# Now, Al Franken **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 16, 2017, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770 "2017-11-16T15:42:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 47
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/921 "2017-11-22T20:55:02Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > …My own sense is that he should resign, given that we have another complaint against him, but I’m seeing that not so much as “punishment”, but that he’s not going to be able to be effective, and it’s the honorable thing to do. … This I simply don’t understand. Why will these alleged instances of inappropriate conduct render him ineffective? What Senator is going to think/act differently towards him than they did before? What else will cause him to be ineffective? Will anyone else refuse to cooperate with him? I also don’t see how resigning is honorable. Why stop there? Why not seppuku? 😉 Why is an apology insufficient? As someone who agrees with most of his positions, I contend it would be DISHONORABLE for him to give up his current position. As a senator for at least the remainder of his term, he can act in ways that positively and significantly benefit many people. Far more than he could as a private citizen. Moreover, he would be doing a disservice to everyone else who is accused of - IMO - relatively minor transgressions. For him to respect the process available is - IMO - more honorable than giving up and going away. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/922 "2017-11-22T21:09:52Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > This I simply don’t understand. Why will these alleged instances of inappropriate conduct render him ineffective? What Senator is going to think/act differently towards him than they did before? What else will cause him to be ineffective? Will anyone else refuse to cooperate with him? > > I also don’t see how resigning is honorable. … Moreover, he would be doing a disservice to everyone else who is accused of - IMO - relatively minor transgressions. For him to respect the process available is - IMO - more honorable than giving up and going away. Yes. Franken should stand up for the principle that accusations should receive full and fair hearings, and comprehensive investigation. For him to quit before that investigation can take place would be contrary to respect for due process. > [@aurora\_maire](#): > > Gerrymandering, voter suppression and the weaponization of accusations is just the evil trifecta Republicans need to permanently take over the country. Democrats need to be very careful here or the GOP _will_ exploit this to their advantage. Again, yes. Congressional Republicans have proven time and again that they are utterly scruple-free. They will exploit whatever Democrats permit them to exploit. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/923 "2017-11-22T22:19:17Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > This I simply don’t understand. Why will these alleged instances of inappropriate conduct render him ineffective? What Senator is going to think/act differently towards him than they did before? What else will cause him to be ineffective? Will anyone else refuse to cooperate with him? For one thing, which official in MN or fellow Senator is going to ask Franken to help him/her campaign? But like I said, I’m OK if he waits until after the ethics investigation to decide. This is something I think reasonable people can disagree on. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/924 "2017-11-22T22:56:57Z")
People are saying, like Fox says… That Ms Tweeden attended a USO dinner honoring Al Franken’s service to the USO. To imply, apparently, that her disdain for him is of recent vintage. > [@](#): > > …Comedian Franken, who has been on seven United Service Organizations trips overseas, was presented with the organization’s Merit Award during a black-tie dinner at the Ritz Carlton in Pentagon City… (_The Hill_, 2/26/09) [http://thehill.com/homenews/news/18937-franken-accepts-uso-award-in-midst-of-battle](http://thehill.com/homenews/news/18937-franken-accepts-uso-award-in-midst-of-battle) The article does not mention Ms Tweeden, and does not specifically say that the event was dedicated to Al Franken, only that he was awarded. The second: Ms Tweeden heavily implies that Al Franken wrote the “kissing” sketch with the intent of trapping her. In fact, it was a repeat of a sketch done several times before. Think “killer bees” and “landshark”. > [@](#): > > …Senator Franken, you wrote the script. But there’s nothing funny about sexual assault. You wrote that scene that would include you kissing me and then relentlessly badgered me into ‘rehearsing’ the kiss backstage when we were alone.”… > **[Senator Al Franken Kissed and Groped Me Without My Consent, And There’s...](https://www.kabc.com/2017/11/16/leeann-tweeden-on-senator-al-franken/)** > > In December of 2006, I embarked on my ninth USO Tour to entertain our troops, my eighth to the Middle East since the 9/11 attacks. This site offers a youtube video of what appears to be a very similar sketch from a USO show three years earlier. You can see it here: [http://verifiedpolitics.com/rest-photos-videos-franken-tweedens-uso-tour-just-emerged/](http://verifiedpolitics.com/rest-photos-videos-franken-tweedens-uso-tour-just-emerged/) Be advised, liberal cooties do not bother me, others may need to proceed Shields Up. Your correspondent does not testify as to veracity. But people are saying… ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/925 "2017-11-22T22:59:41Z")
Anita Hill is turning over in her future grave. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/926 "2017-11-22T23:15:14Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Anita Hill is turning over in her future grave. I’m curious if you think Al Franken is allowed a defense and if so what you think is permissible for that defense? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/927 "2017-11-22T23:20:14Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > … For him to respect the process available is - IMO - more honorable than giving up and going away. Even when “the process available” is something of a standing joke? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/928 "2017-11-22T23:27:17Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Even when “the process available” is something of a standing joke? Indeed it is but in this case the senate is controlled by his opponents who have every reason to string him up if they can. Presumably the republican zeal to take down Franken if at all possible will lend it some measure of not being a perfunctory process. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/929 "2017-11-22T23:43:01Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Indeed it is but in this case the senate is controlled by his opponents who have every reason to string him up if they can. Presumably the republican zeal to take down Franken if at all possible will lend it some measure of not being a perfunctory process. Perhaps not “every reason”. They have at least one reason not to string him up, and it’s pretty much the same reason that led the process to be thought of as a joke in the first place: they might one day find themselves on the wrong end of the stringing up, so most everyone in Washington seems to tacitly agree to sweep these sort of things under the rug, for everybody, or at least everybody called “Senator”. Just take a look at the articles about harassment by federal elected officials. Almost none of them are willing to name names. There’s a whole lot of “one time I was in an elevator with a Representative, and he did X, Y, and Z” or “we have a perv list we warn all the girls about”, but almost no one seems willing to tell a reporter _WHO_ the gropey Congressman was or _WHO_ is on the perv list. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/930 "2017-11-22T23:43:03Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I’m curious if you think Al Franken is allowed a defense and if so what you think is permissible for that defense? I’m going to ask you to verify that your first question is a serious one before I answer it. He can say whatever the likes in his defense. However, it will not bode well for him if he contradicts things he said in his apology. But I’m not sure the committee will be so concerned with something that happened before he became a Senator. And, AFAICT, the committee is 3 Dems and 3 GOP, so if it comes down to party politics, it’s deadlocked. There is, however, one female Senator (Jeanne Shaheen D-NH) on the committee. That might affect things. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/931 "2017-11-23T00:18:54Z")
[Two more accusers.](https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5a15a455e4b09650540ec295?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/932 "2017-11-23T00:22:24Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > [Two more accusers.](https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5a15a455e4b09650540ec295?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) It doesn’t matter. He’s not resigning, and most of the Democratic party appears to be comfortable with that. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/933 "2017-11-23T00:24:54Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I’m going to ask you to verify that your first question is a serious one before I answer it. It is a serious question and I ask it since your response to someone providing a defense is a backhanded swipe at the person for going there. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/934 "2017-11-23T00:34:16Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It doesn’t matter. He’s not resigning, and most of the Democratic party appears to be comfortable with that. I think he’ll be resigning soon. Don’t know when exactly, but there’s a limit, and I think it’s been crossed. Should have been after credible allegation #1, but it will still be the right thing, both morally and politically, even if it’s late. This is based on personal (online) conversations I’ve had with a party insider (no one particularly famous). ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/935 "2017-11-23T00:34:43Z")
4 accusers is OK and he can stay with 4? What about 6 , 8 , 10 etc? I can see Moore winning the race and then the GOP only agreeing to vote out Moore if Franken quits. It will be quid pro quo. So maybe Franken should hope Moore loses. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/936 "2017-11-23T00:39:17Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > 4 accusers is OK and he can stay with 4? What about 6 , 8 , 10 etc? … It’s almost like a weird man version of those “How many \_\_\_ does it take to screw in a lightbulb?”-style jokes. How many assaulted women does it take to oust a Senator? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/937 "2017-11-23T00:57:02Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > 4 accusers is OK and he can stay with 4? What about 6 , 8 , 10 [/auctioneer] ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/938 "2017-11-23T01:06:46Z")
Ian Flemming: “Once is an incident. Twice is a coincidence. Three times is an enemy action.” ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/939 "2017-11-23T01:09:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I think he’ll be resigning soon. Don’t know when exactly, but there’s a limit, and I think it’s been crossed. Should have been after credible allegation #1, but it will still be the right thing, both morally and politically, even if it’s late. > > This is based on personal (online) conversations I’ve had with a party insider (no one particularly famous). Yeah, but those folks know stuff, so I like your original reporting there. He does seem toast because now the floodgates are opening. So now we move onto Conyers, who is currently at only one accuser. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770/940 "2017-11-23T02:20:04Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > It is a serious question and I ask it since your response to someone providing a defense is a backhanded swipe at the person for going there. What? I have no idea what you are talking about. But if I assume the worse, are you saying that if I criticize a defense, I’m saying that the person deserves no defense? Because that would be really weird. Anyway, can you please quote what you are talking about and explain why whatever I said would imply that I don’t think Franken shouldn’t be allowed a defense. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770.md?page=46) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-al-franken/801770.md?page=48)