# Now you're making stuff up. \[Obama's citizenship\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 31, 2009, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427 "2009-03-31T14:16:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/281 "2009-04-02T20:21:24Z")
> [@Furious\_Marmot](#): > > The only way to tell for sure is that God always tells the truth and demons always lie. Wrong on both counts. Demons would have to be idiots to always lie, because in the long run that’s the same as saying nothing, as no one would ever listen. As for the Lord of Hosts, consider this passage from the[18th chapter of Genesis](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018&version=9;): [QUOTE=a bronze age scribe, as translated by scribes in the pay of King James] 9 And they said unto him, Where is Sarah thy wife? And he said, Behold, in the tent. 10 And he said, I will certainly return unto thee according to the time of life; and, lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him. 11 Now Abraham and Sarah were old and well stricken in age; and it ceased to be with Sarah after the manner of women. 12 Therefore Sarah laughed within herself, saying, After I am waxed old shall I have pleasure, my lord being old also? 13 And the LORD said unto Abraham, Wherefore did Sarah laugh, saying, Shall I of a surety bear a child, which am old? [/QUOTE] God clearly lies here. And with good reason: there was no point in telling Abraham the bald true, as it would simply hurt his feelings for no good reason. But God can, in fact, lie. Well, he could if he existed. But the notion that God is incapable of obfuscation is as untrue as the notion that Vulcans are. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/282 "2009-04-02T20:26:17Z")
Never mind. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/283 "2009-04-02T20:32:57Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > God clearly lies here. And with good reason: there was no point in telling Abraham the bald true, as it would simply hurt his feelings for no good reason. But God can, in fact, lie. > [@The 21st chapter of that same story](#): > > 1And the LORD visited Sarah as he had said, and the LORD did unto Sarah as he had spoken. > > 2For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him. > > 3And Abraham called the name of his son that was born unto him, whom Sarah bare to him, Isaac. I’m not getting the lie. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/284 "2009-04-02T20:36:48Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I’m not getting the lie. Upon overhearing the prophecy that she would have a child, Sarah laughed and said “Seems unlikely. My hubby’s really, really old.” The clear subtext being that his winkie no workie no morie. The Lord of Hosts, relatiing this to Abraham, claimed that she laughed and said “Seems unlikely. _I_ am very old.” The clear subtext being that she was mocking her own no-longer-functional plumbing. The LoH is sparing Abraham’s feelings with a lie. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/285 "2009-04-02T20:43:44Z")
If I may help you, here’s (to me) a much more clear lie: > [@The first among Gods](#): > > **17** But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/286 "2009-04-02T20:46:14Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Well, then, thank Og McCain wasn’t elected because he was born in Panama, not the US. > > Except, of course, that McCain was a US citizen from birth because his parents were US citizens. > > So… your statements and insinuations are, as I have said several times now, a steaming pile of nonsensical crap. > > It doesn’t matter how large or small the group is who is claiming it: See, that’s what I don’t get about Obama being born in Kenya-his mother was a citizen of the US. So wouldn’t he have been one automatically? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/287 "2009-04-02T20:49:11Z")
> [@bup](#): > > If I may help you, here’s (to me) a much more clear lie: Not a lie : in Eden, man was immortal AFAIK. Outside, we die. OK, so it was something of a Ben Kenobi-ism, “true from a certain point of view”, but still, not an outright lie. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/288 "2009-04-02T20:50:16Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > …Baal is worshiped by promiscuity and abortions. Ah! A religion I could get behind. ---
**Author:** ![Geek\_Mecha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecae2f/32.png) [@Geek\_Mecha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geek_Mecha)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/289 "2009-04-02T20:50:26Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > Kapi’olani Medical Center was orginally opened by Queen Kapi’olani, ergo it’s the same place! Just wanted to add that the sources you quote are contradictory, perhaps the result of not knowing Hawaii has had at least three queens. The Queen’s Medical Center is not the same as the Kapi’olani hospitals. Queen’s (as it is called) was named for Queen Emma, who founded it with her husband. It’s located in downtown, near the capitol building. Emma was the niece of Kapi’olani, who now has two medical centers named for her: one, the one for Women and Children, about 2 miles from Queen’s, and the other near Pearl Harbor, called Pali Momi. At least they have the dates consistent. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/290 "2009-04-02T20:50:51Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Not a lie : in Eden, man was immortal AFAIK. Outside, we die. OK, so it was something of a Ben Kenobi-ism, “true from a certain point of view”, but still, not an outright lie What about \*in the day that thou eatest thereof \*? Does that not mean you’ll shed this mortal coil _the same day_? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/291 "2009-04-02T20:54:11Z")
What I can’t get is \*how \*promiscuity and abortions worship Baal. I mean, they aren’t even concrete nouns? When’s the last time you saw a promiscuity saunter in a Temple of Baal for fuck’s sake? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/292 "2009-04-02T20:58:07Z")
> [@bup](#): > > What about \*in the day that thou eatest thereof \*? Does that not mean you’ll shed this mortal coil _the same day_? Well, yes. And on the very day they ate the fruit, they were voted off the Island and turned into mortals. Which, to an eternal being, is like being dead already - isn’t a thousand years the same as a day to God ? (Man, it’s so easy to bullshit with religion :p) ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/293 "2009-04-02T21:07:24Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > Just out of interest, Kanicbird, what would you accept as proof that Obama was born in the US? Divine revelation, but I really don’t care where he was born as God will provide for me no matter what demon rules this country. I think there is enough evidence that suggests that Obama was not born in the US to make the scenario that humans have lost total control of the presidency a real (but perhaps remote, perhaps not) possibility. AFAIK this is the only case in history where a actual ‘president’ would be barred from being president by law (again _ **if** _ Obama was born outside the US). If this is the case Obama would have no authority at all in that office and he would be a puppet. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/294 "2009-04-02T21:07:48Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > See, that’s what I don’t get about Obama being born in Kenya-his mother was a citizen of the US. So wouldn’t he have been one automatically? Quite. However, he might not have fit the “natural born citizen” clause of the Constitution, depending on [how it’s interpreted.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural-born_citizen#Constitutional_provisions) > [@Wikipedia](#): > > The term “natural born Citizen” has never been defined by the Courts in the course of a Presidential qualification challenge. It is believed by some that this provision means that only persons born on U.S. soil to two U.S. citizens are “natural born Citizens” of the nation and eligible to become President. There are others who believe that anyone who acquires citizenship by any means other than naturalization is a “natural born Citizen” and eligible for the Presidency. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/295 "2009-04-02T21:10:12Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > What I can’t get is \*how \*promiscuity and abortions worship Baal. I mean, they aren’t even concrete nouns? > > When’s the last time you saw a promiscuity saunter in a Temple of Baal for fuck’s sake? Ever hear of Planned Parenthood, one of the many temples of Baal, where children are cut up and incinerated. Human sacrifice has been a aspect of worship for a very long time. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/296 "2009-04-02T21:11:24Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Divine revelation, but I really don’t care where he was born as God will provide for me no matter what demon rules this country. I think there is enough evidence that suggests that Obama was not born in the US to make the scenario that humans have lost total control of the presidency a real (but perhaps remote, perhaps not) possibility. Yeah, but we’ll get it back in four (or eight) years anyway. It’s the beauty of democracy! Anyway, demonic rule is still an improvement over the last guy. ---
**Author:** ![Hakuna\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hakuna\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hakuna_Matata)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/297 "2009-04-02T21:17:05Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > See, that’s what I don’t get about Obama being born in Kenya-his mother was a citizen of the US. So wouldn’t he have been one automatically? Yes-but the wingnuts argument (is it really fair to call if an argument if it doesn’t hold water?) is that supposedly in 1961 in the US your child was only considered a citizen if you, yourself, had been an a citizen for ten years and five of that had to be after age 14–his mother was only 18 at the time he was born, thus they argue she was a year shy of this requirement and thus he was not a natural born citizen. But the problem lies in that only applies if your child was born OUTSIDE the US. Oops. The wingnuts always conveniently forget that part, or parlay it into why his being born in Kenya is so important. Funny thing is there is no Passport or other official recognition of his mother EVER going to Kenya as far as I know. You wouldn’t think a 18 year old mother would be so clever as to be able to slip by both the US and Kenyan government pass port portals. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/298 "2009-04-02T21:17:05Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > AFAIK this is the only case in history where a actual ‘president’ would be barred from being president by law I’m pretty sure Andrew Jackson had a few nutcases up in arms because they suspected he wasn’t born in the United States. I don’t recall if demons took over that time or not. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/299 "2009-04-02T21:21:02Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Ever hear of Planned Parenthood, one of the many temples of Baal, where children are cut up and incinerated. Human sacrifice has been a aspect of worship for a very long time. You are a Grade-A nutcase, ya know that? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/300 "2009-04-02T21:21:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > See, that’s what I don’t get about Obama being born in Kenya-his mother was a citizen of the US. So wouldn’t he have been one automatically? Possibly not under the laws of the time. There was an age restriction that Obama’s mother would not have passed. > **[Is Barack Obama a Natural-Born Citizen of the U.S.?](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/native-son/)** > > Is Barack Obama a natural-born citizen of the U.S.? The law may have not had the effect of denying him citizenship at birth because of his mother’s age, but that’s not clear legally. However, tt’s moot because he was born in the US. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427.md?page=16)