# Now Trump has an agenda **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 22, 2017, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334 "2017-08-22T05:30:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![epolo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@epolo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epolo)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2017, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/61 "2017-08-24T14:21:13Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > We could do that. We could install a legislature to write a Constitution that would grant absolute political power to Ahmed Karzai. Or Jared Kushner. Or you. Or me. > > Wouldn’t mean shit to a tree. Not sure what your point is. No one was supposed to be able to pacify Chechnya until Kadyrov did so. All it took was a brutal campaign of rape and murder backed by the full force of Russia. I’m sure we could manage the same in Afghanistan, but only if we had a leader with no moral compass, willing to write a blank check to the military, and learning at Putin’s feet. Do we have one of those? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/62 "2017-08-24T19:19:42Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > I was serious. A strategic alliance with a country of a billion people is substantial and has long range consequences. So is the announcement to stay and continue fighting the Taliban- I think many hoped we would leave. And rooting out terrorists in Pakistan? Could be a whole new war, with a nuclear power no less. Yes, these would be substantial events - if they occur. That’s my point. There’s a huge difference between saying you’re going to do something and doing something. Trump’s speech gave no indication that he has any specific plans for how he’s going to achieve any of the things he said he wanted done. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/63 "2017-08-25T01:56:06Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Yes, these would be substantial events - if they occur. That’s my point. There’s a huge difference between saying you’re going to do something and doing something. Trump’s speech gave no indication that he has any specific plans for how he’s going to achieve any of the things he said he wanted done. I think that as a Rich Businessman, he believes that his announcing that Things Should Be Done will cause the little people to do them. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/64 "2017-08-25T05:18:19Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Yes, these would be substantial events - if they occur. That’s my point. There’s a huge difference between saying you’re going to do something and doing something. Trump’s speech gave no indication that he has any specific plans for how he’s going to achieve any of the things he said he wanted done. Apparently the specific plan is to kill Pakistani terrorists in Pakistan whether Pakistan likes it or not. We have been paying them billions and billions of dollars, after all. The money part really is true. And… > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I think that as a Rich Businessman, he believes that his announcing that Things Should Be Done will cause the little people to do them. doncha think the authorities in Pakistan have heard Trump’s announcement? Do you really want to believe there are no wheels turning already? Or with India. If you prefer to check with them first and see if they are on board with this strategic alliance, I understand. But under the circumstances, I bet they don’t care very much about Trump’s pussy grabbing, or the stability of his psychology, or a lot of other “tabloid news issues”; they care about what the US can do for their people, and very well may be interested in performing military favors in exchange for some help. It has been the US and NATO. Now it is the US and India. You are right, maybe all of this talk will turn out to be so much hot air, but you must admit it was a rather prepared statement as far as Trump speeches go, and that the POTUS has considerable latitude to unilaterally direct military operations, as opposed to repealing Obamacare, building a stupid wall between the US and Mexico, banning Muslims from entering the country, and a slew of other things in which he is caught in a web of checks and balances. I bet every authority in the world has at least heard this plan and has thought about how to respond to it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/65 "2017-08-25T05:56:54Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Apparently the specific plan is to kill Pakistani terrorists in Pakistan whether Pakistan likes it or not. We have been paying them billions and billions of dollars, after all. The money part really is true. And… We’ve been making attacks in Pakistan since 2004. I realize President Trump may have just learned that this week. So it may seem like a new idea to him. But it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/66 "2017-08-25T06:18:14Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > You are right, maybe all of this talk will turn out to be so much hot air, but you must admit it was a rather prepared statement as far as Trump speeches go That’s pretty tepid praise for a president. Why not applaud his ability to dress himself while you’re at it (assuming he does) ? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/67 "2017-08-25T08:56:19Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > …but you must admit it was a rather prepared statement as far as Trump speeches go… In other words, ‘to be discounted immediately.’ ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/68 "2017-08-25T13:28:17Z")
I don’t think we have been making attacks in Pakistan in cooperation with India since 2004. Excuse me for taking it seriously. I am not a Trump fan, but honestly I found Trevor Noah’s response to be immature and vapid. To me it looks like the US is stirring the pot with nuclear foes and changing it"s stance. Seemed worth noting. If it is all a big nothing burger then I guess I got trolled by the POTUS. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/69 "2017-08-25T14:34:23Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Seemed worth noting. If it is all a big nothing burger then I guess I got trolled by the POTUS. Why would you think the vague phrases were worth noting this time when promising the moon and delivering … well, nothing, has been the standard throughout the campaign and presidency so far. He promised great health care, said he had the way to do it cheaper and better. Then he said it was complicated. Then left it to congress. Applauded the house bill. Then called it mean. And now wants them just to pass anything at all, never mind cheaper and better like he promised. He promised a tax plan in the campaign. Then promised a tax plan was forthcoming surprising his cabinet who had to come up with something. Presenting a nothing. And now, months later, congress is apparently proceeding on the assumption nothing of relevance will emerge from the White House and they need to starting moving on their own. He promised an immediate infrastructure bill. Nothing. Promised to bring China to heel. Nothing. Promised to bring down drug prices, then decided high drug prices was actually fine … But I have better ways to spend my evening. What Trump said was that people with actual expertise told him all his ideas were bonkers, and he’d decided to let them get on with it. The people with actual expertise are the same who’ve been running things, albeit with more oversight than DJT is planning, for the last decades. If they had any sure fire ways to solve things, it would have been solved already, but at least this way Trump can blame the generals if things don’t go well, and take credit for letting the generals have their way if things go well. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/70 "2017-08-25T18:30:58Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > I don’t think we have been making attacks in Pakistan in cooperation with India since 2004. What on earth makes you think we are going to be doing that now? Or that some new strategic alliance with India has been formed? Based on this? > [@](#): > > Another critical part of the South Asia strategy for America is to further develop its strategic partnership with India – the world’s largest democracy and a key security and economic partner of the United States. We appreciate India’s important contributions to stability in Afghanistan, but India makes billions of dollars in trade with the United States, and we want them to help us more with Afghanistan, especially in the area of economic assistance and development. We are committed to pursuing our shared objectives for peace and security in South Asia and the broader Indo-Pacific region. That sounds a lot less like Trump saying we have a military alliance with India and India is goin to attack Pakistan as part of this alliance (an alliance which would be news to India to find out and something I’m sure they’d have a few things to say about) and more like Trump thinking that India should pay us or being in Afghanistan, rather like Mexico should pay for his wall. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/71 "2017-08-25T21:21:33Z")
> [@epolo](#): > > Not sure what your point is. No one was supposed to be able to pacify Chechnya until Kadyrov did so. All it took was a brutal campaign of rape and murder backed by the full force of Russia. I’m sure we could manage the same in Afghanistan, but only if we had a leader with no moral compass, willing to write a blank check to the military, and learning at Putin’s feet. Do we have one of those? > Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk It’s worth pointing out, for whatever it’s worth, that a lot of Russians now think that their efforts to hang on to Chechnya and fight secession were not worth it. This is partly for ethnic nationalist reasons, partly for financial reasons and partly b/c of disgust at Kadyrov. Half of Russians “would be OK with” Chechen independence, up from 11% in 1998. (This was taken in 2012, I think, but since ethnic consciousness has grown in Russia since then, and Kadryov’s violence and profligate spending have gotten even more over-the-top, I would bet the numbers are even higher now, although advocating for secession is illegal I think). > **[Poll Shows Half Of Russians Don't Oppose Chechen Split](https://www.rferl.org/a/chechnya-russia-poll-independence/25034502.html)** > > A new poll suggests that about half of Russians would not mind if Chechnya broke away from Russia. The independent Levada Center says its survey highlights growing disillusionment with the Kremlin's policies in the North Caucasus. If we follow the same route in Afghanistan we can probably expect to be regretting it in ten years just like the Russians do. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/72 "2017-08-25T21:30:10Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Uh…who are you talking to here? > > That’s nice and all, but…well, wtf does this have to do with anything I said? Or…well, have to do with anything? > > Again…what the hell are you talking about? What’s this got to do with anything in this thread, anything I wrote or, well, anything? If you want to cop to heavy drug use at this point, I’m good with that…I can totally sympathize. I’ll only caution you that heavy use of drugs might not make the Pakistani’s happy, for whatever that’s worth. > > Well, I don’t know…what does Alex Jones think? I mean, he’s got to have something to say about India coming out…it’s probably linked to gay frogs or something like that. > > Next time you want to just fly off the handle and talk to yourself like this leave me out of it, if you would. But…well, as always, thanks for the input! _backs away_ Have a nice day… What part of **AK84** comment did you find difficult to read? because it was perfectly plain to me. The mutual dislike between Afghans and “Indians” is very ancient, for a whole bunch of historical reasons, and there are serious and complex territorial disputes between India and Pakistan as well. America really ought to stay neutral and not take a side between India and Pakistan, and in particular should not try to recruit Indian assistance in Afghanistan. _Particularly_ when India is under the rule of a Hindu nationalist government. Why are you so into the idea that America and India are “natural allies”, whatever that means? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/73 "2017-08-25T22:51:52Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > I don’t think we have been making attacks in Pakistan in cooperation with India since 2004. We haven’t been making attacks in Pakistan in cooperation with the United Federation of Planets either. Trump should have promised an alliance with those guys. They have phasers. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/74 "2017-08-26T00:50:58Z")
“And now, for my next racist trick…” [Trump pardons former Sheriff Joe Arpaio](http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/sheriff-joe-arpaio-donald-trump-pardon/index.html) Funny how there was ‘no pardon paperwork’ according to the Justice Dept. just last week… He tried to slide that one by, doing it late on a Friday. Guess what? It ain’t sliding. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334/75 "2017-08-26T07:57:02Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Funny how there was ‘no pardon paperwork’ according to the Justice Dept. just last week… That’s because he skipped involving them, but I’m sure there will be (or is) a separate thread on this. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-trump-has-an-agenda/794334.md?page=3)