# Now you're making stuff up. \[Obama's citizenship\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 31, 2009, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427 "2009-03-31T14:16:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![Jane\_Elliot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jane_elliot/32/6166_2.png) [@Jane\_Elliot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jane_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/421 "2009-04-03T17:38:21Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Correction: > > But that answer just shows how deft you are in avoid dealing with the fact that you were wrong, you are indeed dismissing the Hispanic nations that expect the women will keep their past identities, just like the males, and in the case of the current secretary of state this is only a “problem” of your own creation. > > What you are saying, regarding what needs to be done to solve that “problem”, is “to let go and take the authority that one is entitled to”; however, that is not needed at all to have a happy family or an effective life. The spiritual component does not depend on the name you choose. Of course things like that only show that your version of god and theology make no sense at all, but that is not a surprise really. And it’s not just Hispanic nations. The practice of taking the husband’s last name is far from universal geographically and rather recent historically. I’ll see if I can dig up some sites, but I’m pressed for time right now. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/422 "2009-04-03T17:50:55Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > That’s what happens when you post things out of context. Again God looks at the heart, the intent of your message. In other words, Ladies and Gentlemen, **Kanicbird** has a monopoly on understanding God’s Word, and everyone else is wrong. > [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > At the Vatican? Actually-I don’t think so. Say what you will about the Church-they’re pretty scholarly. _Sola scriptura_, aka, the Bible says, I believe it, period-isn’t a tenant of the Church. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/423 "2009-04-03T19:49:16Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Say what you will about the Church-they’re pretty scholarly. _Sola scriptura_, aka, the Bible says, I believe it, period-isn’t a tenant of the Church. I think you mean **tenet** , although presumably _sola scriptura_ doesn’t pay rent either. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/424 "2009-04-03T19:58:58Z")
Isn’t the Pope considered infallible, God’s only representative on the earthly plane, or something like that? If Pope Benny flounced out onto the balcony this afternoon and said that God told him that all Catholics had to cluck like a chicken every Wednesday from 8:00 to 9:00 in the morning, who’s gonna go troll-hunter on him? ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/425 "2009-04-03T20:08:06Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Very well, make it all conditional, then. I’ve pretty much had enough of him. I’m just surprised he hasn’t brought up the mark of Cain. I wish he would expound on that subject because I have no idea of what mark to look for. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/426 "2009-04-03T20:31:02Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > I wish he would expound on that subject because I have no idea of what mark to look for. The mark of Cain is a footprint on one’s abdomen. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/427 "2009-04-03T20:37:18Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > The mark of Cain is a footprint on one’s abdomen. What do you mean? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/428 "2009-04-03T20:41:36Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > What do you mean? [Caine](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kung_Fu_(TV_series)) ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/429 "2009-04-03T20:52:07Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > [Caine](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kung_Fu_(TV_series)) Oho. Never a fan of that series, for some reason. It needed more horses (which itself is Rhymer family slang for a work of art you dislike for no reason the person dislking it can articulate). ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/430 "2009-04-03T20:52:23Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Isn’t the Pope considered infallible, God’s only representative on the earthly plane, or something like that? > > If Pope Benny flounced out onto the balcony this afternoon and said that God told him that all Catholics had to cluck like a chicken every Wednesday from 8:00 to 9:00 in the morning, who’s gonna go troll-hunter on him? Well, no. The infallibility thing only applies when the Pope speaks _ex cathedra_, laying out Catholic dogma. At all other times, he’s no more infallible than any other old guy in a funny hat. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/431 "2009-04-03T20:56:33Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > Isn’t Kanicbird actually a woman? speaking on behalf of all womankind, _ **PLEASE** _ don’t saddle us with kanicbird … Though now I think about it, Kanic has demonstrated he is a demon … he is trying to sow dissent and foment argument. Think of it as uber trollism, with pointy horns, pitchfork and tail 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/432 "2009-04-03T20:57:28Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I think you mean **tenet** , although presumably _sola scriptura_ doesn’t pay rent either. Having recently done this as a mini-rant, and with reference to the comments upthread, I think we can safely identify the tenants of a faith as, clearly, paying rent to a lessor god! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/433 "2009-04-04T00:18:08Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I think you mean **tenet** , although presumably _sola scriptura_ doesn’t pay rent either. :smack: I’m a TERRIBLE speller. Dammit. **Jack Batty** , what **shantih**. [Papal Infallibility](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_Infallibility). And here: [_“It is incorrect to hold that doctrine teaches that the Pope is infallible in everything he says. In reality, the invocation of papal infallibility is extremely rare.”_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_Infallibility#Instances_of_papal_infallibility) So the two instances in the past have had to with the Assumption of Mary and the Immaculate Conception. Is it not fascinating that this is in a discussion about the citizenship of our current president? Oh **Kanicbird** , you so crazy! ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/434 "2009-04-04T01:00:37Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Is it not fascinating that this is in a discussion about the citizenship of our current president? Oh **Kanicbird** , you so crazy! If we can get him to talk about the (non)existence of woman sperm and the need to cede to male authority in that area, the thread’ll have it all. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/435 "2009-04-04T01:32:43Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > :smack: > > I’m a TERRIBLE speller. Dammit. Don’t be so hard on yourself. You spelled “tenant” perfectly. You could use some work on choosing the right word in the first place, though. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/436 "2009-04-04T06:20:55Z")
> [@Andy L View](#): > > Be careful when using that device - an early version had a tendency to drop users off in universes where the shape J (that’s like half-a-U) was used as a letter (replacing I in some but not all cases). It was iust the most frustrating thing you could imagine. > It couldn’t have been any more frustrating that I felt when I landed on a strange planet, in an entirely different galaxy, and I was immediately arrested and imprisoned in a totalitarian society where all citizens were forced to submit their free will to some kind of a Hive-Mind, or something. > [@](#): > > It couldn’t have been any more frustrating that I felt when I landed on a strange planet, in an entirely different galaxy, and I was immediately arrested and imprisoned in a totalitarian society where all citizens were forced to submit their free will to some kind of a Hive-Mind, or something. > Ok. You win there. So how are you dealing with your new hive-mind existence? THAT’S IT! I was wondering why I stopped reading Golden Age SF! ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/437 "2009-04-04T11:29:31Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > The mark of Cain is a footprint on one’s abdomen. Thank you, Master, for the enlightenment. My ignorance has been vanquished. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/438 "2009-04-04T12:43:24Z")
> [@Jane\_Elliot](#): > > And it’s not just Hispanic nations. The practice of taking the husband’s last name is far from universal geographically and rather recent historically. I’ll see if I can dig up some sites, but I’m pressed for time right now. No one said that man is following God’s ways. Scriptures clearly show the lineage going through the masculine, plus only the sins of the father being passed on. The union of man and woman is also that of Jesus and the church. Jesus is the bridegroom and the church is the bride (scriptural cite available). We, the church submit our our identity and take on that of Jesus. We get full authority to pray in Jesus’ name, and we are not to pray in our own name: [QUOTE=Eph 5:] 31"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."[a] 32This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church. [/QUOTE] In the same way the woman is not to act in her own name, but submit herself to her new identity. We can see this in Ahab and Jezebel, Jezebel knew to take full power she had to act in the name of Ahab, not that of Jezebel, and used Ahab’s seal. This does not put her down but builds both of them up. Any attempt to hold on to her old identity goes against the union and diminishes her authority. It would like me praying in the name of kanicbird instead of Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/439 "2009-04-04T12:50:46Z")
You’re living proof of the wisdom of the establishment clause. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427/440 "2009-04-04T13:04:18Z")
> [@Eutychus](#): > > You can claim whatever you like. "For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. " (1 Corinthians 11:13-14) That what scripture is all about; so that Christians would have some standard to refer to if they did meet people they thought might be unqualified or preaching nonsense. > > Your preaching does not meet up to the standards of scripture and by your own theology, has to be tossed out. > > Hoist by your own petard, as it were. First, In the name of Jesus I rebuke you, you who claim to know scriptures by man’s authority but don’t glorify God by not crediting enlightenment by His Spirit, but only seek to glorify yourself. [QUOTE=1 Tim 1:7] They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm. [/QUOTE] Second, you taking verses out of context, and even unreferenced is a tool of the devil (Luke 4:10-11) and I expose this in the name of Lord Jesus [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427.md?page=21) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/now-youre-making-stuff-up-obamas-citizenship/491427.md?page=23)