# Nuclear meltdown! Holy Godzilla NOOOO!!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 12, 2011, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389 "2011-03-12T08:19:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 70
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1381 "2011-04-04T21:04:20Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Do you realize Three Mile Island had a core meltdown (happened in the first few hours of the disaster)? Half the core was melted. > > They did not realize it till years later when they were able to open the reactor and have a look. There is a big difference between “we weren’t sure but we figured it was possible that it happened” and “it surprised the hell out of everyone(that has a clue about science and engineering and stuff) that it had happened”. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1382 "2011-04-04T21:04:41Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > [Is nuclear energy worth the risk? - CNN.com](http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/04/04/nuclear.debate/index.html) Spain’s solar industry is not doing so well (wind seems to be where it is at for them now). > [@](#): > > Spain’s struggling solar-power sector has announced it will sue the government over two royal decrees that will reduce tariffs retroactively, claiming they will cause huge losses for the industry. > > \ > > The decrees are part of the newly launched tariff framework that will cut payouts for ground-mounted solar energy projects by 45% this year, killing future investment in the trade, which industry leaders expect will be frozen in the next few years. > > SOURCE: [Factor This™ Energy Understood. All Factored In.](http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea/news/article/2011/01/spains-solar-sector-sues-government-over-retroactive-tariff-cuts) ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1383 "2011-04-04T21:06:26Z")
There you go. The best way to assure people that nuclear power is safe, is to talk about other shit instead of nuclear power. We are proud of you son. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1384 "2011-04-04T21:09:52Z")
[QUOTE=FXMastermind] Instead of bragging about your experience, why not educate us with some facts? Not that we believe you about having been there, but still, you could take the same amount of time you spent bragging and post some figures. [/QUOTE] Bragging, ehe? 😛 Too funny. Here is a [Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yucca_Mountain_nuclear_waste_repository) on Yucca Mountain. As of 2008, the [DOE](http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/newsarticle.aspx?id=20196) was estimating costs at $96 billion and change (this of course doesn’t count the costs the government will have to pay to the nuclear power companies because they defaulted on their promise to build a waste repository…a waste repository that nuclear power companies also ponied up money for). Now, obviously some of those costs won’t ever have to be paid, since the repository will seemingly never get used: > [@](#): > > The new estimated cost of $96.2 billion includes some $13.5 billion that has already spent on the project; $54.8 billion for the construction, operation and decommissioning of the repository; $19.5 billion for transportation of the used fuel; and, $8.4 billion for other program activities. I think the $13.5 billion is way low for the supposed costs ‘already spent on the project’, but that’s what this cite says so that’s the answer to your question. Of course, eventually people will realize that we have to put the waste somewhere (or start allowing reprocessing), so it will probably get jerked around again, so we can pour more money into it, only to have it killed again by the anti-nuke fruit cakes like you…only to realize again that we have to do something…so we can jerk it around again…and pour more money into it, only to have anti-nuke fruit cakes like you kill it again…rinse…repeat…waste more money… > [@](#): > > But, you said you knew all about it. Did they leave you out of the budget meetings? Didn’t you get the memo about the cost over runs? The serious problems that caused the redesigns? The serious problems caused by folks like you with signs, making ridiculous demands about unrealistic time frames that it has to be ‘safe’ in, and poisoning the well so much in Nevada with fear and bullshit that the project was eventually killed? Yeah…I know all about them. -XT ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1385 "2011-04-04T21:11:22Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Do you realize Three Mile Island had a core meltdown (happened in the first few hours of the disaster)? Half the core was melted. > > They did not realize it till years later when they were able to open the reactor and have a look. It was years _until_ they could get to it. Contamination and stuff. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1386 "2011-04-04T21:11:42Z")
Don’t blame me motherfucker. I never protested shit, much less tried to stop Yucca mountain. Fuck Nevada, fill that shit up. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1387 "2011-04-04T21:13:18Z")
At TMI they were all like, “What? The water leaked into the other reactor containment building? And now we can’t use that one either?” Yeah bitches, that is exactly what happened. And then they realized the concrete was too contaminated to move, so it’s all still there. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1388 "2011-04-04T21:26:49Z")
And 100 years from now, what are the odds that anyone alive when TMI happened will still be alive, huh? Huh? Just about zero, that’s what. They will all be dead! All of the workers at the nuclear power plant in Japan will all be dead too! That’s how deadly nuclear power is! Everyone working at every nuclear power plant IN THE WORLD TODAY WILL BE DEAD TOO! All of them. 100%!! Scary, no? -XT ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1389 "2011-04-04T23:08:12Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > The [GE 2.5 MW turbine](http://www.gepower.com/prod_serv/products/wind_turbines/en/downloads/GEA17007A-Wind25Brochure.pdf) (PDF) needs a wind speed of 28 MPH to achieve that. Below that speed the power generation drops off precipitously (look at their brochure…this is their own numbers). > > Know a lot of places in the US with a sustained wind speed of over 28 MPH? Even a slight breeze generates some electricity. Unlike a destroyed nuke plant, which generates nothing that gets onto the grid. A destroyed nuke plant can contribute to the food chain for years. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1390 "2011-04-04T23:16:03Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Are ‘the officials’ liars? Fuckhead clowns and idiots? Why yes, yes they are. > > [http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/04\_10.html](http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/04_10.html) I think that is a big reason for the difference of opinion. The nukies don’t believe that officials would like to them. They don’t believe that a nuclear core can meltdown until it is confirmed that it has meltdown. Until confirmed, it is a trivial accident spouting trivial amount of radiation, after it is confirmed it happened years ago due to bad design we aren’t using anymore, we can’t possibly design another bad design and look over there! A windspill! It’s Schrodinger’s fucking meltdown. It doesn’t exist and if you can confirm it, then it took place in the past. These folks think that Three Mile Island and Chernobyl were not big deals. The general public is of a different opinion because they have to drink the irradiated kool aid as it builds up in the food chain. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1391 "2011-04-04T23:39:22Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Even a slight breeze generates some electricity. Not if it can’t overcome the force of static friction. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2011, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1392 "2011-04-04T23:46:56Z")
[QUOTE=The Second Stone] Even a slight breeze generates some electricity. [/QUOTE] Hell, even a wind turbine that’s been destroyed in a storm or is down for maintenance probably generates some electricity. A volt or two here, a volt or two there and after a while you are talking enough to light a light bulb…and after that it’s all money! > [@](#): > > Unlike a destroyed nuke plant, which generates nothing that gets onto the grid. And since this happens so often, it’s no wonder that the grid is always on the verge of brown outs or black outs…er, but it doesn’t, so your point is silly. > [@](#): > > A destroyed nuke plant can contribute to the food chain for years. Well, that’s good, since every little bit contributing to the food chain is a helpment! Oh, you meant the radiation thingy, right? Well, it’s a shame that they get destroyed so often then, isn’t it? On a happier note, a working coal plant contributes to the food chain for years too…and a destroyed one contributes all the more, so it’s all good! 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1393 "2011-04-05T00:13:37Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > The [GE 2.5 MW turbine](http://www.gepower.com/prod_serv/products/wind_turbines/en/downloads/GEA17007A-Wind25Brochure.pdf) (PDF) needs a wind speed of 28 MPH to achieve that. Below that speed the power generation drops off precipitously (look at their brochure…this is their own numbers). > > Know a lot of places in the US with a sustained wind speed of over 28 MPH? [This is](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GE_Wind_Energy#Products) an overview of their capabilities. Cut-in is 7.8 mph and cut-out is 56 mph. If someone tells you you’re going to get 2.5MW sustained output from a turbine, they’re lying. It they tell you you’re going to get 500MW sustained output from a 500MW-rated nuke plant they’re lying. If a utility installs a wind farm, they’re going to know what the whole farm can be expected to produce, and they’re not going to be saying “ah, man! That guy said we’d get 2.5MW out of these things all the time!” Of course, in the news release they will keep things simple and, as a for instance, just multiply [2.5MW times 338 and call it an 845MW wind farm](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shepherds_Flat_Wind_Farm). Lyin’ bastards. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1394 "2011-04-05T00:28:14Z")
The thing about them windmills, is when the wind does blow, you get a shitload of power from them. Like, a lot. And if you base your value on power, which means money, and sometimes you get like, a lot of money from wind, it kind of makes it attractive. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1395 "2011-04-05T00:29:24Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > Not if it can’t overcome the force of static friction. I live next to a very big wind farm, and they are almost always turning, even when it feels like there is no breeze on the ground level. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1396 "2011-04-05T00:33:41Z")
Stupid windmills. Always turning, making power. And nobody realizes how deadly they are. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1397 "2011-04-05T01:00:21Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I live next to a very big wind farm, and they are almost always turning, even when it feels like there is no breeze on the ground level. You are in danger. I live about 30 miles from Fermi’ It has only suffered one meltdown . There is a book about it" the Day We Almost lost Detroit". I would just be an uninformed anti nukie. if that bothered me. It has had endless problems and has been for a while, used as a teaching facility because they were afraid to turn it up to full power. It cost a pile of money to build. It never delivered. But the fact that it really did not quite vaporize Detroit proves nuclear is safe. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1398 "2011-04-05T01:02:57Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > But the fact that it really did not quite vaporize Detroit proves nuclear is safe. Detroit? It DIDN’T destroy it? Well, hell that alone shows how shitty nucleeuurr power is. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1399 "2011-04-05T01:21:40Z")
I thought Fermi was near Chicago. I went to UCLA and they had (and may still have) a reactor in Boelter Hall for the engineering and physics students to screw around with. I walked within 100 yards of that monstrosity every day. That proves that Godzilla is tame. Rancho Seco is the nearest commercial reactor to where I live, and it was shut down by its owners (SMUD f’in voting taxpayers) because it never worked at more than 39 percent capacity. There are a few reactors near Sunol and probably a whole bunch in Livermore at the mad scientists lab there. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2011, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1400 "2011-04-05T01:28:03Z")
Yucca mountain was approved in 1978. It has had 10 billion dollars spent on it. The cost over runs have been enormous. It has not been finished .I suppose the anti nukers used their enormous political pull to end it. Where the hell was that power for the last 3 decades? It has been a very good repository of tax money. Thirty years and 10 billion dollars indicates the anti nukers power stopped it?. XT ,think about it. How dumb was that claim? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389.md?page=69) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389.md?page=71)