26, 2010, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456 "2010-04-26T21:25:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/41 "2010-04-27T15:48:05Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > If the bottlers change over, how do you expect to keep the cork industry afloat? I see what you did there. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/42 "2010-04-27T16:03:28Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > Actually, I’ve read that the cork industry keeps cork forest ecosystems going. No corks, no cork trees, you get the picture. Isn’t cork flooring catching on anywhere? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/43 "2010-04-27T16:12:31Z")
Heck, if bottlers change over, the government might have to subsidize the cork industry. Can you imagine more tax on bulletin boards? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/44 "2010-04-27T16:18:51Z")
> [@Wallenstein](#): > > It is a myth that old wines “breathe” through the corks. Most of the changes to wine take place anaerobically, or they use the “headspace” at the top of the bottle to provide a modicum of oxygen. Real producers prefer to age wine in screwcaps as it prevents outside air interfering with the chemical changes taking place in the bottle. Again, corks don’t permit air in; they permit gases built up during the long-term aging (after all the oxygen in the ullage has been reacted) to escape (and not through the body of the cork, which is nearly impervious, but around the sides). The early phases of aging (in oak, or for some white and ice wines, in stainless steel) may use some kind of mechanical closure, but few high end winemakers use screwcaps across their line. Corking of wine is rare as long as high quality cork is selected for the stoppers and the bottles are stored correctly (on their sides, the cork wetted by the wine, in a cool, dry, sun-free room with a consistently moderate humidity level). Unfortunately, some vintners don’t consistently follow the practice of using “old growth” cork (on a tree that has been already stripped two or three times. As the cork layer grows back (and in fact shedding the cork layer is a natural and healthy part of the tree’s growth cycle) it becomes more consistent and less porous. Good cork, though, is resilient and corking should be rare; I’ve only encountered two or three bottles of good wine that was definitively corked, and then likely because of poor handling and storage. Mind you, screwtops are fine for most wine. Few reds, and almost no whites or fortified wines benefit from aging. Some of my favorite table wines are screwtops (the Bonny Doon wines, for instance) But personally, I like the ritual of opening the bottle with a flurish on the wine key and presentation of the removed cork. I have to agree that the plastic corks are an abomination. The only reason they’re used is because they are cheaper than cork, and almost universally used on inferior quality wine. > [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > If the bottlers change over, how do you expect to keep the cork industry afloat? Bravo, sir. Well played. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/45 "2010-04-27T16:25:00Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > OK, so you don’t like Añejos. I’ll make a note in case you ever come visit. > > I don’t like sex with women, but that doesn’t make “sex with women” a bad thing, it’s just something I don’t happen to like. Maybe añejos are just something you don’t happen to like, and not something bad. 😕 Isn’t Añejos a tequila? And that’s one peculiar analogy to remark on whether gas exchange is desirable in wine aging. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/46 "2010-04-27T16:25:47Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Isn’t cork flooring catching on anywhere? Yeah. Mostly on the underflooring. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/47 "2010-04-27T16:48:20Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > But personally, I like the ritual of opening the bottle with a flourish on the wine key and **presentation of the removed cork.** Any sommelier/waitron who does anything other than give the cork a glance to check for leakage and place it on the table out of the way is going to make me question the advisability of eating at that establishment. Presenting the cork is meaningless and annoying. What the hell am I supposed to do with it? ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/48 "2010-04-27T17:00:12Z")
I love my cordless corkscrew. Works every time and I’ve never lost a cork. ---
**Author:** ![panman\_1960](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@panman\_1960](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panman_1960)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/49 "2010-04-27T17:12:29Z")
So now all the upscale restaurants will have ‘screwing fees’? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/50 "2010-04-27T17:15:30Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Any sommelier/waitron who does anything other than give the cork a glance to check for leakage and place it on the table out of the way is going to make me question the advisability of eating at that establishment. Presenting the cork is meaningless and annoying. What the hell am I supposed to do with it? Nod and say, “Yes, that’s fine, thank you.” What, were you raised in a barn? Stranger ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/51 "2010-04-27T17:16:21Z")
Manger, actually. Why do you ask? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/52 "2010-04-27T18:19:53Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Any sommelier/waitron who does anything other than give the cork a glance to check for leakage and place it on the table out of the way is going to make me question the advisability of eating at that establishment. Presenting the cork is meaningless and annoying. What the hell am I supposed to do with it? As the customer, if in fact you are buying a medium to higher-end wine, you should inspect it. Not smelling it, put squeezing it with your fingers. It should feel moist and not crumbly (unless its a _very_ old wine). It helps give clues as to the wine’s storage. Particularly if you’re blowing a huge wad of cash at restaurant prices on an aged, high end wine. You’d be surprised how many restaurants have expensive wines in their inventory that store them standing up in a makeshift “cellar” that’s 70 degrees F. Good wines should always be stored on their sides. An old red wine that has sediment in it should be stood up hours prior to opening to allow it to settle to the bottom so its easily avoided. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/53 "2010-04-27T18:22:55Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Manger, actually. Why do you ask? 😃 You were supposed to say, “No, whorehouse.” “Fear is not an option.” Stranger ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/54 "2010-04-27T18:41:50Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > As the customer, if in fact you are buying a medium to higher-end wine, you should inspect it. Not smelling it, put squeezing it with your fingers. It should feel moist and not crumbly (unless its a _very_ old wine). It helps give clues as to the wine’s storage. > > Particularly if you’re blowing a huge wad of cash at restaurant prices on an aged, high end wine. You’d be surprised how many restaurants have expensive wines in their inventory that store them standing up in a makeshift “cellar” that’s 70 degrees F. > > Good wines should always be stored on their sides. An old red wine that has sediment in it should be stood up hours prior to opening to allow it to settle to the bottom so its easily avoided. A sip will tell you a helluva lot more about the storage of a wine than the cork will. So why should I bother with the silly thing when the wine is right there in my glass? If I’m blowing that kind of money, the sommelier had better be doing that before the cork ever gets near me. Thus, my comment about not trusting that establishment. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/55 "2010-04-27T19:17:10Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > A sip will tell you a helluva lot more about the storage of a wine than the cork will. So why should I bother with the silly thing when the wine is right there in my glass? > > If I’m blowing that kind of money, the sommelier had better be doing that before the cork ever gets near me. Thus, my comment about not trusting that establishment. True, as will aromas, but the presentation of the cork is an observed tradition. All I was pointing out was that it isn’t _entirely_ without meaning/substance. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/56 "2010-04-27T19:45:02Z")
No, not _entirely_. But meaningless (relatively) ritual should be, at the very least, soothing or comforting. I find the Cork Ritual (Orthodox and Reformed) to be irritating. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/57 "2010-04-27T20:03:31Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > True, as will aromas, but the presentation of the cork is an observed tradition. All I was pointing out was that it isn’t _entirely_ without meaning/substance. Again, my BIL the winemaker has no use for the presentation of the cork. He will smile at the waiter and put the cork down. The glass of wine is right there and will tell him all he needs to know. It may be an observed tradition, but I contend that it is entirely useless, and always has been. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/58 "2010-04-27T20:06:27Z")
Note to **ralph124c** : These go in Cafe Society. I’ll move this one there from The BBQ Pit. **Gfactor** Pit Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/59 "2010-04-27T20:31:48Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Again, my BIL the winemaker has no use for the presentation of the cork. He will smile at the waiter and put the cork down. The glass of wine is right there and will tell him all he needs to know. It may be an observed tradition, but I contend that it is entirely useless, and always has been. “So is our electoral process. But we still vote.” – _State and Main_ Stranger ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456/60 "2010-04-27T21:04:07Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Again, my BIL the winemaker has no use for the presentation of the cork. He will smile at the waiter and put the cork down. The glass of wine is right there and will tell him all he needs to know. It may be an observed tradition, but I contend that it is entirely useless, and always has been. If I were presented with a rotten, crumbling cork, I’d make the sommelier taste it first. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/note-to-winemakers-get-rid-of-those-stupid-effin-corks/537456.md?page=4)