# Nuclear meltdown! Holy Godzilla NOOOO!!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 12, 2011, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389 "2011-03-12T08:19:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 78
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1541 "2011-04-12T17:10:23Z")
Clearly Japan wouldn’t want to call it a 7 without good evidence. Now that they have it (and probably with a good deal or arm twisting from the US and France) they upgraded it. While the amounts of radioactive materials are staggering, much higher than even the alarmists thought, the real reason for a 7 category is loss of containment. Which seemed obvious once we saw pictures of the reactor buildings, but they kept saying “we don’t know”, which is actually accurate, and they won’t know by observations for decades, if ever. But the amount of radioactive material that has left the reactors and ended up in the air, land and ocean, they can’t keep that covered up. And while a nuclear denier really wants to believe, physics tells us that radioactive material from the core of a reactor flooding into the ocean means the containment is breached. I know, I know, it’s terrible. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1542 "2011-04-12T17:17:59Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > I know, I know, it’s terrible. or for a somewhat less batshit crazy viewpoint > **[Mummy, mummy, there's a nuclear monster!](https://www.theregister.com/2011/04/12/fukushima_ffs/)** > > Go back to BED! No more stories from Auntie Fear for you > [@](#): > > The facts are that the incident at Fukushima Daiichi remains far and away the most minor of the various consequences which have followed the initial, devastating magnitude-9.0 quake and tsunami which struck northeastern Japan nearly a month ago. It has caused less human consequences than a moderate road-traffic accident. The nuclear reactors in the stricken provinces came through mostly unscathed (even at the Daiichi site two are expected to return to service, and at other nuclear powerplants in the region no significant damage at all was seen). One nuclear worker, in a crane cab at the time, was killed by the quake strike at the Daini plant: two were killed by the tsunami wave at Daiichi. A handful have been injured by the quake and following hydrogen explosions. > > Almost all other infrastructure hit by the natural disaster failed catastrophically. Housing, transport and industry across the region collapsed with deadly consequences, killing people by the tens of thousands. Oil plants, chemical factories, storage facilities and tankers of every type ruptured and burned, spilling megatonnes of pollution and carcinogens into the environment. But almost nothing is heard of all this, except as a footnote to the supposed radiological hazards resulting from the Fukushima Daiichi reactors 1 to 4. I now return you to the ongoing “let’s make it up as we go along and pretend we understand the actual science” musings of FXmastermind. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1543 "2011-04-12T17:30:49Z")
As I peruse the smorgasbord of denial that one can find online, the impression that one gets, is of a serious eyed spokesman from a large corporation assuring us that 220,000 people losing their homes, cars, businesses, farms, everything, due to radiation leaking from exploded and burned power reactors, just isn’t that bad. He points to hard hit areas, and reminds you that it was worse elsewhere. And then he gets a little disturbed when nobody buys his act. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1544 "2011-04-12T17:32:55Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Have you ever actually tried reading any of the stuff I cite? I mean, just as a change of pace? > > No…it wasn’t. It was a provision 5 weeks ago (as well as last week, as well as day before yesterday) while they evaluated the data. It’s a provisional 7 now, since the data seems to indicate that it should be, and the final analysis of where the level will be fixed in the future history of this event will be determined after the event is over and the data is fully developed and analyzed. > > See, that’s how things work in the real world. People don’t just pull numbers out of their ass…they actually have to look at that data stuff and develop it to get real results. I realize this is a difficult concept for you, since you are so used to doing it the other way. > > Again, it’s a race to the bottom between you and FXM. Who is stupider? It’s really difficult to tell. I think you have more native talent at being stupid, but FXM is hungrier and more assertive in his stupidity. He also might be a touch crazy, while you are just…well, really stupid. Probably a coin flip would be the only real way to determine who wins the race. > > -XT That race was won by you long ago. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1545 "2011-04-12T17:35:07Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > or for a somewhat less batshit crazy viewpoint > [Mummy, mummy, there's a nuclear monster! • The Register](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/04/12/fukushima_ffs/) > > > [@](#): > > > > The facts are that the incident at Fukushima Daiichi remains far and away the most minor of the various consequences which have followed the initial, devastating magnitude-9.0 quake and tsunami which struck northeastern Japan nearly a month ago. It has caused less human consequences than a moderate road-traffic accident. > > I now return you to the ongoing “let’s make it up as we go along and pretend we understand the actual science” musings of FXmastermind. i’m sure glad i don’t live in the UK where moderate road-traffic accident have greater than 12 mile evacuation zones. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1546 "2011-04-12T17:46:37Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > i’m sure glad i don’t live in the UK where moderate road-traffic accident have greater than 12 mile evacuation zones. That japanese nuclear death toll again. 0. We will of course keep you updated as this disaster continues to unfold. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1547 "2011-04-12T18:06:14Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > That japanese nuclear death toll again. 0. We will of course keep you updated as this disaster continues to unfold. reports are 2 plant workers have been killed. though i suppose because they were killed due to explosion some would claim they were not nuclear deaths. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1548 "2011-04-12T18:06:25Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > That japanese nuclear death toll again. 0. We will of course keep you updated as this disaster continues to unfold. Bullshit. The workers are getting fried and they know it. The radiation spraying around the heavily populated environment will result in lots of deaths in the future. radiation does not make you keel over in the streets. It disrupts your DNA allowing cancers to start. The death toll will not be completely known for decades. Why do you think they are evacuating a huge area? Kids and pregnant women are especially vulnerable. But they will not keel over within your attention span. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1549 "2011-04-12T18:08:40Z")
The comedy just keeps getting better. \*nuclear plant in danger, everybody run like hell! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! Nobody was hurt! No problem. See? Nuclear power is safe. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1550 "2011-04-12T18:18:24Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Why do you think they are evacuating a huge area? Kids and pregnant women are especially vulnerable. But they will not keel over within your attention span. I mean, fuck, is it really too much to ask for you to read a cite? Same link as above: "Thus far the worst exposure was suffered by three workers who stood in ankle-deep radioactive water for several hours and sustained doses above 100 millisievert from doing so, indicating local levels of 20-odd millisievert/hour. They have suffered zero health consequences as a result. As of the latest reports, as many as four other workers (of all the many hundreds present at the site) have gone above 100 millisievert: the maximum level allowed is 250 before being withdrawn from the operation altogether, but as is common in the nuclear industry intense caution is being exercised. Danger beyond the plant fence has remained effectively nil. As of yesterday, according to nuclear experts at MIT in the States (reviewing data from Japanese and international monitoring teams on the ground) the highest dose rates seen within 30km of the plant have been 0.0016 millisievert/hour. For context, you could live permanently under radiation levels of 0.0016 mS/hr and you would never achieve even half the annual dose levels permitted by airline crew. The only actual health menace of any kind beyond the plant fence from Fukushima (and indeed following Chernobyl) has been presented by ingestion of radioisotopes in food: specifically of radioisotopic iodine. For adults this appears to have almost no effect, but in the case of children radio-iodine is taken up and concentrated in the thyroid gland very efficiently. Even though it decays away completely in a matter of weeks (iodine-131 has a half-life of just eight days), if a child ingests even quite small amounts of radio-iodine he or she will have a tiny extra risk of thyroid cancer in future – about 0.02 per cent, based on Chernobyl. Fortunately, thyroid cancer – unusually among cancers – is almost always curable without ill effects (this is done, counterintuitively, using much larger amounts of iodine-131) and so the chance of such a child actually dying as a result of such exposure is unfeasibly tiny: less than one chance in a million." Christ, at this rate I’m going to fall foul of the fair use policy for quotes just because clicking on a link is too much fucking effort for you. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1551 "2011-04-12T18:23:24Z")
Calm down. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1552 "2011-04-12T18:32:19Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Calm down. Yes, we should all follow your example of calm and reasoned restraint. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1553 "2011-04-12T18:37:00Z")
You could, but then how could we make fun of you? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1554 "2011-04-12T18:41:57Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > You could, but then how could we make fun of you? Poke all the fun you want. I’m not the one making unsubstantiated claims in this thread. How many people have died from radiation in Japan again? ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1555 "2011-04-12T18:44:11Z")
There is a certain shared laughter among a subset of people, that nobody is going to explain to you. It probably can’t be explained to you. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1556 "2011-04-12T18:48:24Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > There is a certain shared laughter among a subset of people, that nobody is going to explain to you. It probably can’t be explained to you. You Gonzo, tSS and lev are irrational. Giggle among yourselves all you like. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1557 "2011-04-12T18:58:50Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Calm down. And thanks for this latest advice from the Department for Shrill Panic and Scientific Misunderstanding. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1558 "2011-04-12T19:04:03Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > As I peruse the smorgasbord of denial that one can find online, the impression that one gets, is of a serious eyed spokesman from a large corporation assuring us that 220,000 people losing their homes, cars, businesses, farms, everything, due to radiation leaking from exploded and burned power reactors, just isn’t that bad. > > He points to hard hit areas, and reminds you that it was worse elsewhere. And then he gets a little disturbed when nobody buys his act. > [@johnpost](#): > > reports are 2 plant workers have been killed. though i suppose because they were killed due to explosion some would claim they were not nuclear deaths. Of course not. These explosions weren’t caused by nuclear reactions directly, they were only related to nuclear reactions through a long chain of causation. And they were in Japan, in Fukushima, not here. The laws of physics are such that no explosions occur in the USofA because we are exceptional. Unlike the Japanese, our nuclear plants are designed by American companies like GE and Westinghouse. And our nuclear plants are of later generations of design. What’s that you say? Fukushima designs are from the same design era as all existing US plants? Bullshit I say! You say GE designed the Fukushima plants? Bullshit I say. Those are lies! Like the lies about it being a 7! There is no proof that it is still a 7! Just like there was not proof that it was ever admitted it was a 7 while it was still a 7! Just like there are no dead bodies of workers killed in the blasts that didn’t happen. You guys are such liars. Irrational liars! ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1559 "2011-04-12T19:10:11Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Poke all the fun you want. I’m not the one making unsubstantiated claims in this thread. > > How many people have died from radiation in Japan again? Many nuclear experts claim no radiation is ok. it disrupts your DNA. .We are all snowflakes, a little bit different that everyone else. For some residents near the plant cancer is in their future. Others will not get it. But many will. They will die from this nuclear plant’s radioactive excrement. If you claim nobody will die you are making a stupid claim. They will ,but nuke fans can wave it away in a decade or so and claim it is unrelated. That is what they do. And people who are pro nuke will eat it up. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2011, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389/1560 "2011-04-12T19:10:36Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Of course not. These explosions weren’t caused by nuclear reactions directly, they were only related to nuclear reactions through a long chain of causation. The slight fact that they were killed in the tsunami really doesn’t even enter your head, does it? > **[Japan: Fukushima nuclear workers' bodies found](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12949783)** > > The bodies of two workers killed by the 11 March tsunami are found in Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, as work continues to seal a leak. “The bodies of two workers killed by the tsunami which wrecked Japan’s Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant more than three weeks ago have been recovered.” I mean, they died of fucking multiple head wounds for fucks sake. You’re trying to claim that’s a common sympton of radiation poisoning now? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389.md?page=77) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nuclear-meltdown-holy-godzilla-noooo/574389.md?page=79)